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A lot of doom and gloom on here, this is a rebuild we are looking at. Most of the team have never played together before. 4 games 50% win record we would have taken that at the start of the league. Obviously there's problems, midfield is a major concern to me Jones is not a midfielder can't catch a high ball, an awful kicker of the ball and tackles like your mother probably would be better suited on the wing. Keogan is not a centre back and is giving away to many frees.
latouche25 (Meath) - Posts: 532 - 27/02/2023 13:28:51
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Replying To CastleBravo: "A lot of dramatic catastrophising here. There's no chance we will lose to Limerick, and 6 points will be enough to stay up even before we take on the Dubs and what looks like a Kildare team in freefall." Will not be taking Kildare for granted . That is likely to be a game where their form will go out the window .It is 50/50. Difficult to have confidence in Meath at present. Most annoying is the sloppiness and sleepiness in our last 2 matches .Our goalie coming up to take a 45 and then short passing the ball instead of having a go for a point.That is rubbish Colm. It is also rubbish to have an opposing forward run half the length of the pitch with goalkeeper completely unprotected .Why do we have a defence Colm? I am a supporter of direct attacking football where at all possible .Long ball in to forwards .The key here has to be DIRECT and FAST delivery where defenders are not given time to organise themselves to cover. Direct attacking football without posting a letter to the opposing defence will pay dividends if used when possible. Equally the running game can be appropriate ,but too many players are running with head down and poor ball control. Too many passes therefore means too many chances to loose possesion. What surprises and annoys me most is sloppiness in using basic skills.
None of this is rocket science indeed ,but unfortunately all too obvious at club matches. I do wonder what happens at Meath training sessions.How are they structured ,and are they related to needs identified in games.?
Why have we not tried to benefit more from the breaking ball at midfield ?
It will be a long haul .Its not fair to be too harsh after a few months. There may be some green shoots like Adam O Neill,Flood, Walsh etc. I hear the atmosphere is pleasent for the lads .Colm is given the required respect required as manager.I would accept that any player who does not buy in for the benefit of the team should be let go. I am being critical of management only because of sily mistakes such as above. .I know we cant expect miracles and as club matches confirm the talent pool is not overfowing. O Rourke has what it takes to get the best out of the lads . Delegate, Oversee, Make sure everyone does what they are supposed to be doing on and off the field .May i be so rude to suggest that might begin with a written plan agreed by the backroom team on the structure of the next training session. Easier from the pundits chair or the keyboard warriors chair than in practise. Heres HOPING. Th e best of luck in the efforts and 100% support for the next2 years !
nobull456 (Meath) - Posts: 1266 - 27/02/2023 13:48:51
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I see a lot of people saying that a win against Limerick ( 6 points on table) see's us safe.
Im not so sure thats accurate. We may avoid relegation to div 3, but could still easily miss out on All Ireland series.
As it stands, Westmeath are garunteed a place(last years Tailteann cup winners) but they aren't a cert for promotion, especially after Down beat them on Saturday.
So say its Cavan & Down who were promoted. Thats 3 spots gone from the all Ireland series, so that would be the teams finishing 6/7/8 in Div 2.
Then, allow for the way the connaught "draw" has just happened to work out. One of Lietrim, Sligo or London are guarantied a provincial final spot... Thus, guaranteeing them an All ireland series spot. So thats another div 2 place go.
So you could be looking at 5/6/7/8 in Div 2 not making All Ireland series.
It could very well come down to Kildare v Meath in Newbridge being a game that ordinarily would be a dead rubber, ending up being the equivalent of a Championship knock out match....
No Of course, if Meath rached a Leinster Final, or more teams higher up in Div 2 reach provincial finals, it passes the place on down the pecking order, but it still leaves plenty at stake in the final 3 games...
Jinxie (Meath) - Posts: 6347 - 27/02/2023 13:55:16
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Replying To nobull456: "Will not be taking Kildare for granted . That is likely to be a game where their form will go out the window .It is 50/50. Difficult to have confidence in Meath at present. Most annoying is the sloppiness and sleepiness in our last 2 matches .Our goalie coming up to take a 45 and then short passing the ball instead of having a go for a point.That is rubbish Colm. It is also rubbish to have an opposing forward run half the length of the pitch with goalkeeper completely unprotected .Why do we have a defence Colm? I am a supporter of direct attacking football where at all possible .Long ball in to forwards .The key here has to be DIRECT and FAST delivery where defenders are not given time to organise themselves to cover. Direct attacking football without posting a letter to the opposing defence will pay dividends if used when possible. Equally the running game can be appropriate ,but too many players are running with head down and poor ball control. Too many passes therefore means too many chances to loose possesion. What surprises and annoys me most is sloppiness in using basic skills.
