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Replying To Thejoeshow: "I'm not his supporter anymore but we also got into super 8s, Division 1, Leinster finals players got all star nominations. Andy brought Meath on from previous management teams and to discount that is just malicious and personal vs Andy it's not just fitness he has brought.
He has run his course and can't bring us further as tactically he isn't strong enough to make the next jump and it's regressing quickly now. Agree that a change is needed and wouldn't argue now is the right time but not many options who will take the job now, I am struggling to remember last time any county got rid of a manager mid year?" My opinion is just that and nothing malicious or personal intended. Yes we got promoted and this was the aim of management in 2019, we peaked for the league and there is little doubt that fitness played a big part in promotion, however, many of the teams we beat (Cork, Armagh and Tipp especially) were well below full strength and we rightly took full advantage of this. The All Star nominations were mainly based on displays in our league run. Thats as good as it got and all our flaws (which were obvious in promotion run) were exposed in Super 8s, Division One and especially so in two back to back hammerings by Dublin, change should have happened then, but for whatever reason they ( coaches included) were allowed to remain in place. Again last year were handed a great chance to return to Div One but made a complete mess of it and surprise surprise it was felt they deserved another chance. Little point in going over the ever increasing list of faults that any half decent management would be expected to address, not to mention the antics on the sideline. I can see no area of improvement after six years and suggest we have gone backwards and are in danger of freefall at this stage. Survival is in the hands of our players and I still think we can retain our place in Div 2 despite the shortcomings of current setup.
seadog54 (Meath) - Posts: 2195 - 07/02/2022 16:21:47
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Replying To seadog54: "My opinion is just that and nothing malicious or personal intended. Yes we got promoted and this was the aim of management in 2019, we peaked for the league and there is little doubt that fitness played a big part in promotion, however, many of the teams we beat (Cork, Armagh and Tipp especially) were well below full strength and we rightly took full advantage of this. The All Star nominations were mainly based on displays in our league run. Thats as good as it got and all our flaws (which were obvious in promotion run) were exposed in Super 8s, Division One and especially so in two back to back hammerings by Dublin, change should have happened then, but for whatever reason they ( coaches included) were allowed to remain in place. Again last year were handed a great chance to return to Div One but made a complete mess of it and surprise surprise it was felt they deserved another chance. Little point in going over the ever increasing list of faults that any half decent management would be expected to address, not to mention the antics on the sideline. I can see no area of improvement after six years and suggest we have gone backwards and are in danger of freefall at this stage. Survival is in the hands of our players and I still think we can retain our place in Div 2 despite the shortcomings of current setup." Well if you see no area of improvement from previous management teams I genuinely feel sorry for you. Dublin dished out hammerings to everyone and badly beat most sides year on year. Anyone outside the county or any logical fan can see the progress made under Andy. The all stars were not based on the league run and all players earned rightful plaudits for their performances in the super 8s, I know this for A fact from experience that all stars are never based on league runs in division 2. To suggest it really is absurd.
The antics on the sideline are embarrassing and always have been, and there is now a real risk of the progress made unravelling quickly and Andy needs to go as soon as possible without risking a mess which results in relegation.
You are making excuses for their few successes so I have no doubt you have and have always had an issue with Andy taking charge and I will leave it at that but I've no idea why any manager or player would want to be associated with the county, from county board to fans it's a deluded rotten bunch on part.
Thejoeshow (Meath) - Posts: 687 - 07/02/2022 17:26:33
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Replying To hyperache: "No he hasn't brought Meath on, not even in the slightest. There was a period where things were looking good, but we've regressed now to a place even worse than where Mick O'Dowd left us. Under O'Dowd we were a team who were placing mid division 2, always in with a squeak of promotion, we lost out on promotion because of a head to head tie with Roscommon in his last league campaign. Couple of Leinster Final appearances and a few hammerings from Dublin.
What did we do under McEntee? Basically the same. I do agree there was some genuine hope and improvements made in 2019 on the back of the super 8s and getting to Division 1. But we're a million miles away from that level of form at the minute. And I don't give him any credit for brining on the fitness of the players, that's just the modern day football player, strength and conditioning is completely different to even how it was 10 years ago in a general sense. So you would assume players would have sorted that bit out themselves
But just ask yourself this, did Meath ever win a single big game when it mattered under McEntee? I can't think of one.. We got to Division 1, lost every game bar the draw in the final game. We lost every super 8 game, we lost every big game against Dublin, Kildare beat us in the Division 1 play off last year, we lot narrowly in qualifier games to Tyrone and Donegal. We genuinely lost every single big game.
