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There were very few came out of this well.
Flynn should have had the courage of his convictions and stayed if he really believed in the players and not left them when the going got tough. There had been two challenge matches against Cavan and Roscommon that had gone poorly and it looked like this was a factor.County chair should never have allowed a written agreement like this to happen but once he did he was obliged see the terms honoured. Senior manager should always have access to every player, however if you put your name to an agreement you should honour it if your word matters. Callaghan and Kelly stood up for the county and made huge progress in limited time under big pressure. Injuries were a massive factor and time to get the team to settle. A lot of play was disjointed on Thursday but if they had more time there was a better performance in them. Flynn's coaching team should not all be tarnished by this as Robbie Brennan is a class coach but didn't seem to get much of a look in with Leahy as Flynn's number one who was, to be kind, unique in his methods.
ABK67 (Meath) - Posts: 62 - 18/07/2021 08:34:12
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I believe there was no written agreement it was only verbal
royal1967 (Meath) - Posts: 257 - 20/07/2021 13:40:23
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Replying To royal1967: "I believe there was no written agreement it was only verbal" There was an agreement, that's the important part, if roles were reversed what would Mc entee have done ......honouring your word is still something that decent people do
Analyst (Meath) - Posts: 1467 - 21/07/2021 11:21:37
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Replying To ABK67: "There were very few came out of this well.
Flynn should have had the courage of his convictions and stayed if he really believed in the players and not left them when the going got tough. There had been two challenge matches against Cavan and Roscommon that had gone poorly and it looked like this was a factor.County chair should never have allowed a written agreement like this to happen but once he did he was obliged see the terms honoured. Senior manager should always have access to every player, however if you put your name to an agreement you should honour it if your word matters. Callaghan and Kelly stood up for the county and made huge progress in limited time under big pressure. Injuries were a massive factor and time to get the team to settle. A lot of play was disjointed on Thursday but if they had more time there was a better performance in them. Flynn's coaching team should not all be tarnished by this as Robbie Brennan is a class coach but didn't seem to get much of a look in with Leahy as Flynn's number one who was, to be kind, unique in his methods." Unique in methods.care to expand lad/lassie?
Borderroyal (Meath) - Posts: 488 - 21/07/2021 14:27:18
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Replying To Thelongwoodslasher: "Irrespective of Result & no matter at what stage we bowed out of this Competition, without a doubt the Circus that was created around this group was a disgrace. yet again, we are looking at possibly a missed opportunity. How many have we allowed to slip through or fingers over the last 20 years due to us shooting ourselves in the foot. Please, can we stop the bullsh*t around Resources & Funding...once & for all...until we get our house in order. Can we at least promise on this site to each other that we wont talk about the inequalities UNTIL...we are doing most things correctly.
I have great sympathy for ALL involved last night,
Offaly showing how things can change btw....and it will be a real wake up call I hope to us , if their u20 team manage to land this football leinster title" Offaly make the breakthrough...which adds to my frustration with the upheavel created for this group.....we lost an opportunity to take another step forward in our progression methinks
Thelongwoodslasher (Meath) - Posts: 383 - 23/07/2021 09:27:19
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Replying To Thelongwoodslasher: "Offaly make the breakthrough...which adds to my frustration with the upheavel created for this group.....we lost an opportunity to take another step forward in our progression methinks" Have to agree going off yesterday, Dublin looked very wobbly against us and Offaly really outclassed them, the goals kept Dublin in it, in reality Offaly were much better. You have to wonder if we had a management for over 4 weeks what would happen
LeitrimRoyal99 (Meath) - Posts: 1452 - 23/07/2021 11:33:54
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Replying To LeitrimRoyal99: "Have to agree going off yesterday, Dublin looked very wobbly against us and Offaly really outclassed them, the goals kept Dublin in it, in reality Offaly were much better. You have to wonder if we had a management for over 4 weeks what would happen" I'd say flynn is regretting his decision to abandon ship now. Was definitely a 20s title there for the taking.