None of this is rocket science indeed ,but unfortunately all too obvious at club matches. I do wonder what happens at Meath training sessions.How are they structured ,and are they related to needs identified in games.?
Why have we not tried to benefit more from the breaking ball at midfield ?
It will be a long haul .Its not fair to be too harsh after a few months. There may be some green shoots like Adam O Neill,Flood, Walsh etc. I hear the atmosphere is pleasent for the lads .Colm is given the required respect required as manager.I would accept that any player who does not buy in for the benefit of the team should be let go. I am being critical of management only because of sily mistakes such as above. .I know we cant expect miracles and as club matches confirm the talent pool is not overfowing. O Rourke has what it takes to get the best out of the lads . Delegate, Oversee, Make sure everyone does what they are supposed to be doing on and off the field .May i be so rude to suggest that might begin with a written plan agreed by the backroom team on the structure of the next training session. Easier from the pundits chair or the keyboard warriors chair than in practise. Heres HOPING. Th e best of luck in the efforts and 100% support for the next2 years !" HH coming up to take 45 and then playing it back did seem a bit odd. However, I expect when he got there and realised kicking in the conditions was not on. Maybe should have realised sooner, but we have been guilty of taking on potshots from frees and 45s before so think incident may be a bit overblown. Instructions may be to trust instint of free taker and if in doubt recycle. I,m sure Colm asked why a player was allowed travel so far with the ball, defence is a job for entire team. Its a positive to see some of the new lads you named fitting in so well and hopefull a few more brought through over next year or two.
seadog54 (Meath) - Posts: 2195 - 27/02/2023 14:28:08
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Replying To Jinxie: "I see a lot of people saying that a win against Limerick ( 6 points on table) see's us safe.
Im not so sure thats accurate. We may avoid relegation to div 3, but could still easily miss out on All Ireland series.
As it stands, Westmeath are garunteed a place(last years Tailteann cup winners) but they aren't a cert for promotion, especially after Down beat them on Saturday.
So say its Cavan & Down who were promoted. Thats 3 spots gone from the all Ireland series, so that would be the teams finishing 6/7/8 in Div 2.
Then, allow for the way the connaught "draw" has just happened to work out. One of Lietrim, Sligo or London are guarantied a provincial final spot... Thus, guaranteeing them an All ireland series spot. So thats another div 2 place go.
So you could be looking at 5/6/7/8 in Div 2 not making All Ireland series.
It could very well come down to Kildare v Meath in Newbridge being a game that ordinarily would be a dead rubber, ending up being the equivalent of a Championship knock out match....
No Of course, if Meath rached a Leinster Final, or more teams higher up in Div 2 reach provincial finals, it passes the place on down the pecking order, but it still leaves plenty at stake in the final 3 games..." Cavan and Down can qualify for the all Ireland series by promotion in Div 2 as they will be ranked 15th and 16th and 2 spots are already definitely gone.
Maestro (Meath) - Posts: 584 - 27/02/2023 14:51:24
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In truth we are in transition. Era of Menton, McGill, Keoghan, Harnan as our leaders is over. We are now moving into the era of the current under 20's and the groups coming along behind supplemented by players such as O'Sullivan, Shane Walsh etc.
So keeping our status in Division 2 is probably the best we could hope for and, as mentioned, a miraculous promotion probably wont do us any good.
stillaroyal (Meath) - Posts: 225 - 27/02/2023 15:51:53
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Replying To seadog54: "Well said, we have been on the slide for many years and things are not going to get much better anytime soon. Fortunate to be on four points if we are honest with ourselves. Next week very important, a win will go a long way to safety, however, top five is a minimum to insure place in All Ireland series should Leinster go belly up." If we can't beat Offaly and Westmeath in Leinister we wouldn't be out of place in the Tailtean Cup.
I spoke to Dessie Dolan a few times during Westmeaths run in the Tailtean Cup last year and he said it was brilliant to be still playing matches in Croke Park and winning something .
Meath haven't won anything in a long time I think the last was a Div 3 title so a run in the Tailtean Cup wouldn't be the worst thing that could happen to this team !!
mmc (Meath) - Posts: 280 - 27/02/2023 15:56:34
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Nice to see most of the comments are realistic and by genuine G.A.A fans who understand this was never going to be a silver bullet with COR.