We got to Leinster finals under O'Dowd, and under previous management we we had poor teams but reached All Ireland semi-finals in 2007, 2009, and the 1/4 final in 2010. We were in the Leinster Final in 2012, 2013, 2014. The only additional thing Andy McEntee did was get us to division 1 and if he managed to keep us there I would say that's genuine progress. But now he's leaving us possible getting relegated to Division 3.
I'm sorry but it shouldn't matter if other teams have gotten rid of managers mid season or not, that's not the point. Other managers aren't being sent off for viscously abusing referees either so he needs to be take a long look at himself. If he had any dignity he'd walk, take the decision out of others hands. Yeah it's a terrible situation we're in, people complained back when the country board tried to vote him out in 2021 that it was too late, well in hindsight they probably should have done. They will probably wait until the end of the season but if they acted now, I'd have no objections." That is the point I'm making? We improved under Andy but now we have gone backwards? We got to Leinster finals under Andy too? I'm not suggesting what he's done this year or for most of last year was good enough I'm saying he made improvements since he took over.
To be clear, and as you've said genuine hope and improvements in 2019, my point is he did improve them but we haven't built on that and clearly Andy is unable to build on that so need a new man in as soon as possible as Andy is wrecking the improvements he made.
Thejoeshow (Meath) - Posts: 687 - 07/02/2022 17:32:02
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When the dust settles on all of this long running shambles the fact remains we need a new manager. I suggest that is the real issue and ONLY issue. Draw a line under the rest
. Again the County Board should now be wiser with the benefit of hindsight.Lets hope they have learned a lesson. Lets hope they wise up and give the role of manager and the key skills required for the role full consideration. Man management for the role is an absolute must to begin with plus all the other skills . We need a man with the skills and the potential to develop himself in the role rather than just look at who might be available . No body will be made to measure thats a given. The main point i suggest is eventhough we are where we are.no need to rush the appointment probably end of championship fits as most practical time . The CB need to begin real work in a professional manner in the effort to find the correct person NOW!
nobull456 (Meath) - Posts: 1266 - 07/02/2022 18:00:22
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Replying To Thelongwoodslasher: "I have said Since the Vote, that Andy needed to go.
Once so many expressed a lack of faith & confidence in him , it made the whole situation unworkable.
The Whole Panel would then suffer...and if for no one else, Andy should have recognised that at the time. Problem now is, The pressure in that whole set up is now reaching boiling point....and better squads & better set ups have crumbled than the one we have. Only hope is , a win at home , takes the heat down a notch or two, and we are left alone to salvage what we can from this year...yesterdays red card doesn't help...not by a long shot...it means it puts things front & centre on a national level...so You can sense that RTE are all over this "story" ...its critical we get through the season & the dial doesn't get reset to zero in all of this...there has been some progress.....but it is fast getting lost in all of the mess ..get a win , calm things down...stay in division 2 ...and calmly set out a plan for 7-10 years" by the way....the 7-10 year Plan...is a Plan form the County Board (Lord save us)...not the Managers Plan
Thelongwoodslasher (Meath) - Posts: 401 - 07/02/2022 18:05:48
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Replying To Thejoeshow: "Well if you see no area of improvement from previous management teams I genuinely feel sorry for you. Dublin dished out hammerings to everyone and badly beat most sides year on year. Anyone outside the county or any logical fan can see the progress made under Andy. The all stars were not based on the league run and all players earned rightful plaudits for their performances in the super 8s, I know this for A fact from experience that all stars are never based on league runs in division 2. To suggest it really is absurd.
The antics on the sideline are embarrassing and always have been, and there is now a real risk of the progress made unravelling quickly and Andy needs to go as soon as possible without risking a mess which results in relegation.
You are making excuses for their few successes so I have no doubt you have and have always had an issue with Andy taking charge and I will leave it at that but I've no idea why any manager or player would want to be associated with the county, from county board to fans it's a deluded rotten bunch on part." 100% agree. Good post
southmeathgael (Meath) - Posts: 937 - 07/02/2022 19:12:33
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Replying To Thejoeshow: "Well if you see no area of improvement from previous management teams I genuinely feel sorry for you. Dublin dished out hammerings to everyone and badly beat most sides year on year. Anyone outside the county or any logical fan can see the progress made under Andy. The all stars were not based on the league run and all players earned rightful plaudits for their performances in the super 8s, I know this for A fact from experience that all stars are never based on league runs in division 2. To suggest it really is absurd.
