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National Hurling League 2023

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Replying To legendzxix:  "It was a terrible decision by RTÉ to start with the hurling highlights last night. There is no jeopardy. A lot of teams are utilising an opportunity to build squad depth, which is fair enough when there is no jeopardy."
Why ever, pray tell? It was a great decision. Once the hurling highlights were over, I could switch off the laptop.

foreveryoung (USA) - Posts: 2202 - 01/03/2023 18:51:59    2461313

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Replying To updwell:  "Maybe Viking Wexford are the ultimate team for not showing their hand this year."
We will see on April 22nd. But unrealistic expectations based on League form so far shouldn't be an issue this year anyway!!!

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 15578 - 02/03/2023 11:43:53    2461376

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Replying To Viking66:  "We will see on April 22nd. But unrealistic expectations based on League form so far shouldn't be an issue this year anyway!!!"
Any truth in the rumours that wexford trained hard last Sunday morning?

daveboy (Limerick) - Posts: 1197 - 02/03/2023 13:05:26    2461395

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Replying To daveboy:  "Any truth in the rumours that wexford trained hard last Sunday morning?"
Doubt it. Would love to find out that was true but I doubt it. Not the whole panel anyway although the lads who weren't playing had a full heavy session.
I'll be bringing the kids to PUC and the Gaelic grounds more in hope of a competitive performance than expectation of one.
The big one for us will be Salthill. While we wouldn't have to win there to make a Leinster final the game will show us all more where we are really at this year.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 15578 - 02/03/2023 14:28:38    2461415

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Replying To Viking66:  "Doubt it. Would love to find out that was true but I doubt it. Not the whole panel anyway although the lads who weren't playing had a full heavy session.
I'll be bringing the kids to PUC and the Gaelic grounds more in hope of a competitive performance than expectation of one.
The big one for us will be Salthill. While we wouldn't have to win there to make a Leinster final the game will show us all more where we are really at this year."
I think Egan is a very good coach and I think wexford if they get everyone healthy will give leinster a right rattle. Galway from what I can see haven't unearthed a huge amount of players that will break the 15 from last year so I'd expect much of the same there. Kilkenny are always strong and Dublin are down some bodies so O Donoghue might need a year to get them competitive. That match in salthill will have enormous pressure on shefflin and the Galway team in general. Year 2 and they'll expect a leinster title.

daveboy (Limerick) - Posts: 1197 - 02/03/2023 16:09:10    2461450

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Replying To daveboy:  "Any truth in the rumours that wexford trained hard last Sunday morning?"
If they did that I wish they told us before we shelled out €18 on the match.
But they looked like a team who had a lot done, that is for sure.
And if they did, I wouldn't rule out serious morale damage being done.
Good story though if they did

ExiledInWex (Dublin) - Posts: 1334 - 02/03/2023 16:27:41    2461453

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Replying To daveboy:  "I think Egan is a very good coach and I think wexford if they get everyone healthy will give leinster a right rattle. Galway from what I can see haven't unearthed a huge amount of players that will break the 15 from last year so I'd expect much of the same there. Kilkenny are always strong and Dublin are down some bodies so O Donoghue might need a year to get them competitive. That match in salthill will have enormous pressure on shefflin and the Galway team in general. Year 2 and they'll expect a leinster title."
One thing for sure about Salthill is that it will be a hard battle. And likely low scoring if both teams bring their best intensity. There will be no room for flowery hurling. Or faint hearts. Hopefully we turn up. If we do we could win.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 15578 - 02/03/2023 16:33:38    2461455

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Replying To ExiledInWex:  "If they did that I wish they told us before we shelled out €18 on the match.
But they looked like a team who had a lot done, that is for sure.
And if they did, I wouldn't rule out serious morale damage being done.
Good story though if they did"
Good point. I take all that "trained heavily the morning or the day before" with a pinch of salt. Might work for Limerick the odd time, but like you say, hard to see anything compensating for an old fashioned whupping.

Only time I know for certain a team went into a game on their uppers was when Dublin were hammered by Tipp in league semi final in Thurles in 2013. It was a few days after a week of army Rangers type boot camp.

Idea is of course to see how lads operate at the end of their tether. Well, they didn't! I was close enough to the sideline too to hear Tipp lads screaming at our fellas that they were finished; Dublin having beaten them a few times before that and run them close enough in All Ireland semi in 2011. I don't know how the players felt but i certainly wished I'd stayed in bed!