Was only chatting Rory Gallagher before Christmas and he told me it took 6 months to weed out the problems in the Derry camp alone before he could start building a panel of players who are committed to the cause. He is hoping he can get to an Ireland final this year and bow out then. He said 4 years is enough with any county with the 5th as a last resort.
So lets have a look at the teams in Division 2 and their management. I obviously wont get all the times right but lets look at the main players.
Dublin - Dessie into his 3rd season.
Derry - Rory into his 4th season
Louth - Mickey into his 3rd season
Cork - John C into his 2nd season
Kildare - Glen R into his 2nd season
Clare - Colm C is there a very long time now
Limerick - Ray D , Is this his first year ?
Okay so lets take a look, Teams doing very well have managers into seasons 3 and 4, I'm sure Glen Ryan is not happy with his second season however John C has definitely improved Cork.
Clare's manager is there just too long now at this stage, did very well going from division 4 to Division 2 and reaching all Ireland Q/F however it looks like it needs changing
That leave us and Limerick with new Managers.
As I said, this is not a silver bullet, its a journey and as COR said on RTE he will know after 2 years if he is on the right path or not. the only negative is and I am sure I will be slated for it is the appointment of Sean Boylan to the backroom team. Absolute ludicrous in this day and age, Sean has been retired far too long and has been watching more women's games the past 5 years than men's, just my opinion and my opinions are my own.
Summary - We will judge COR at the end of the 2024 season.
thelutch (Meath) - Posts: 1073 - 27/02/2023 16:04:57
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Replying To mmc: "If we can't beat Offaly and Westmeath in Leinister we wouldn't be out of place in the Tailtean Cup.
I spoke to Dessie Dolan a few times during Westmeaths run in the Tailtean Cup last year and he said it was brilliant to be still playing matches in Croke Park and winning something .
Meath haven't won anything in a long time I think the last was a Div 3 title so a run in the Tailtean Cup wouldn't be the worst thing that could happen to this team !!" I said it before a ball was kicked in O Byrne cup, to much consternation on here, Tailteann Cup is where we need to start from. Have no right to look down on it in any shape or form. Louth were good value for their win over us yesterday - that's where we are!
Crinigan (Meath) - Posts: 1352 - 27/02/2023 16:25:25
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Replying To Jinxie: "I see a lot of people saying that a win against Limerick ( 6 points on table) see's us safe.
Im not so sure thats accurate. We may avoid relegation to div 3, but could still easily miss out on All Ireland series.
As it stands, Westmeath are garunteed a place(last years Tailteann cup winners) but they aren't a cert for promotion, especially after Down beat them on Saturday.
So say its Cavan & Down who were promoted. Thats 3 spots gone from the all Ireland series, so that would be the teams finishing 6/7/8 in Div 2.
Then, allow for the way the connaught "draw" has just happened to work out. One of Lietrim, Sligo or London are guarantied a provincial final spot... Thus, guaranteeing them an All ireland series spot. So thats another div 2 place go.
So you could be looking at 5/6/7/8 in Div 2 not making All Ireland series.
It could very well come down to Kildare v Meath in Newbridge being a game that ordinarily would be a dead rubber, ending up being the equivalent of a Championship knock out match....
No Of course, if Meath rached a Leinster Final, or more teams higher up in Div 2 reach provincial finals, it passes the place on down the pecking order, but it still leaves plenty at stake in the final 3 games..." I don't understand how 5th/6th in Division 2 miss out on the All-Ireland series over the 2 promoted teams from Division 3?? If Westmeath are not promoted should they not take the 16th ranked teams place in the AI, e.g the 2nd placed team in Division 3?? Am I missing something here?
Anyway I think it would be a sad day for Meath to be playing in the Tailteann Cup. This is simply not what we should be aiming for. Accepted we've a lot of problems to address but still would be an embarrassment for a county like ourselves to be playing in it.
People might say, we're not the Meath team of the past but maybe that's the difference, our mentality has changed and we've gone soft, among other things.
NYRoyal (USA) - Posts: 31 - 27/02/2023 19:07:44
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Replying To thelutch: "Nice to see most of the comments are realistic and by genuine G.A.A fans who understand this was never going to be a silver bullet with COR.