The antics on the sideline are embarrassing and always have been, and there is now a real risk of the progress made unravelling quickly and Andy needs to go as soon as possible without risking a mess which results in relegation.
You are making excuses for their few successes so I have no doubt you have and have always had an issue with Andy taking charge and I will leave it at that but I've no idea why any manager or player would want to be associated with the county, from county board to fans it's a deluded rotten bunch on part." It is a real point youre making - Would the big name coaches be interested in Meath?
On one hand you've history, trophies, the population, the clubs, the money, and decent structures. You also have interest, and the raw material to be successful. Only 8-10 counties have all
of these things and Meath is one of them.
On the other hand you've arguably the most political setup in Ireland characterised by old-school parish pump attitudes and the type of wink and nod characters we had running the country for decades, a ridiculously outdated and poor stadium which will very soon be the worst in Ireland, fan delusion and arrogance ad nauseum which is mostly all as a result of exceptionalism in Leinster over many decades and traditional relevance - which is now long, long gone so it now adds up to little more than bluster. We also have a senior team that is not capable of being an elite level team atm.
Meath is a GAA county that in many ways never joined the new milennium, and has been a sleeping giant for the period since bar a few cameos. Other counties in the same category are Down, Cork, Derry, and Offaly. All of them in my own view are more attractive and marketable to a top manager than Meath, and that is just where we are at the moment. For the negatives I mentioned above I dont think the foresight will be in place to seek the top managers in the foreseeable future and as a result when McEntee does go, we can expect an internal appointment.
Young_gael (Meath) - Posts: 596 - 07/02/2022 19:22:49
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Replying To hyperache: "No he hasn't brought Meath on, not even in the slightest. There was a period where things were looking good, but we've regressed now to a place even worse than where Mick O'Dowd left us. Under O'Dowd we were a team who were placing mid division 2, always in with a squeak of promotion, we lost out on promotion because of a head to head tie with Roscommon in his last league campaign. Couple of Leinster Final appearances and a few hammerings from Dublin.
What did we do under McEntee? Basically the same. I do agree there was some genuine hope and improvements made in 2019 on the back of the super 8s and getting to Division 1. But we're a million miles away from that level of form at the minute. And I don't give him any credit for brining on the fitness of the players, that's just the modern day football player, strength and conditioning is completely different to even how it was 10 years ago in a general sense. So you would assume players would have sorted that bit out themselves
But just ask yourself this, did Meath ever win a single big game when it mattered under McEntee? I can't think of one.. We got to Division 1, lost every game bar the draw in the final game. We lost every super 8 game, we lost every big game against Dublin, Kildare beat us in the Division 1 play off last year, we lot narrowly in qualifier games to Tyrone and Donegal. We genuinely lost every single big game.
We got to Leinster finals under O'Dowd, and under previous management we we had poor teams but reached All Ireland semi-finals in 2007, 2009, and the 1/4 final in 2010. We were in the Leinster Final in 2012, 2013, 2014. The only additional thing Andy McEntee did was get us to division 1 and if he managed to keep us there I would say that's genuine progress. But now he's leaving us possible getting relegated to Division 3.
I'm sorry but it shouldn't matter if other teams have gotten rid of managers mid season or not, that's not the point. Other managers aren't being sent off for viscously abusing referees either so he needs to be take a long look at himself. If he had any dignity he'd walk, take the decision out of others hands. Yeah it's a terrible situation we're in, people complained back when the country board tried to vote him out in 2021 that it was too late, well in hindsight they probably should have done. They will probably wait until the end of the season but if they acted now, I'd have no objections." Mightn't have intended it but you have actually identified where he achieved more than MOD (actually achieved promotion and then backed that up by making the super 8s in the championship).
You say fitness levels were just part of the evolution that happened across all inter county teams over the last 10 years, well because McEntee came in immediately after MOD it is easy to see the improvements in a short period of time.
A modern management team needs to get expertise in place which gives players specialist S&C/ fitness programs rather than as you say just let amateur players just sort out themselves. McEntee seemed to bring us a more modern approach to (basing this on just looking at the players not seeming to tire as much in games after he came in).