Blackspot09 (Meath) - Posts: 868 - 23/07/2021 11:47:48
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Firstly havent spoken to somenof the lads involved they were very disappointed that Flynn and Co left as that felt that there was real potential in this group. Aside from that and even without the 2 key senior lads I believe we still should have beaten them, the tactics were wrong from the start and the fact we started without a free taker showed lack of foresight from the management. Offaly showed Dublin no respect, we unfortunately did. Poor management and poor direction from the top but a great bunch of players. Caulfield, Adam McDonnell and James o Hare should be drafted straight into the senior setup.
hootervillian (Meath) - Posts: 308 - 24/07/2021 08:05:36
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Replying To hootervillian: "Firstly havent spoken to somenof the lads involved they were very disappointed that Flynn and Co left as that felt that there was real potential in this group. Aside from that and even without the 2 key senior lads I believe we still should have beaten them, the tactics were wrong from the start and the fact we started without a free taker showed lack of foresight from the management. Offaly showed Dublin no respect, we unfortunately did. Poor management and poor direction from the top but a great bunch of players. Caulfield, Adam McDonnell and James o Hare should be drafted straight into the senior setup." Maybe O Hare should move up but I wouldn't be rushing Caulfield and McDonnell up to the Senior set up, O Hare has 2 years on them and although the other two are great prospects, (McDonnell is only back from a years injury, cruciate) I would leave them with the development squads.
I agree mistakes were made on the line at the U20 game and also at 2020 Minor All-Ireland semi final (Derry), they are two games that we could have won if decisions of management were better. However I think both sets of management should be allowed to continue (in fairness the U20 management only had a few weeks) especially if both sets of management put up their hands, admit mistakes and commit to learning from mistakes and not repeat them.
We got to stop the results based hiring and firing, Barry Callaghan & Co (for U20 ) should be reappointed and John McCarty & Co. should have an U19/18 and development squad ready to take the U20 reins either next year or the year after. He could also maybe bring Cathal O Bric (2021 minor manager) in with him. In any case both management teams need to be strengthened.
County Board needs to make Decision very soon so all can prepare properly.
Meathball (Meath) - Posts: 140 - 25/07/2021 10:34:45
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Replying To Meathball: "Maybe O Hare should move up but I wouldn't be rushing Caulfield and McDonnell up to the Senior set up, O Hare has 2 years on them and although the other two are great prospects, (McDonnell is only back from a years injury, cruciate) I would leave them with the development squads.
I agree mistakes were made on the line at the U20 game and also at 2020 Minor All-Ireland semi final (Derry), they are two games that we could have won if decisions of management were better. However I think both sets of management should be allowed to continue (in fairness the U20 management only had a few weeks) especially if both sets of management put up their hands, admit mistakes and commit to learning from mistakes and not repeat them.
We got to stop the results based hiring and firing, Barry Callaghan & Co (for U20 ) should be reappointed and John McCarty & Co. should have an U19/18 and development squad ready to take the U20 reins either next year or the year after. He could also maybe bring Cathal O Bric (2021 minor manager) in with him. In any case both management teams need to be strengthened.
County Board needs to make Decision very soon so all can prepare properly." 100% agree with this. Callaghan/Kelly as 20's managers. McCarthy and O'Bric with an under 19 development panel with input to the 20's management about guys who are going well and that seems like a good strategy going forwards, with McCarthy taking over the 20's in 2022
LeitrimRoyal99 (Meath) - Posts: 1452 - 25/07/2021 12:44:15
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Replying To LeitrimRoyal99: "100% agree with this. Callaghan/Kelly as 20's managers. McCarthy and O'Bric with an under 19 development panel with input to the 20's management about guys who are going well and that seems like a good strategy going forwards, with McCarthy taking over the 20's in 2022" I was only thinking this after the minor final on Monday. In 2018 we were sat in the exact same position. Back to back Leinster 17's champs. And for the under 20s of both ages we made a mess of it, with late appointments for both ages and the Bernard Flynn debacle. We have been given a gift, we're in the exact same situation right now. Why would you not approach and hopefully announce the management team for the 2022 under 20's now. It could be the same management team that ended up with this years 20's and then with McCarthy and O'Bric with an under 18/19 development group. Or it could be John McCarthy straight away with next years 20's and O'Bric with the development group. But why not approach them now? Let them watch the club championships to see are there any bolters who didn't get much game time at minor (Like Jack Flynn this year) or what minors are kicking on etc. If these two Leinster minor winning teams are given the attention and the tools for success that they deserve then I think they'll lift our senior team a serious amount. If we treat them like we treated the 2017 and 2018 Leinster winning teams then at best we leave it to the individuals to figure out themselves, and at worst we leave them to a poor enough club standard relative to the top counties and they fall away