Was only chatting Rory Gallagher before Christmas and he told me it took 6 months to weed out the problems in the Derry camp alone before he could start building a panel of players who are committed to the cause. He is hoping he can get to an Ireland final this year and bow out then. He said 4 years is enough with any county with the 5th as a last resort.
So lets have a look at the teams in Division 2 and their management. I obviously wont get all the times right but lets look at the main players.
Dublin - Dessie into his 3rd season.
Derry - Rory into his 4th season
Louth - Mickey into his 3rd season
Cork - John C into his 2nd season
Kildare - Glen R into his 2nd season
Clare - Colm C is there a very long time now
Limerick - Ray D , Is this his first year ?
Okay so lets take a look, Teams doing very well have managers into seasons 3 and 4, I'm sure Glen Ryan is not happy with his second season however John C has definitely improved Cork.
Clare's manager is there just too long now at this stage, did very well going from division 4 to Division 2 and reaching all Ireland Q/F however it looks like it needs changing
That leave us and Limerick with new Managers.
As I said, this is not a silver bullet, its a journey and as COR said on RTE he will know after 2 years if he is on the right path or not. the only negative is and I am sure I will be slated for it is the appointment of Sean Boylan to the backroom team. Absolute ludicrous in this day and age, Sean has been retired far too long and has been watching more women's games the past 5 years than men's, just my opinion and my opinions are my own.
Summary - We will judge COR at the end of the 2024 season." Well if Rory Gallagher had to weed out problems in Derry we face a really mammoth climb. Just cast your mind back to the All Ireland Intermediate Club Final between Steelstown and Trim. Steelstown were extremely well organised, always had plenty of defenders back 'when needed' and yet were able to get several forward to work scores without Trim literally 'getting a hand' on them. Yet Steelstown made very little impression in Derry's Senior Championship this year. So Rory G had plenty of players well drilled in organised defensive followed by instant attacking football at his disposal. We just cannot cope with the way Ulster teams set up and we are showing no inclination to do so. I knew before yesterday that the Louth game was a banana skin all because Mickey Harte was involved. There was NOT going to be a flurry of goals like we got against Cork and Clare and Louth were going to compete to the very end.
We are where we are because our overall approach has not evolved like the northern counties. Therefore our county managers take on a job with literally no raw materials available to them. Yes there are many excellent defenders and forwards who can kick scores and some who can run forever but that's all. Most importantly of all we are short of top class mobile high fielding midfielders. I know they can't be plucked off some exotic tree but are a very worthwhile asset to have. Conor Glass being a recent example. Without them a lot of extra work falls on the entire team from cluttering up midfield to having a super efficient kick out strategy. The very good forward remains a very good forward by our club standards but faces a monster task in kicking points when he is forced on to his 'weak foot' or hassled by three defenders when he dons the county jersey. Yet when he or another forward coughs up possession it is more than likely that within 15 to 20 seconds one of his hasslers will be kicking a point at the other end. Granted we do get players back to defend but don't then get some of them forward at a huge pace to create a telling overlap that leads to important scores. We have to get to the mindset that you are a defender when an opponent has the ball and an attacker has the ball. The northern teams appear to work to a system that the players are rotated that gives players an opportunity to take a breather and be ready to do it all over again and again. This is the way the game is now being played in all the ambitious clubs. Therefore the County management teams get their hands on players who are well versed in modern football methods, then they take it to a level that leave us in their slipstream.
So where do we go from here? Development squads? Increased coaching? Something else?
Development squads, we have them for years now yet who notices any improvement. Not much. Why? Probably the squads are too small or not fluid enough. Promising players at 13 or 14 don't improve enough or suffer a slump in form due to several factors, new school set up, growth spurts or injury. Then you have the player who did not initially make the cut but really develops between 17 and 19, this boy has now no opportunity since the minor age went down to u-17. Message, keep Development Squads under constant review.
Increased coaching. No brainier really but does every club coach now have to have a basic coaching coarse completed? I think so but is this enough? A basic coarse is probably not enough and are the coaches evaluated regularly after the basic qualification is achieved. Message. Keep a big push on to get highly qualified coaches in each club and evaluate their performance in an educational way rather than by fault finding.
Something else. Probably more strength and conditioning is required at all levels both club and county. At last the club championships are again getting competitive but I would like to have the Regional teams getting access to the Senior Championship therefore exposing our better Junior and Intermediate player playing at the highest level possible even if that meant reducing the SFC to twelve (12) stand alone senior teams. Finally it was disappointing that there were only a few contested positions for county committee positions this year.