Listen most can see things aren't great at the moment but your argument is stronger if you stick to where we currently are and not stretch it by downplaying improvements most know we made a few years ago.
bdbuddah (Meath) - Posts: 1400 - 07/02/2022 20:05:47
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Replying To Young_gael: "It is a real point youre making - Would the big name coaches be interested in Meath?
On one hand you've history, trophies, the population, the clubs, the money, and decent structures. You also have interest, and the raw material to be successful. Only 8-10 counties have all
of these things and Meath is one of them.
On the other hand you've arguably the most political setup in Ireland characterised by old-school parish pump attitudes and the type of wink and nod characters we had running the country for decades, a ridiculously outdated and poor stadium which will very soon be the worst in Ireland, fan delusion and arrogance ad nauseum which is mostly all as a result of exceptionalism in Leinster over many decades and traditional relevance - which is now long, long gone so it now adds up to little more than bluster. We also have a senior team that is not capable of being an elite level team atm.
Meath is a GAA county that in many ways never joined the new milennium, and has been a sleeping giant for the period since bar a few cameos. Other counties in the same category are Down, Cork, Derry, and Offaly. All of them in my own view are more attractive and marketable to a top manager than Meath, and that is just where we are at the moment. For the negatives I mentioned above I dont think the foresight will be in place to seek the top managers in the foreseeable future and as a result when McEntee does go, we can expect an internal appointment." Agree young Gael, sadly it will be internal I would suspect and a candidate that perhaps won't have won as much as Andy actually did in the club game. It's all a mess at the moment and for the sake of the current players who have dug in and pushed it on, and the talent coming thru, I hope they get it right but I have no faith in that happening, as most of us don't.
Thejoeshow (Meath) - Posts: 687 - 07/02/2022 21:30:38
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Getting to the super 8s was down to a very lucky draw more so than anything andy done.
hurlit (Meath) - Posts: 424 - 08/02/2022 09:15:01
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Replying To Thejoeshow: "Agree young Gael, sadly it will be internal I would suspect and a candidate that perhaps won't have won as much as Andy actually did in the club game. It's all a mess at the moment and for the sake of the current players who have dug in and pushed it on, and the talent coming thru, I hope they get it right but I have no faith in that happening, as most of us don't." Lets be honest though, when Andy came in he had a pretty good resume to be fair and now look at how people are going on about him. Regardless of who we get in for next year, unless the full squad of players buy into the new manager and whatever game plan they attempt to implement then we will remain in the same position. I mean Andy hardly won a club All Ireland with 0 tactics, 0 attacking/defending strategy and 0 man management. Yes he has shown flaws over the last 6 years but trying to say that it is all managements fault and a change will suddenly fix all our problems is just wrong and clueless, I've said before, you could bring in the best manager and backroom team the game has ever seen, simple fact is some of the players in the squad haven't stepped up, and they are in fact still the best lads in the county bar maybe one or two who have stepped away or can't commit
ratlag (Meath) - Posts: 582 - 08/02/2022 09:27:02
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Replying To Thejoeshow: "Agree young Gael, sadly it will be internal I would suspect and a candidate that perhaps won't have won as much as Andy actually did in the club game. It's all a mess at the moment and for the sake of the current players who have dug in and pushed it on, and the talent coming thru, I hope they get it right but I have no faith in that happening, as most of us don't." Joe forgive me if this sounds worse than I intend, but bar that all ireland has Andy won anything else in the club game? I'm not trying to attack Andy with this in anyway, there's very few managers who have won a club all ireland but outside that year with Ballyboden has he won anything else. Nothing springs to mind and i think he's had a lot of close but no cigar teams. I don't think he's won anything with the clubs he managed in Meath from memory maybe got some to county finals and got the Minors to all ireland in 2012 but again don't think he won any of them. I'm not knocking his achievement of getting to those finals either fair play to him for it.