LeitrimRoyal99 (Meath) - Posts: 1452 - 04/08/2021 18:37:12
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Replying To LeitrimRoyal99: "I was only thinking this after the minor final on Monday. In 2018 we were sat in the exact same position. Back to back Leinster 17's champs. And for the under 20s of both ages we made a mess of it, with late appointments for both ages and the Bernard Flynn debacle. We have been given a gift, we're in the exact same situation right now. Why would you not approach and hopefully announce the management team for the 2022 under 20's now. It could be the same management team that ended up with this years 20's and then with McCarthy and O'Bric with an under 18/19 development group. Or it could be John McCarthy straight away with next years 20's and O'Bric with the development group. But why not approach them now? Let them watch the club championships to see are there any bolters who didn't get much game time at minor (Like Jack Flynn this year) or what minors are kicking on etc. If these two Leinster minor winning teams are given the attention and the tools for success that they deserve then I think they'll lift our senior team a serious amount. If we treat them like we treated the 2017 and 2018 Leinster winning teams then at best we leave it to the individuals to figure out themselves, and at worst we leave them to a poor enough club standard relative to the top counties and they fall away" Very good point. 2020 2021 minor winning teams should be real contenders with John Mccarthy U20 manager in 2022 and Cathal O Bric U20 manager in 2023. Mccarthy will take Under 19 development panel in 2021 and O Bric will take similar U19 development panel in 2022. So in 2022, 2023 we should be strong contenders at U20, hopefully that we will get victory over Dubs and leinster title in those years.
Next year obvious thing is to ask kelly/Callaghan as manager duo next year with Sean Boylan involved with management team. Look at Seans record at underage teams recently. He was involved as selector with DCU they win Sigerson in recent years. He is involved in Down U20 management team this year and they win first Ulster title at U20/U21 in 12 years. Sean Boylan has never being involved with underage team in Meath. That is huge mistake. And needs to be sorted put now. Appoint kelly/ Callaghan as managers with Sean as part of management team next year. That's what a top county would do.
Kelly and Callaghan did well this year under circumstances and have better CVs than Flynns high profile inexperienced management. Flynn had little experience and Leahy had little experience in men's game.
Callaghan as managing and Kelly taking over coaching seems to work as management duo. Callaghan hasn't being successful but he has huge experience managing underage teams in Meath. He has managed Meath with Meath minor team, with U21 Meath team and 2 Under 20 Meath teams. Kelly's CV is good. Here is look at Kelly's CV
2000 to 2007 Coached Meath minor, U21 teams.
2008 Manage coach's Navan O Mahoneys to Meath senior club title
2009 2010 Coachs Meath Seniors to leinster title and beating Dubs in leinster in 2010 and coached Meath to 2009 All Ireland senior semi final
2011 Left Meath seniors
2014 Returned to coach Meath seniors to victory over kildare and leinster final and was selector in 2015 also.
2015 Manager of leinster inter provicial team, led them to Railway Cup final v Munster
2016 Managed and Coached Ashbourne to Feis Cup and Div 1 league title. Was selector in 2017 also. Sean Barry took over reins in 2017.
2018 Coached Dunboyne to Meath senior club title
2020 He managed coached Ardee to their first ever louth senior final after knocking out hot favs Newtown Blues in semis
2020 Managed coached Ardee to their first Louth senior title ever
2021 Manager of Meath U20s along with Callaghan.
Callaghan/Kelly should be appointed charge of U20 now for next year with Sean Boylan as part of management team. We always wait till December to appoint U20, that's crazy. Mccarthy is Manager in 2022, O Bric in 2023. 2021 needs to be sorted now. Teams like Dublin, the whole country will have management teams in place by September. If we don't thats unreal. Look at Callaghans experience at managing Meath underage teams, Kelly's coaching managerial cv and Sean Boylans CV, the greatest manager ever. Surely appointing Callaghan/kelly/Boylan to U20 Meath management team next year is a no brainer.
