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Replying To CTGAA10:  "Killingfields,I'm thinking you might be best to answer a few things as regards international rugby and provinces..I have a healthy interest in rugby and in the 80s,90s attended ail every Saturday..I'm worried that Leinster rugby are going to be so dominant that the other 3 are only wasting their time..I think 2 players will start the 6 nations from the other 3 provinces,Tadgh beirne and Mack Hansen,even at this stage Crowley for me won't start and that is again down to how strong Leinster are in every department..I see one of the Byrne brothers gone to England for a few months..do you think this will happen with more of their players rather than throw their lot in with a rival province.does the fact they have so many centrally contracted players mean they can afford to bring in some huge international names?im asking because I don't know how the system works..I watched Munster and thought only 2 players really stood up to Leinster,I was disappointed and enjoyed ulster/Connacht more the following evening…I know this is a long winded question and I'm asking you because you might have a better idea of the workings of irfu.."
Leinster once they got their act together were always going to be totally dominant ahead of other provinces. Their playing numbers totally outweigh the other provinces and they have most fee paying schools with big budgets to spend on rugby as well.
What question(s) are you asking of me specifically?

KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3695 - 04/01/2025 13:09:21    2584550

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Replying To Pope_Benedict:  "When did Leinster stop picking fancy dans, and when did the whole Munster by Grace of God thing die a comprehensive death?"
What are you on about. Clichéd nonsense?

KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3695 - 04/01/2025 13:10:13    2584552

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Replying To seadog54:  "Leinster have put a lot of effort in a move away from D4 nonsence and have embraced the twelve county army model. The have developed a great relationship with, not only fee paying schools, but clubs and school teams across provience. Munster a bit like my own county took their eye off the ball in thinking good times were here to stay and let future take care of itself. There seems to be a divide between Limerick and the rest, especially Cork. Last thing Munster need is a bigger disconnect beteen club and fan's. In fairness they have been very unlucky with injuries and poor return from their NIQ players. Too many players, back room staff and managers seem happy to leave, these are questions that need to be addressed."
I don't think that's true at all from my experience being directly involved in the sport in the province.
In what way is there a divide between limer9ck and the rest of the province?

KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3695 - 04/01/2025 13:13:32    2584554

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Replying To TheFlaker:  "You are embarrassing yourself. I gave you a breakdown of numbers. I can give you another 5 or 6 schools as well if you want. And i can share multiple articles as well. You have said it's mostly due to students from abroad. It isn't. Of course immigrant students are exempt but the number of Irish born students with Irish parents being exempt has increased year on year. That's a fact. And now someone else is telling you the same thing. But you are right because you read an article. Bravo."
An article based on a Department of Education report.

You have share NO ThING of substance. Meaningless anecdotes. The Department report is based on the very statistics and investigation that I referred to months ago, and that you accused me of being all sorts of things.

I don't expect nor demand an apology. Such are unnecessary among men.

BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 3275 - 04/01/2025 13:21:45    2584556

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"Man who fixes boilers or something in 5 or 6 schools somewhere rubbishes Department of Education inspectors report."

And I'm the one embarrassing myself?

BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 3275 - 04/01/2025 13:40:50    2584563

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Replying To BarneyGrant:  "Blithely ignoring the fact that THE main numerical reason is the numbers of immigrants and children of immigrants in the education system!

And i say this as someone who has read the reports. Try that perhaps? Did you even read the article?"
Speaking from experience only Barney. Perhaps you should get out a bit more. Dip your toe in the water, as it were and not be relying on reports which you can find to suit any narrative - even your particularly biased one.

Freethinker (Wicklow) - Posts: 1325 - 04/01/2025 13:46:24    2584566

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Replying To BarneyGrant:  ""Man who fixes boilers or something in 5 or 6 schools somewhere rubbishes Department of Education inspectors report."

And I'm the one embarrassing myself?"
Teacher for 10 years. VP after that before taking role which means i am involved in multiple schools in more than one province. Headline of article states main reason for exemption is learning difficulties not non nationals.

I also shared actual numbers from actual schools. You are the only one who shared a hearsay story from an apparent teacher friend you have.

TheFlaker (Mayo) - Posts: 8208 - 04/01/2025 14:05:26    2584570

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Replying To TheFlaker:  "Teacher for 10 years. VP after that before taking role which means i am involved in multiple schools in more than one province. Headline of article states main reason for exemption is learning difficulties not non nationals.

I also shared actual numbers from actual schools. You are the only one who shared a hearsay story from an apparent teacher friend you have."
The report states that vast majority of exemptions are non nationals.

Are you claiming teachers and Department or Irish Times are making this up?

BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 3275 - 04/01/2025 14:27:04    2584575

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Replying To Freethinker:  "Speaking from experience only Barney. Perhaps you should get out a bit more. Dip your toe in the water, as it were and not be relying on reports which you can find to suit any narrative - even your particularly biased one."
Experience:-)

The Department report confirms MY experience and is based on facts as reported by teachers to Department of Education.

They dipped their toe it seems.

BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 3275 - 04/01/2025 14:30:37    2584577

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Replying To TheFlaker:  "Teacher for 10 years. VP after that before taking role which means i am involved in multiple schools in more than one province. Headline of article states main reason for exemption is learning difficulties not non nationals.

I also shared actual numbers from actual schools. You are the only one who shared a hearsay story from an apparent teacher friend you have."
Headline states no such thing. It refers to non nationals and that is made even more stark in article.

I hope you were not teaching English?

BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 3275 - 04/01/2025 14:33:20    2584580

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Killingfields,the questions I'd ask,have the likes of Haley been treated unfairly?even with injuries he was behind 5 or 6 Leinster players..carbery(ok suffered with injuries),frisch(capped by France),healy(capped by Scotland),was the decision to leave just their own or was it a Munster decision?front row,big problems,players who have served well but now at an age where they are expected to play 60/70 mins,yet if im right they couldn't bring in cover,why?nash played 6 nations but only got one run out in autumn,it looked like it was Lowe,Hansen straight back in even though they had only come back from injury..I've always thought Coombs should have been capped,but he has fallen down the rankings behind possibly 6/7 others,is there a reason for that?if a province has centrally contracted players does it free up money to bring in huge names??maybe as I've mentioned I'm showing my Munster bias,but I'm finding it harder to stay totally interested in Munster and Ireland..

CTGAA10 (Limerick) - Posts: 2414 - 04/01/2025 14:39:05    2584583

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Replying To BarneyGrant:  "Headline states no such thing. It refers to non nationals and that is made even more stark in article.

I hope you were not teaching English?"
https://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/education/2025/01/02/department-queries-high-levels-of-irish-exemptions-at-second-level-schools/

Here you go. Another one for you.

TheFlaker (Mayo) - Posts: 8208 - 04/01/2025 14:43:53    2584585

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Replying To BarneyGrant:  "Headline states no such thing. It refers to non nationals and that is made even more stark in article.

I hope you were not teaching English?"
Can you share some of the article stating the exemptions are on the rise because of non nationals. Surely the article has included the rise of Irish born students being exempt and the percentage rise year on year? I could share 4 or 5 articles with numbers stating that. I shared one previously with official figures a while back that you of course ignored.

There isn't an Irish speaker or teacher in this country that thinks Irish is being taught the right way. Their complaints fall on deaf ears especially under the leadership of Norma Foley.

TheFlaker (Mayo) - Posts: 8208 - 04/01/2025 14:50:49    2584586

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Replying To KillingFields:  "I don't think that's true at all from my experience being directly involved in the sport in the province.
In what way is there a divide between limer9ck and the rest of the province?"
I live in Cork and my opinion is only based on interaction with other rugby supporters many of whom seem to belive Munster rugby is too Limerich centric, been involved you may have a better handle on this issue. But its a topic often covered by media and rugby podcasts. True or false its only one problem facing provience.

seadog54 (Meath) - Posts: 2207 - 04/01/2025 15:22:03    2584588

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Replying To CTGAA10:  "Killingfields,the questions I'd ask,have the likes of Haley been treated unfairly?even with injuries he was behind 5 or 6 Leinster players..carbery(ok suffered with injuries),frisch(capped by France),healy(capped by Scotland),was the decision to leave just their own or was it a Munster decision?front row,big problems,players who have served well but now at an age where they are expected to play 60/70 mins,yet if im right they couldn't bring in cover,why?nash played 6 nations but only got one run out in autumn,it looked like it was Lowe,Hansen straight back in even though they had only come back from injury..I've always thought Coombs should have been capped,but he has fallen down the rankings behind possibly 6/7 others,is there a reason for that?if a province has centrally contracted players does it free up money to bring in huge names??maybe as I've mentioned I'm showing my Munster bias,but I'm finding it harder to stay totally interested in Munster and Ireland.."
Could you try use paragraphs
Makes reading on phone easier.

Friach and healy both left as offered chance to play for other nations and weren't seen as wanted by ireland. Ben healy. I know. And he left as he knew crowley was going to pass him and he saw it as necessary to play more regularly.

Munster have been trying to sign front rows for years but irfu refused and the academy guys or young options have either always been injured or just not good enough and irfu refused a few big name signings.

Didn't Nash not have injuries recently which is why he was out of contention for ireland.
Coombes has very good stats for Munster.
Good scoring record, high tackle count. Doris is one of best in world in terms of 8 play. And maybe there's other reasons he hasn't been selected.