brian (Meath) - Posts: 1973 - 08/02/2022 09:42:35
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Replying To ratlag: "Lets be honest though, when Andy came in he had a pretty good resume to be fair and now look at how people are going on about him. Regardless of who we get in for next year, unless the full squad of players buy into the new manager and whatever game plan they attempt to implement then we will remain in the same position. I mean Andy hardly won a club All Ireland with 0 tactics, 0 attacking/defending strategy and 0 man management. Yes he has shown flaws over the last 6 years but trying to say that it is all managements fault and a change will suddenly fix all our problems is just wrong and clueless, I've said before, you could bring in the best manager and backroom team the game has ever seen, simple fact is some of the players in the squad haven't stepped up, and they are in fact still the best lads in the county bar maybe one or two who have stepped away or can't commit" Ratlag think you're making a fair point, he was the right appointment at the time. He was coming off an all ireland club with Ballyboden and was a stand out candidate. I think what most people are discussing now is more the lack of progress from his undoubted high point of 2019. There's been no visible sign of any progress from then. Some will say we have stalled and I will argue we've regressed since then in all facets of the game i.e. fitness, attitude, basic skills
I think as some have said Andy's style and autocratic leadership can only last so long at a club, look at Jose Mourinho for example, to a point in his career he could elevate a group and win trophies but after 3-4 years everything broke down; then compare him to Guardiola who can elevate a group to champagne status. I would liken Andy to Mourinho in that he raises standards but flames out and Jim Gavin to Guardiola in that all the raw materials, resources and finances are behind him and he sprinkles his fairy dust on top and you've a champagne footballing team. Can't believe as a United supporter I'm saying this but Meath need a Klopp type manager to implement a style and substance of play for the team, to put his arm around players shoulders and cajole them along to improve. Look at where they've come from to know with good coaching, an understanding manager and support around the players.
Think you make an excellent point on the players and their part in things and i think we have to accept at present some of those on the panel are just not good enough despite being the best in the county. I think with better and improved training and better systems they could gain 5 or 10% and push back towards where they were in 2019 and hopefully sustain it as the minor's and U20's of successful recent years are brought into the fold.
There's a lot of players now from that 2012 team who are approaching or in their prime years and still look like players waiting to make their breakthrough and that's simply not good enough. They should be the backbone and leaders of the team and they're struggling to have a best position to be picked in. The costello's, hickeys etc are now coming in and taking their lead from the old group and need to find their voice and start pushing them all aside and make this their team.
brian (Meath) - Posts: 1973 - 08/02/2022 10:06:58
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Replying To brian: "Joe forgive me if this sounds worse than I intend, but bar that all ireland has Andy won anything else in the club game? I'm not trying to attack Andy with this in anyway, there's very few managers who have won a club all ireland but outside that year with Ballyboden has he won anything else. Nothing springs to mind and i think he's had a lot of close but no cigar teams. I don't think he's won anything with the clubs he managed in Meath from memory maybe got some to county finals and got the Minors to all ireland in 2012 but again don't think he won any of them. I'm not knocking his achievement of getting to those finals either fair play to him for it." I think to be fair Brian winning an all Ireland, getting to multiple county finals, minor all Ireland final is an achievement in itself and we don't have many, and most counties don't, who can get to finals as regularly. Maybe Andy comes up short in finals and is found out tactically (I think he probably is) but I can promise you our next manager most likely will not have the same level of achievement even if Andy isn't a serial winner. He won't be remembered as a boylan by any stretch but it's hard to achieve what he did with any clubs.
Thejoeshow (Meath) - Posts: 687 - 08/02/2022 10:20:23
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Replying To brian: "Ratlag think you're making a fair point, he was the right appointment at the time. He was coming off an all ireland club with Ballyboden and was a stand out candidate. I think what most people are discussing now is more the lack of progress from his undoubted high point of 2019. There's been no visible sign of any progress from then. Some will say we have stalled and I will argue we've regressed since then in all facets of the game i.e. fitness, attitude, basic skills
I think as some have said Andy's style and autocratic leadership can only last so long at a club, look at Jose Mourinho for example, to a point in his career he could elevate a group and win trophies but after 3-4 years everything broke down; then compare him to Guardiola who can elevate a group to champagne status. I would liken Andy to Mourinho in that he raises standards but flames out and Jim Gavin to Guardiola in that all the raw materials, resources and finances are behind him and he sprinkles his fairy dust on top and you've a champagne footballing team. Can't believe as a United supporter I'm saying this but Meath need a Klopp type manager to implement a style and substance of play for the team, to put his arm around players shoulders and cajole them along to improve. Look at where they've come from to know with good coaching, an understanding manager and support around the players.