Kingkeegan (UK) - Posts: 55 - 07/08/2021 20:37:24
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Replying To Kingkeegan: "Very good point. 2020 2021 minor winning teams should be real contenders with John Mccarthy U20 manager in 2022 and Cathal O Bric U20 manager in 2023. Mccarthy will take Under 19 development panel in 2021 and O Bric will take similar U19 development panel in 2022. So in 2022, 2023 we should be strong contenders at U20, hopefully that we will get victory over Dubs and leinster title in those years.
Next year obvious thing is to ask kelly/Callaghan as manager duo next year with Sean Boylan involved with management team. Look at Seans record at underage teams recently. He was involved as selector with DCU they win Sigerson in recent years. He is involved in Down U20 management team this year and they win first Ulster title at U20/U21 in 12 years. Sean Boylan has never being involved with underage team in Meath. That is huge mistake. And needs to be sorted put now. Appoint kelly/ Callaghan as managers with Sean as part of management team next year. That's what a top county would do.
Kelly and Callaghan did well this year under circumstances and have better CVs than Flynns high profile inexperienced management. Flynn had little experience and Leahy had little experience in men's game.
Callaghan as managing and Kelly taking over coaching seems to work as management duo. Callaghan hasn't being successful but he has huge experience managing underage teams in Meath. He has managed Meath with Meath minor team, with U21 Meath team and 2 Under 20 Meath teams. Kelly's CV is good. Here is look at Kelly's CV
2000 to 2007 Coached Meath minor, U21 teams.
2008 Manage coach's Navan O Mahoneys to Meath senior club title
2009 2010 Coachs Meath Seniors to leinster title and beating Dubs in leinster in 2010 and coached Meath to 2009 All Ireland senior semi final
2011 Left Meath seniors
2014 Returned to coach Meath seniors to victory over kildare and leinster final and was selector in 2015 also.
2015 Manager of leinster inter provicial team, led them to Railway Cup final v Munster
2016 Managed and Coached Ashbourne to Feis Cup and Div 1 league title. Was selector in 2017 also. Sean Barry took over reins in 2017.
2018 Coached Dunboyne to Meath senior club title
2020 He managed coached Ardee to their first ever louth senior final after knocking out hot favs Newtown Blues in semis
2020 Managed coached Ardee to their first Louth senior title ever
2021 Manager of Meath U20s along with Callaghan.
Callaghan/Kelly should be appointed charge of U20 now for next year with Sean Boylan as part of management team. We always wait till December to appoint U20, that's crazy. Mccarthy is Manager in 2022, O Bric in 2023. 2021 needs to be sorted now. Teams like Dublin, the whole country will have management teams in place by September. If we don't thats unreal. Look at Callaghans experience at managing Meath underage teams, Kelly's coaching managerial cv and Sean Boylans CV, the greatest manager ever. Surely appointing Callaghan/kelly/Boylan to U20 Meath management team next year is a no brainer." St. Marys Ardee didn't win the Louth championship in 2020 under Kelly but they have won 10 in total long before he got there!
TigerKing (Meath) - Posts: 31 - 07/08/2021 21:43:24
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Replying To TigerKing: "St. Marys Ardee didn't win the Louth championship in 2020 under Kelly but they have won 10 in total long before he got there!" I mixed that up. Naomh Maitin won the title in 2020, their first time. Kelly got Ardee to final. I am not an expert on louth Club football. I knew he was in Final Ardee. I just read it wrong along time ago, first time winners in 2020. My mistake but again, I am not upto date on louth club football.