Time to be bold or we will become irrelevant.
MillerX (Meath) - Posts: 1080 - 27/02/2023 19:46:08
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Replying To mmc: "If we can't beat Offaly and Westmeath in Leinister we wouldn't be out of place in the Tailtean Cup.
I spoke to Dessie Dolan a few times during Westmeaths run in the Tailtean Cup last year and he said it was brilliant to be still playing matches in Croke Park and winning something .
Meath haven't won anything in a long time I think the last was a Div 3 title so a run in the Tailtean Cup wouldn't be the worst thing that could happen to this team !!" We will in likelihood be playing louth in Leinster semi. Confidence after yesterday won't be high
royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 27/02/2023 20:29:08
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Watching the game back, I asked myself how have we gotten worse but it seems to be more a case of Louth getting better. They put it up to both Derry and Clare and on form should beat Kildare next weekend.
For Meath it is a case of doing the best with what we have available.
A couple of key talking points on the game:
1.) O Higgins red card, harsh but Gannon was sent off for similar the previous week but his was a second yellow, refs are clamping down on "hits" like that more. We've gone the way of rugby that contact to the head with those kind of shoulders is a red card.
2.) Louths wonder goal. O Connor went to kick it stopped and then decided to kick it. The Louth player knew where the ball was going and had made his run the same time the ball was kicked, he was running onto the ball at speed while the defenders had to turn and inject some pace which was always going to be difficult to do. O Neill made up some ground and should have taken a black card to avoid the goal chance.
3.) We were outscored 8pts to 1pt in the last 15 minutes. Being down the 14 men didn't help but it was a case of control the match and see it out. Instead we imploded and couldn't hold on to the ball.
There were positives on yesterday's match, 1-11 from play, Flynn and Jones kicked 3 points from midfield, full forward line all contributed.
Flood and O Neill had great games, second half by O Neill was impressive for someone who never played underage for Meath. Still need to find another man marker, Flood can't do it by himself especially when most teams in division 2 have 2 or 3 forwards who will contribute 2/3 pts a game.
McEntee was unfortunate to be taken off at half time, it could have been a case of injury but also COR was thinking he needs to get another man marker on the pitch which is why it was O Hare over other players. McEntee was probably the poorest of the 5 backs in the first half. If it was me then I would have hauled O Connor off, he done nothing wrong in the first half but this was waiting to happen. He's not a wing back so why is COR playing him there.
Jones and Flynn just about broke even but against stronger midfield pairings will be taken to the cleaners. I've commented on this in other threads, not really sure how COR addresses it.
O Sullivan and Campion aren't working at wing forward, something different is needed here perhaps O Connor moves to wing forward or maybe try O Reilly there for the next 3 games. There's no return so far with O Sullivan and Campion on either work rate or scores.
I would be happy enough with our inside line, they showed well for ball, kicked some very good scores but the way Louth set up they weren't getting much more than they got. This is where the wing forwards need to come from deep off the shoulder of the full forward line and try add a point or two. Frees and 45s are still a problem but nothing new there.
UsernameInvalid (Meath) - Posts: 403 - 28/02/2023 08:54:41
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Watching the game back, I asked myself how have we gotten worse but it seems to be more a case of Louth getting better. They put it up to both Derry and Clare and on form should beat Kildare next weekend.
For Meath it is a case of doing the best with what we have available.
A couple of key talking points on the game:
1.) O Higgins red card, harsh but Gannon was sent off for similar the previous week but his was a second yellow, refs are clamping down on "hits" like that more. We've gone the way of rugby that contact to the head with those kind of shoulders is a red card.
2.) Louths wonder goal. O Connor went to kick it stopped and then decided to kick it. The Louth player knew where the ball was going and had made his run the same time the ball was kicked, he was running onto the ball at speed while the defenders had to turn and inject some pace which was always going to be difficult to do. O Neill made up some ground and should have taken a black card to avoid the goal chance.
3.) We were outscored 8pts to 1pt in the last 15 minutes. Being down the 14 men didn't help but it was a case of control the match and see it out. Instead we imploded and couldn't hold on to the ball.
There were positives on yesterday's match, 1-11 from play, Flynn and Jones kicked 3 points from midfield, full forward line all contributed.
Flood and O Neill had great games, second half by O Neill was impressive for someone who never played underage for Meath. Still need to find another man marker, Flood can't do it by himself especially when most teams in division 2 have 2 or 3 forwards who will contribute 2/3 pts a game.