Upside of that of course is that Dublin won Leinster after five games in six weeks that Summer. So maybe it paid some dividends.

Hope this helps Wex chums :-)

BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 3487 - 02/03/2023 16:50:25    2461461

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Replying To daveboy:  "Any truth in the rumours that wexford trained hard last Sunday morning?"
You're half right.

The lads outside the starting 15 and the subs most likely to be used had a session on Sunday morning all right. But that can't be used as an excuse for the performance on the pitch that afternoon.

Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2844 - 02/03/2023 16:50:32    2461462

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Replying To daveboy:  "Any truth in the rumours that wexford trained hard last Sunday morning?"
If you were playing Clare in a few weeks and didn't want to show your hand then it would be still daft but might make a little sense!

Ban (Westmeath) - Posts: 1468 - 02/03/2023 17:12:29    2461471

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Replying To BarneyGrant:  "Good point. I take all that "trained heavily the morning or the day before" with a pinch of salt. Might work for Limerick the odd time, but like you say, hard to see anything compensating for an old fashioned whupping.

Only time I know for certain a team went into a game on their uppers was when Dublin were hammered by Tipp in league semi final in Thurles in 2013. It was a few days after a week of army Rangers type boot camp.

Idea is of course to see how lads operate at the end of their tether. Well, they didn't! I was close enough to the sideline too to hear Tipp lads screaming at our fellas that they were finished; Dublin having beaten them a few times before that and run them close enough in All Ireland semi in 2011. I don't know how the players felt but i certainly wished I'd stayed in bed!

Upside of that of course is that Dublin won Leinster after five games in six weeks that Summer. So maybe it paid some dividends.

Hope this helps Wex chums :-)"
I admire your optimism Barney even if I don't quite share it; )

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 15578 - 02/03/2023 17:58:46    2461484

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There are two different paths/fork on the road - play the NHL stand alone or merge it into the AIC.

1) NHL Stand Alone
- Prior year 'AIC SF 4' and NHL 'Div 2A Promoted Finalists 2' (1-4 & 11-12 in Div 1A) play the 'Other 6' (5-10 in Div 1B).
- Top 4 in a combined 12-team, 6-match table to SFs.
- Bottom 2 of 12 relegated.

While promoted teams may still get hammered, they can improve against 'mid-ranked teams', avoiding the top 4.
Anticipation of top 4 head-to-head meetings in the KO SFs/Final stage should grow as they avoid each other in the 'inter group' phase.

2) AIC/NHL Merged
- Provincial Championship (PC) groups retained for both PC phase and non-PC phase (replacing NHL).
- PCs played 'intra group' (no change), with the top 2 in each group (4 or 5 matches per team) advancing to respective PC Finals (after 25 matches total, M10 & L15).
- Prior to PCs, all 'inter group' pairings are played (5 or 6 matches per team, 30 matches total, M5 v L6), contributing to a full 10-match round robin (5 at home, 5 away) per team.
- Based on the 10-match table, the top 6 and both PC Champs advance to AI KO QFs, with PC Champs most likely earning byes to SFs by advancing twice.

What do you think?

omahant (USA) - Posts: 3229 - 04/03/2023 14:56:47    2461765

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Replying To omahant:  "There are two different paths/fork on the road - play the NHL stand alone or merge it into the AIC.

1) NHL Stand Alone
- Prior year 'AIC SF 4' and NHL 'Div 2A Promoted Finalists 2' (1-4 & 11-12 in Div 1A) play the 'Other 6' (5-10 in Div 1B).
- Top 4 in a combined 12-team, 6-match table to SFs.
- Bottom 2 of 12 relegated.

While promoted teams may still get hammered, they can improve against 'mid-ranked teams', avoiding the top 4.
Anticipation of top 4 head-to-head meetings in the KO SFs/Final stage should grow as they avoid each other in the 'inter group' phase.

2) AIC/NHL Merged
- Provincial Championship (PC) groups retained for both PC phase and non-PC phase (replacing NHL).
- PCs played 'intra group' (no change), with the top 2 in each group (4 or 5 matches per team) advancing to respective PC Finals (after 25 matches total, M10 & L15).
- Prior to PCs, all 'inter group' pairings are played (5 or 6 matches per team, 30 matches total, M5 v L6), contributing to a full 10-match round robin (5 at home, 5 away) per team.
- Based on the 10-match table, the top 6 and both PC Champs advance to AI KO QFs, with PC Champs most likely earning byes to SFs by advancing twice.