But it doesnt take away Kelly has good CV, especially coaching. Duos work at underage. Look at Clare few years ago and Dooher/ Logan in Tyrone. Mccarthy take over in 2023, O Bric in 2024. Kelly/Callaghan with Sean Boylan on management team also. Would that not be best option in 2012. Like this
Meath Underage Mangement Teams 2022 to 2025
2022 Under 20 Kelly/ Callaghan with Sean Boylan on management team
Under 19 development panel will be under Mccarthy ( that has already being decided)
2023 Under 20 Manager Mccarthy ( already decided)
Under 19 development panel under O Bric ( already decided)
2024 Under 20 Manager O Bric ( already decided)
2024 Get Mccarthy involved in another underage team from Under 15 or minor
2025 Get O Bric involved in another underage county team from U15 or minor.
We need to keep Mccarthy O Bric in the system. And other minor winning manager Trenor, Kearins should be also involved
We know Mccarthy is in charge in 2023, O Bric in 2024. But yet don't no manager in 2021. That should be main priority of county board in the next few weeks. Appointing an U20 manager for next year NOW.
Kingkeegan (UK) - Posts: 55 - 07/08/2021 22:39:54
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Replying To Kingkeegan: "I mixed that up. Naomh Maitin won the title in 2020, their first time. Kelly got Ardee to final. I am not an expert on louth Club football. I knew he was in Final Ardee. I just read it wrong along time ago, first time winners in 2020. My mistake but again, I am not upto date on louth club football.
But it doesnt take away Kelly has good CV, especially coaching. Duos work at underage. Look at Clare few years ago and Dooher/ Logan in Tyrone. Mccarthy take over in 2023, O Bric in 2024. Kelly/Callaghan with Sean Boylan on management team also. Would that not be best option in 2012. Like this
Meath Underage Mangement Teams 2022 to 2025
2022 Under 20 Kelly/ Callaghan with Sean Boylan on management team
Under 19 development panel will be under Mccarthy ( that has already being decided)
2023 Under 20 Manager Mccarthy ( already decided)
Under 19 development panel under O Bric ( already decided)
2024 Under 20 Manager O Bric ( already decided)
2024 Get Mccarthy involved in another underage team from Under 15 or minor
2025 Get O Bric involved in another underage county team from U15 or minor.
We need to keep Mccarthy O Bric in the system. And other minor winning manager Trenor, Kearins should be also involved
We know Mccarthy is in charge in 2023, O Bric in 2024. But yet don't no manager in 2021. That should be main priority of county board in the next few weeks. Appointing an U20 manager for next year NOW." Fair enough I wasn't having a go at you or Sean Kelly's CV, which is impressive, I just thought it's right to be factual
TigerKing (Meath) - Posts: 31 - 07/08/2021 23:29:48
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Replying To Kingkeegan: "I mixed that up. Naomh Maitin won the title in 2020, their first time. Kelly got Ardee to final. I am not an expert on louth Club football. I knew he was in Final Ardee. I just read it wrong along time ago, first time winners in 2020. My mistake but again, I am not upto date on louth club football.
But it doesnt take away Kelly has good CV, especially coaching. Duos work at underage. Look at Clare few years ago and Dooher/ Logan in Tyrone. Mccarthy take over in 2023, O Bric in 2024. Kelly/Callaghan with Sean Boylan on management team also. Would that not be best option in 2012. Like this
Meath Underage Mangement Teams 2022 to 2025
2022 Under 20 Kelly/ Callaghan with Sean Boylan on management team
Under 19 development panel will be under Mccarthy ( that has already being decided)
2023 Under 20 Manager Mccarthy ( already decided)
Under 19 development panel under O Bric ( already decided)
2024 Under 20 Manager O Bric ( already decided)
2024 Get Mccarthy involved in another underage team from Under 15 or minor
2025 Get O Bric involved in another underage county team from U15 or minor.
We need to keep Mccarthy O Bric in the system. And other minor winning manager Trenor, Kearins should be also involved
We know Mccarthy is in charge in 2023, O Bric in 2024. But yet don't no manager in 2021. That should be main priority of county board in the next few weeks. Appointing an U20 manager for next year NOW." And everyone was wondering where furlong was gone.
All that stinks of to me is keep the old politics going in Meath football. Keep the old traditional names going.
johnsee (Meath) - Posts: 389 - 08/08/2021 00:11:44
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Replying To Kingkeegan: "Very good point. 2020 2021 minor winning teams should be real contenders with John Mccarthy U20 manager in 2022 and Cathal O Bric U20 manager in 2023. Mccarthy will take Under 19 development panel in 2021 and O Bric will take similar U19 development panel in 2022. So in 2022, 2023 we should be strong contenders at U20, hopefully that we will get victory over Dubs and leinster title in those years.