McEntee was unfortunate to be taken off at half time, it could have been a case of injury but also COR was thinking he needs to get another man marker on the pitch which is why it was O Hare over other players. McEntee was probably the poorest of the 5 backs in the first half. If it was me then I would have hauled O Connor off, he done nothing wrong in the first half but this was waiting to happen. He's not a wing back so why is COR playing him there.
Jones and Flynn just about broke even but against stronger midfield pairings will be taken to the cleaners. I've commented on this in other threads, not really sure how COR addresses it.
O Sullivan and Campion aren't working at wing forward, something different is needed here perhaps O Connor moves to wing forward or maybe try O Reilly there for the next 3 games. There's no return so far with O Sullivan and Campion on either work rate or scores.
I would be happy enough with our inside line, they showed well for ball, kicked some very good scores but the way Louth set up they weren't getting much more than they got. This is where the wing forwards need to come from deep off the shoulder of the full forward line and try add a point or two. Frees and 45s are still a problem but nothing new there.
UsernameInvalid (Meath) - Posts: 403 - 28/02/2023 08:54:51
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I've stayed away from posting because of the nonsense posted the last few days. Thought the Shane McEntee nonsense would stop with Andy gone as manager but maybe I was expecting too much of some supporters. Strangely I wasn't as disappointed as I would be after a loss to a team we'd be expected to beat. The red card was a clear red card. You can't shoulder and hit the head at all anymore. If you're going to go for the big flashy hit you have to make sure it's nailed on and O'Higgins mistimed it. Hopefully he learns from it. There were plenty of positives. Adam O'Neill was incredible, Flood was was very solid, Flynn definitely looks like he'll be a good player at this level and Walsh and Costello have definitely improved since last year. The negatives is that we still can not figure out a packed defense. We lack the patience to just make a game boring and do the right thing and keep the ball. Some simple skills that were executed wrong. And defensively we look naive and are bad at passing on runners and have players covering danger zones to stop the runners. We have to beat Limerick now otherwise we will be relegated but I think we will. The effort was not a question against Louth and there was glimpses of real quality from O'Neill, Flynn, Walsh, Morris, Costello. There are some issues but they are fixable with good coaching so time for Garrigan etc. to get to work
LeitrimRoyal99 (Meath) - Posts: 1523 - 28/02/2023 09:30:22
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Replying To LeitrimRoyal99: "I've stayed away from posting because of the nonsense posted the last few days. Thought the Shane McEntee nonsense would stop with Andy gone as manager but maybe I was expecting too much of some supporters. Strangely I wasn't as disappointed as I would be after a loss to a team we'd be expected to beat. The red card was a clear red card. You can't shoulder and hit the head at all anymore. If you're going to go for the big flashy hit you have to make sure it's nailed on and O'Higgins mistimed it. Hopefully he learns from it. There were plenty of positives. Adam O'Neill was incredible, Flood was was very solid, Flynn definitely looks like he'll be a good player at this level and Walsh and Costello have definitely improved since last year. The negatives is that we still can not figure out a packed defense. We lack the patience to just make a game boring and do the right thing and keep the ball. Some simple skills that were executed wrong. And defensively we look naive and are bad at passing on runners and have players covering danger zones to stop the runners. We have to beat Limerick now otherwise we will be relegated but I think we will. The effort was not a question against Louth and there was glimpses of real quality from O'Neill, Flynn, Walsh, Morris, Costello. There are some issues but they are fixable with good coaching so time for Garrigan etc. to get to work" Yeah agree with the positives you mention.I think we win this game 15V 15 as it made a big difference.In fairness to Louth they used the extra man well and in bringing out their goalkeeper they had 2 extra men on our kickouts.The keeper (plays midfield for his club I heard)was on the terrace side and the corner forward was the other side,they all pushed up forcing us to kick long.They also brought Sam Mulroy out and he won a good bit of ball.They crowded the middle and broke the ball and had extra men there to help out.If we won the ball they all got back behind the ball.It was a risk bringing the keeper and we nearly caught him a couple of times but it worked for them.If Its 15 v15 I dont think they take the risk as much.The lads put in a big effort and it's a long time to play a man down and it probably caught up with us in the end.We need to give Hogan more options on our kickouts and need more movement from all players.We as another poster said need to manage the game more if leading but that will only come with experience.We played some nice football at times and got some nice scores just need to keep the scoreboard ticking over more and not go so long without scores.Hopefully we learn from this game and move on and hopefully get the win the next day and go into the last 2 games with no fear and put in good performances.