What do you think?"
Firstly I'm in favour of a return to Division 1B for 7 to 12. Failing that, the bottom teams from both groups in Division 1 must be relegated. The Division 2A finalists should both be promoted.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8769 - 04/03/2023 16:31:15    2461785

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Replying To BarneyGrant:  "Good point. I take all that "trained heavily the morning or the day before" with a pinch of salt. Might work for Limerick the odd time, but like you say, hard to see anything compensating for an old fashioned whupping.

Only time I know for certain a team went into a game on their uppers was when Dublin were hammered by Tipp in league semi final in Thurles in 2013. It was a few days after a week of army Rangers type boot camp.

Idea is of course to see how lads operate at the end of their tether. Well, they didn't! I was close enough to the sideline too to hear Tipp lads screaming at our fellas that they were finished; Dublin having beaten them a few times before that and run them close enough in All Ireland semi in 2011. I don't know how the players felt but i certainly wished I'd stayed in bed!

Upside of that of course is that Dublin won Leinster after five games in six weeks that Summer. So maybe it paid some dividends.

Hope this helps Wex chums :-)"
As an Inter county player, in 52 weeks of the year you get to play a maximum of 12 top games.
There is no sense to that sort of nonsense.
I don't believe Wexford trained hard that day. I think they were just steamrolled and shell shocked. A bit like us all after 18 euro expecting a good game.

ExiledInWex (Dublin) - Posts: 1334 - 07/03/2023 18:47:04    2462633

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Replying To ExiledInWex:  "As an Inter county player, in 52 weeks of the year you get to play a maximum of 12 top games.
There is no sense to that sort of nonsense.
I don't believe Wexford trained hard that day. I think they were just steamrolled and shell shocked. A bit like us all after 18 euro expecting a good game."
Between Walsh Cup, League and Championship you might have anything up to 20 games. 4 WC, 7 NHL, and 9 Championship. 9 if you are from Leinster and finish 3rd and make the AIF.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 15578 - 08/03/2023 11:55:33    2462724

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Replying To ExiledInWex:  "As an Inter county player, in 52 weeks of the year you get to play a maximum of 12 top games.
There is no sense to that sort of nonsense.
I don't believe Wexford trained hard that day. I think they were just steamrolled and shell shocked. A bit like us all after 18 euro expecting a good game."
Between Walsh Cup, League and Championship you might have anything up to 20 games. 4 WC, 7 NHL, and 9 Championship. 9 if you are from Leinster and finish 3rd and make the AIF.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 15578 - 08/03/2023 11:55:45    2462725

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Replying To Viking66:  "Between Walsh Cup, League and Championship you might have anything up to 20 games. 4 WC, 7 NHL, and 9 Championship. 9 if you are from Leinster and finish 3rd and make the AIF."
True, and it's no longer in 52 weeks, but now in about half that time!

foreveryoung (USA) - Posts: 2202 - 08/03/2023 12:38:47    2462738

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Replying To ExiledInWex:  "As an Inter county player, in 52 weeks of the year you get to play a maximum of 12 top games.
There is no sense to that sort of nonsense.
I don't believe Wexford trained hard that day. I think they were just steamrolled and shell shocked. A bit like us all after 18 euro expecting a good game."
Players can't be playing every week. February to May are the league and championship round robin months.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8769 - 08/03/2023 17:34:04    2462856

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Replying To legendzxix:  "Firstly I'm in favour of a return to Division 1B for 7 to 12. Failing that, the bottom teams from both groups in Division 1 must be relegated. The Division 2A finalists should both be promoted."
That 7-12 also creates a 1-6 which was too intense for players before the Championship and lead to the current arrangement. I'd make the same argument against the current NFL, although there are great games for us fans. Somehow a top 12 in both codes, split into two groups, I think, is the better way to go, with placings deciding AIC KO pairings.

omahant (USA) - Posts: 3229 - 08/03/2023 18:50:02    2462870

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Probably the last weekend of anything like serious hurling before they wind down even more for the championship. Tipp v Waterford will be interesting for various reasons. Winner will most likely top group and reach final two but also a rehearsal for later on. Antrim probably do enough to save themselves from relegation against Laois.

Kilkenny v Dublin be interesting from our perspective in that it's strongest team O'Donoghue has put out so far, assuming it starts, and be close enough to the championship first 15. O'Sullivan and Considine back and forwards look to have a bit of shape and scoring threat so expect a good enough battle.

BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 3487 - 11/03/2023 09:04:05    2463300

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