Next year obvious thing is to ask kelly/Callaghan as manager duo next year with Sean Boylan involved with management team. Look at Seans record at underage teams recently. He was involved as selector with DCU they win Sigerson in recent years. He is involved in Down U20 management team this year and they win first Ulster title at U20/U21 in 12 years. Sean Boylan has never being involved with underage team in Meath. That is huge mistake. And needs to be sorted put now. Appoint kelly/ Callaghan as managers with Sean as part of management team next year. That's what a top county would do.
Kelly and Callaghan did well this year under circumstances and have better CVs than Flynns high profile inexperienced management. Flynn had little experience and Leahy had little experience in men's game.
Callaghan as managing and Kelly taking over coaching seems to work as management duo. Callaghan hasn't being successful but he has huge experience managing underage teams in Meath. He has managed Meath with Meath minor team, with U21 Meath team and 2 Under 20 Meath teams. Kelly's CV is good. Here is look at Kelly's CV
2000 to 2007 Coached Meath minor, U21 teams.
2008 Manage coach's Navan O Mahoneys to Meath senior club title
2009 2010 Coachs Meath Seniors to leinster title and beating Dubs in leinster in 2010 and coached Meath to 2009 All Ireland senior semi final
2011 Left Meath seniors
2014 Returned to coach Meath seniors to victory over kildare and leinster final and was selector in 2015 also.
2015 Manager of leinster inter provicial team, led them to Railway Cup final v Munster
2016 Managed and Coached Ashbourne to Feis Cup and Div 1 league title. Was selector in 2017 also. Sean Barry took over reins in 2017.
2018 Coached Dunboyne to Meath senior club title
2020 He managed coached Ardee to their first ever louth senior final after knocking out hot favs Newtown Blues in semis
2020 Managed coached Ardee to their first Louth senior title ever
2021 Manager of Meath U20s along with Callaghan.
Callaghan/Kelly should be appointed charge of U20 now for next year with Sean Boylan as part of management team. We always wait till December to appoint U20, that's crazy. Mccarthy is Manager in 2022, O Bric in 2023. 2021 needs to be sorted now. Teams like Dublin, the whole country will have management teams in place by September. If we don't thats unreal. Look at Callaghans experience at managing Meath underage teams, Kelly's coaching managerial cv and Sean Boylans CV, the greatest manager ever. Surely appointing Callaghan/kelly/Boylan to U20 Meath management team next year is a no brainer." St. Marys Ardee didn't win the Louth championship in 2020 under Kelly but they have won 10 in total long before he got there!
TigerKing (Meath) - Posts: 31 - 08/08/2021 15:01:19
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All Ireland under 20's Hurling B Final this evening versus Derry. Not sure if it has been covered anywhere else but I didnt see it.
Anyone know how good Derry are?
Will there be any effect from Trim winning the SHC at the weekend - must be difficult for their players to come down from the high of winning and play this one on a wet midweek day. Same for the Ratoath players as they experienced defeat at the weekend.
stillaroyal (Meath) - Posts: 223 - 11/08/2021 09:43:19
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Replying To stillaroyal: "All Ireland under 20's Hurling B Final this evening versus Derry. Not sure if it has been covered anywhere else but I didnt see it.
Anyone know how good Derry are?
Will there be any effect from Trim winning the SHC at the weekend - must be difficult for their players to come down from the high of winning and play this one on a wet midweek day. Same for the Ratoath players as they experienced defeat at the weekend." Pairc TV showing the U20 Final - €5 for the stream I think (https://pairctv.com/)
Amarach (Meath) - Posts: 49 - 11/08/2021 09:54:02
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Great win - congratulations to the manager, selectors and all the squad. Great to win an All Ireland - hopefully a boost to hurling overall in the county.
Special mention to the Ratoath and Trim players who had to change from being opponents at the weekend to team mates this time. Notably, Meath captain Cian Kelly from Ratoath and a possible Man of The Match performance from Trim's James Murray.
stillaroyal (Meath) - Posts: 223 - 12/08/2021 12:16:35
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