Think you make an excellent point on the players and their part in things and i think we have to accept at present some of those on the panel are just not good enough despite being the best in the county. I think with better and improved training and better systems they could gain 5 or 10% and push back towards where they were in 2019 and hopefully sustain it as the minor's and U20's of successful recent years are brought into the fold.
There's a lot of players now from that 2012 team who are approaching or in their prime years and still look like players waiting to make their breakthrough and that's simply not good enough. They should be the backbone and leaders of the team and they're struggling to have a best position to be picked in. The costello's, hickeys etc are now coming in and taking their lead from the old group and need to find their voice and start pushing them all aside and make this their team." I agree with everything you're saying here, but sticking with you Klopp comparison, before he joined Dortmund he had won nothing bar promotion in his 6-7 years with Mainz. My point being we don't need a big name in order to progress, we just need someone that the lads will row in behind and just work for. I would stretch as far as to say someone like Cian Ward, Kevin Reilly or the likes, lads with limited managerial experience but who would command respect immediately and might be able to just inspire the team given their stature in Meath football. (I know Reilly has just had a brilliant year with Trim, but you get my point). I'm not saying this approach would definitely work, but getting a manager in that has a good record like a few of the names mentioned in this thread won't guaranteed success and therefore I don't see the benefit to ousting Andy at this stage of the year. We do have the quality to stay up in Div 2, probably finishing 3rd and the usual in Leinster, let Andy finish out his term rather than adding to the "laughing stock" some lads here think we are and then just get the new men in early so they can go to the club championship games this year and start to plan early for next season.
I'm not as gung-ho 'WE ARE MEATH' as the likes or RoyalDunne is but he has a point in that we have to get behind the team for the remainder of this year, turning on them and management midseason can literally have no benefit whatsoever.
ratlag (Meath) - Posts: 582 - 08/02/2022 10:24:39
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Interesting points being made about the state of things at the moment. I've never been fond of Andy as manager as I think he's tactically inept. You just have to look at the goal-keeper fiasco over a number of years as a starting point and you get the picture.
Heard him on the radio on Monday morning, said we lost 5 players on the day due to covid postivies, and he lost the plot on the sideline as he felt that one of the Roscommon players was trying to get a Meath player sent off. No excusing the behaviour but I can see how the frustration etc would get to anyone in his position. Needs to seriously get a grip of himself. His problem is that he cares too much, if that's possible.
Heard O'Rourke on a podcast after the Galway debacle and he said he couldn't think of any players that are available who are not in the squad and could improve matters. Maybe he was being PC about it but it doesn't sound good.
Unfortunately at the moment we have a squad of players who just are not good enough to challenge for anything and a manager who can't get the best out of what's available. Not a good combination.
Should be able to just about survive in D2. Well beat so far and can't see us getting anything from Derry. Will need max pts from Cork, Clare and Offaly. Lose to any of them and it's D3 all the way.
moylagh (Meath) - Posts: 485 - 08/02/2022 10:29:54
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While obviously they were enjoyable achievements at the time, I think people are over-egging the "reached Division 1 and Super 8s" line. Despite being beyond us most years, achieving Division 1 football isn't some ridiculously difficult goal, you only need to be in the top 10 performing teams in a given season to get up there. In the last 10 years Laois, Down, Derry, Westmeath, Cavan, Roscommon and Armagh have all made it up to Division 1 and Kildare have managed it 3 or 4 times. None of these teams are giving their managers endless terms as a result though.
Reaching the Super 8s was great, but when you factor in the opposition we played that year it puts it into a bit of perspective. Anyone from any semi-serious football county would laugh at the idea of giving our manager major credit today because 3 years ago he beat Offaly, Carlow, Laois and Clare.
Even then it always stops at reached Division 1/Super 8s, conveniently ignoring how we utterly foundered when we got there and lost every game bar a dead rubber draw vs. Monaghan.
Again, the fact we find it so difficult to get there is proof that it's not easy for Meath, but I don't buy that it's some massive achievement we should be lauding McEntee for.
CastleBravo (Meath) - Posts: 1664 - 08/02/2022 10:35:46
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Replying To CastleBravo: "While obviously they were enjoyable achievements at the time, I think people are over-egging the "reached Division 1 and Super 8s" line. Despite being beyond us most years, achieving Division 1 football isn't some ridiculously difficult goal, you only need to be in the top 10 performing teams in a given season to get up there. In the last 10 years Laois, Down, Derry, Westmeath, Cavan, Roscommon and Armagh have all made it up to Division 1 and Kildare have managed it 3 or 4 times. None of these teams are giving their managers endless terms as a result though.