Yes if you have itfu directly paying more of your top players it can help with funding other contracts as less of your prov9ncial budget is going towards those players.

KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3695 - 04/01/2025 16:05:39    2584593

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Replying To seadog54:  "I live in Cork and my opinion is only based on interaction with other rugby supporters many of whom seem to belive Munster rugby is too Limerich centric, been involved you may have a better handle on this issue. But its a topic often covered by media and rugby podcasts. True or false its only one problem facing provience."
Munster had to focus on one base. Training and playing. How many other professional club teams play all the time out of multiple venues. It doesn't and never really dis make sense. Financially and time wise as well.
There is far more issues that needed or need attention than trying to split yourself across 2 cities when one will suffice.

KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3695 - 04/01/2025 16:56:03    2584611

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Ok,thanks very much..
My last comment on it is it just seems that there is a group that are non moveable.

CTGAA10 (Limerick) - Posts: 2414 - 04/01/2025 17:22:48    2584613

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Replying To TheFlaker:  "Can you share some of the article stating the exemptions are on the rise because of non nationals. Surely the article has included the rise of Irish born students being exempt and the percentage rise year on year? I could share 4 or 5 articles with numbers stating that. I shared one previously with official figures a while back that you of course ignored.

There isn't an Irish speaker or teacher in this country that thinks Irish is being taught the right way. Their complaints fall on deaf ears especially under the leadership of Norma Foley."
You could not possibly have statistics on the "rise of Irish born students being exempt" as they have not supplied any such breakdown. Besides which, the article proves that this has nothing to do with the large increase. It is not even mentioned as a factor.

The article is based on responses from schools with much higher than average exemptions and ALL of them have huge % of non national students. All of the principals quoted attribute that to their "distorted" levels of exemptions. One such school has 48% non Irish students.

Why anyone thinks that people from Africa - most of them from anglophone countries - would have even the remotest desire to learn Irish, play Irish music or games is beyond me. Why would they?

There are a million descendants of Scottish immigrant settlers in Ulster with at best no interest in our culture. And yet some lad from Cape Town or Lagos will :-)

BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 3275 - 04/01/2025 17:47:07    2584617

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Replying To BarneyGrant:  "You could not possibly have statistics on the "rise of Irish born students being exempt" as they have not supplied any such breakdown. Besides which, the article proves that this has nothing to do with the large increase. It is not even mentioned as a factor.

The article is based on responses from schools with much higher than average exemptions and ALL of them have huge % of non national students. All of the principals quoted attribute that to their "distorted" levels of exemptions. One such school has 48% non Irish students.

Why anyone thinks that people from Africa - most of them from anglophone countries - would have even the remotest desire to learn Irish, play Irish music or games is beyond me. Why would they?

There are a million descendants of Scottish immigrant settlers in Ulster with at best no interest in our culture. And yet some lad from Cape Town or Lagos will :-)"
Firstly i provided stats from schools i am involved in. Your article is telling half a story as its based on non nationals. And a high focus on schools in urban areas. You can't be that stupid to try and ignore information from 2 posters on here with actual experience on the ground.

The schools I am involved with have a vast majority of Irish born students with Irish parents who are being exempt from Irish for various reasons. If you took all non nationals out of the schools especially in rural areas the number of exemptions would still rise meaning your overall point is incorrect.

Let me say it again. The decline in the Irish language in schools is nothing to do with immigration. Go talk to speakers of the language and teachers of it and then come back to me. Because it's clear you have no clue of what's happening on the ground.

TheFlaker (Mayo) - Posts: 8208 - 04/01/2025 18:54:27    2584621

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Replying To TheFlaker:  "Firstly i provided stats from schools i am involved in. Your article is telling half a story as its based on non nationals. And a high focus on schools in urban areas. You can't be that stupid to try and ignore information from 2 posters on here with actual experience on the ground.

The schools I am involved with have a vast majority of Irish born students with Irish parents who are being exempt from Irish for various reasons. If you took all non nationals out of the schools especially in rural areas the number of exemptions would still rise meaning your overall point is incorrect.

Let me say it again. The decline in the Irish language in schools is nothing to do with immigration. Go talk to speakers of the language and teachers of it and then come back to me. Because it's clear you have no clue of what's happening on the ground."
Have to agree from my experience. There are so many different learning difficulties experienced in schools in latter years. Many of them are getting exemptions from Irish, and other languages at second level. I also believe that the traditional methods of teaching Irish in our schools have been a disaster. I find it hard to figure Barney's apparent fixation with "non nationals", unless ……

Freethinker (Wicklow) - Posts: 1325 - 04/01/2025 20:40:56    2584640

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