Proudroyal (Meath) - Posts: 294 - 28/02/2023 11:51:32
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Replying To UsernameInvalid: "Watching the game back, I asked myself how have we gotten worse but it seems to be more a case of Louth getting better. They put it up to both Derry and Clare and on form should beat Kildare next weekend.
For Meath it is a case of doing the best with what we have available.
A couple of key talking points on the game:
1.) O Higgins red card, harsh but Gannon was sent off for similar the previous week but his was a second yellow, refs are clamping down on "hits" like that more. We've gone the way of rugby that contact to the head with those kind of shoulders is a red card.
2.) Louths wonder goal. O Connor went to kick it stopped and then decided to kick it. The Louth player knew where the ball was going and had made his run the same time the ball was kicked, he was running onto the ball at speed while the defenders had to turn and inject some pace which was always going to be difficult to do. O Neill made up some ground and should have taken a black card to avoid the goal chance.
3.) We were outscored 8pts to 1pt in the last 15 minutes. Being down the 14 men didn't help but it was a case of control the match and see it out. Instead we imploded and couldn't hold on to the ball.
There were positives on yesterday's match, 1-11 from play, Flynn and Jones kicked 3 points from midfield, full forward line all contributed.
Flood and O Neill had great games, second half by O Neill was impressive for someone who never played underage for Meath. Still need to find another man marker, Flood can't do it by himself especially when most teams in division 2 have 2 or 3 forwards who will contribute 2/3 pts a game.
McEntee was unfortunate to be taken off at half time, it could have been a case of injury but also COR was thinking he needs to get another man marker on the pitch which is why it was O Hare over other players. McEntee was probably the poorest of the 5 backs in the first half. If it was me then I would have hauled O Connor off, he done nothing wrong in the first half but this was waiting to happen. He's not a wing back so why is COR playing him there.
Jones and Flynn just about broke even but against stronger midfield pairings will be taken to the cleaners. I've commented on this in other threads, not really sure how COR addresses it.
O Sullivan and Campion aren't working at wing forward, something different is needed here perhaps O Connor moves to wing forward or maybe try O Reilly there for the next 3 games. There's no return so far with O Sullivan and Campion on either work rate or scores.
I would be happy enough with our inside line, they showed well for ball, kicked some very good scores but the way Louth set up they weren't getting much more than they got. This is where the wing forwards need to come from deep off the shoulder of the full forward line and try add a point or two. Frees and 45s are still a problem but nothing new there." Where did you watch it, would you have a link please.
seadog54 (Meath) - Posts: 2195 - 28/02/2023 12:56:35
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Replying To NYRoyal: "I don't understand how 5th/6th in Division 2 miss out on the All-Ireland series over the 2 promoted teams from Division 3?? If Westmeath are not promoted should they not take the 16th ranked teams place in the AI, e.g the 2nd placed team in Division 3?? Am I missing something here?
Anyway I think it would be a sad day for Meath to be playing in the Tailteann Cup. This is simply not what we should be aiming for. Accepted we've a lot of problems to address but still would be an embarrassment for a county like ourselves to be playing in it.
People might say, we're not the Meath team of the past but maybe that's the difference, our mentality has changed and we've gone soft, among other things." There is a good article by Malachy Clerkin in Mondays Irish Times which explains in laymans terms the ins and out,s of qualification for All Ireland series. Its not behind pay wall so just look up Irish Times sport.
seadog54 (Meath) - Posts: 2195 - 28/02/2023 13:54:40
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Replying To LeitrimRoyal99: "I've stayed away from posting because of the nonsense posted the last few days. Thought the Shane McEntee nonsense would stop with Andy gone as manager but maybe I was expecting too much of some supporters. Strangely I wasn't as disappointed as I would be after a loss to a team we'd be expected to beat. The red card was a clear red card. You can't shoulder and hit the head at all anymore. If you're going to go for the big flashy hit you have to make sure it's nailed on and O'Higgins mistimed it. Hopefully he learns from it. There were plenty of positives. Adam O'Neill was incredible, Flood was was very solid, Flynn definitely looks like he'll be a good player at this level and Walsh and Costello have definitely improved since last year. The negatives is that we still can not figure out a packed defense. We lack the patience to just make a game boring and do the right thing and keep the ball. Some simple skills that were executed wrong. And defensively we look naive and are bad at passing on runners and have players covering danger zones to stop the runners. We have to beat Limerick now otherwise we will be relegated but I think we will. The effort was not a question against Louth and there was glimpses of real quality from O'Neill, Flynn, Walsh, Morris, Costello. There are some issues but they are fixable with good coaching so time for Garrigan etc. to get to work" So had i. But the bitterness still is astounding.
royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 28/02/2023 14:00:26
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Replying To MillerX: "Well if Rory Gallagher had to weed out problems in Derry we face a really mammoth climb. Just cast your mind back to the All Ireland Intermediate Club Final between Steelstown and Trim. Steelstown were extremely well organised, always had plenty of defenders back 'when needed' and yet were able to get several forward to work scores without Trim literally 'getting a hand' on them. Yet Steelstown made very little impression in Derry's Senior Championship this year. So Rory G had plenty of players well drilled in organised defensive followed by instant attacking football at his disposal. We just cannot cope with the way Ulster teams set up and we are showing no inclination to do so. I knew before yesterday that the Louth game was a banana skin all because Mickey Harte was involved. There was NOT going to be a flurry of goals like we got against Cork and Clare and Louth were going to compete to the very end.
We are where we are because our overall approach has not evolved like the northern counties. Therefore our county managers take on a job with literally no raw materials available to them. Yes there are many excellent defenders and forwards who can kick scores and some who can run forever but that's all. Most importantly of all we are short of top class mobile high fielding midfielders. I know they can't be plucked off some exotic tree but are a very worthwhile asset to have. Conor Glass being a recent example. Without them a lot of extra work falls on the entire team from cluttering up midfield to having a super efficient kick out strategy. The very good forward remains a very good forward by our club standards but faces a monster task in kicking points when he is forced on to his 'weak foot' or hassled by three defenders when he dons the county jersey. Yet when he or another forward coughs up possession it is more than likely that within 15 to 20 seconds one of his hasslers will be kicking a point at the other end. Granted we do get players back to defend but don't then get some of them forward at a huge pace to create a telling overlap that leads to important scores. We have to get to the mindset that you are a defender when an opponent has the ball and an attacker has the ball. The northern teams appear to work to a system that the players are rotated that gives players an opportunity to take a breather and be ready to do it all over again and again. This is the way the game is now being played in all the ambitious clubs. Therefore the County management teams get their hands on players who are well versed in modern football methods, then they take it to a level that leave us in their slipstream.
So where do we go from here? Development squads? Increased coaching? Something else?
Development squads, we have them for years now yet who notices any improvement. Not much. Why? Probably the squads are too small or not fluid enough. Promising players at 13 or 14 don't improve enough or suffer a slump in form due to several factors, new school set up, growth spurts or injury. Then you have the player who did not initially make the cut but really develops between 17 and 19, this boy has now no opportunity since the minor age went down to u-17. Message, keep Development Squads under constant review.
Increased coaching. No brainier really but does every club coach now have to have a basic coaching coarse completed? I think so but is this enough? A basic coarse is probably not enough and are the coaches evaluated regularly after the basic qualification is achieved. Message. Keep a big push on to get highly qualified coaches in each club and evaluate their performance in an educational way rather than by fault finding.
Something else. Probably more strength and conditioning is required at all levels both club and county. At last the club championships are again getting competitive but I would like to have the Regional teams getting access to the Senior Championship therefore exposing our better Junior and Intermediate player playing at the highest level possible even if that meant reducing the SFC to twelve (12) stand alone senior teams. Finally it was disappointing that there were only a few contested positions for county committee positions this year.
Time to be bold or we will become irrelevant." Very small little pointer from Michael Daragh Mccauley today online , where he is speaking about Dublin...and he references players with the right attitude
To me the attitude has been wrong in the County set up (and county ) for years. There are many elements to it, but in summary its an over estimation of ourselves as a County, As County Squads, and in alot of the individual players. Thing is , this no teh fault of teh one who thinks they are special...in many ways they don't know what they don't know i, but it is a fault in people at the top , who are supposed to know how vital attitude & culture is.
pat Gilroy fundamentally changed the attitude in Dublin , as to who they are , how they see themselves and how they value & judge themselves going forward .....If we are still talking only about , ability, S&C., fitness etc.,...and not addressing the other stuff...we get what we reap
Thelongwoodslasher (Meath) - Posts: 401 - 28/02/2023 14:51:08
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