Reaching the Super 8s was great, but when you factor in the opposition we played that year it puts it into a bit of perspective. Anyone from any semi-serious football county would laugh at the idea of giving our manager major credit today because 3 years ago he beat Offaly, Carlow, Laois and Clare.
Even then it always stops at reached Division 1/Super 8s, conveniently ignoring how we utterly foundered when we got there and lost every game bar a dead rubber draw vs. Monaghan.
Again, the fact we find it so difficult to get there is proof that it's not easy for Meath, but I don't buy that it's some massive achievement we should be lauding McEntee for." Not over egging it at all but I don't think it's fair to downplay as we have struggled to get there. Never sure why there can be no happy medium. Andy has brought us on but lacks the ability to bring us past this level, we had some great days and some good performances too. Nothing ground breaking, we didn't win anything but from where we were it was a step forward.
He hasn't been able to get past that level and now looks like it's regressing so time for a change as he isn't the man needed now, but he brought the players on fitness wise and set us up a little more professionally then we were. Andy and the team has shown glimpses (second half vs Donegal and many of the super 8s games in spells) of being a decent team but ultimately has struggled to get any consistency so change is needed and probably was last year.
I haven't seen anyone say Andy should be given longer, everyone seems fairly United that we need a change but no need to go back through history and rubbish all he has done either. He has many flaws but his commitment to Meath and his players can't be questioned nor can the incremental improvements made and certain achievements but time to go.
Thejoeshow (Meath) - Posts: 687 - 08/02/2022 11:07:09
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Replying To Thejoeshow: "I think to be fair Brian winning an all Ireland, getting to multiple county finals, minor all Ireland final is an achievement in itself and we don't have many, and most counties don't, who can get to finals as regularly. Maybe Andy comes up short in finals and is found out tactically (I think he probably is) but I can promise you our next manager most likely will not have the same level of achievement even if Andy isn't a serial winner. He won't be remembered as a boylan by any stretch but it's hard to achieve what he did with any clubs." Totally fair point Joe, as I said wasn't trying to downplay his achievements more asking was their something I hadn't remembered him winning.
brian (Meath) - Posts: 1973 - 08/02/2022 11:07:46
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Replying To Thejoeshow: " Replying To CastleBravo: "While obviously they were enjoyable achievements at the time, I think people are over-egging the "reached Division 1 and Super 8s" line. Despite being beyond us most years, achieving Division 1 football isn't some ridiculously difficult goal, you only need to be in the top 10 performing teams in a given season to get up there. In the last 10 years Laois, Down, Derry, Westmeath, Cavan, Roscommon and Armagh have all made it up to Division 1 and Kildare have managed it 3 or 4 times. None of these teams are giving their managers endless terms as a result though.
Reaching the Super 8s was great, but when you factor in the opposition we played that year it puts it into a bit of perspective. Anyone from any semi-serious football county would laugh at the idea of giving our manager major credit today because 3 years ago he beat Offaly, Carlow, Laois and Clare.
Even then it always stops at reached Division 1/Super 8s, conveniently ignoring how we utterly foundered when we got there and lost every game bar a dead rubber draw vs. Monaghan.
Again, the fact we find it so difficult to get there is proof that it's not easy for Meath, but I don't buy that it's some massive achievement we should be lauding McEntee for." Not over egging it at all but I don't think it's fair to downplay as we have struggled to get there. Never sure why there can be no happy medium. Andy has brought us on but lacks the ability to bring us past this level, we had some great days and some good performances too. Nothing ground breaking, we didn't win anything but from where we were it was a step forward. He hasn't been able to get past that level and now looks like it's regressing so time for a change as he isn't the man needed now, but he brought the players on fitness wise and set us up a little more professionally then we were. Andy and the team has shown glimpses (second half vs Donegal and many of the super 8s games in spells) of being a decent team but ultimately has struggled to get any consistency so change is needed and probably was last year. I haven't seen anyone say Andy should be given longer, everyone seems fairly United that we need a change but no need to go back through history and rubbish all he has done either. He has many flaws but his commitment to Meath and his players can't be questioned nor can the incremental improvements made and certain achievements but time to go."
brian (Meath) - Posts: 1973 - 08/02/2022 12:08:52
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