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Failed drug test

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If a lad did something unintentionally and served his ban, whose benefit is it for it to be made public. Unlike other sports, these lads have to hold down a job as well, no need to tarnish the lads name as_ky (Kerry) - Posts:460 - 28/05/2017 16:10:28To warn other athletes to be careful of what you put into your body. yes these players are amatuer and have to hold down a job outside the sport but thats irrelvant. If they get a ban for taking substances in sport they can still earn if a pro athlete does they may not be able to or at least certainly not easily I am totally against this charade "Oh what a clean sport we are now can we have the grants please!". These are amateuers they do not play for money, it was unintentional. The only financial gain is to the Sports doping authorities and their labs. Explain to me the advantage if any to be gained here? If the authorities were concerned about player welfare rather than the image of the sport I would at least try and support this rubbish. A mandatory ban of four years is outragous and the procedures so inflexible so secret it is medieval and archaic. Basically it is a disgrace to deprive people of natural justice, in effect a player has to prove his innocence. World wide doping has been shown to be corrupt, flawed, lack of transparency. The only reason the GAA signed up to this was for sporting grants and her we see an innocent person been punished an amateuer. arock (Dublin) - Posts:3302 - 28/05/2017 16:18:39 This is so naive. What advantages do you think are to be taken A 4 year ban if proven illegal, enhancing substances have been taken is not at all outrageous and the procedures around bans etc are not inflexible and certainly not secret or medevill. Nobody is deprived of natural justice so lay off the histironics. That a player is amatuer doesnt mean drug testing shouldnt be taking place. ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 28/05/2017 19:42:25 1991571 Link
Replying To as_ky: "If a lad did something unintentionally and served his ban, whose benefit is it for it to be made public. Unlike other sports, these lads have to hold down a job as well, no need to tarnish the lads name" I agree with you but the vultures want to know. I would never rely on an article/story in a paper for the truth as they are about selling their product. I strongly disagree with anyone taking un-approved substances and I am quite happy to see people getting caught, but I am not interested names as on occasions mistakes can be made and players like everyone else takes medicines. browncows (Meath) - Posts: 2342 - 28/05/2017 20:14:41 1991579 Link
Replying To TheHermit: "Doesn't Michael Lowry regularly top the poll in your own back yard? I wouldn't be referencing the Healy Rae's when you return fella's like that." Haha, touché, at least he knows what he is and is not in denial. If it was a Dublin player who had failed a drugs test, Kerry would have a field day. I'm only winding ye up cos ye love trivialising extremely important things when it suits ye. Whether the player did it intentionally or not, ye'd want to sort it out cos it's the sending Kerry player. A boxer was sent home from the Olympics for something similar. Trying to sweeping it under the carpet is the reason why it doesn't sit well with me. Killarney.87 (Tipperary) - Posts: 2513 - 28/05/2017 20:23:20 1991586 Link
Replying To Killarney.87: "Haha, touché, at least he knows what he is and is not in denial. If it was a Dublin player who had failed a drugs test, Kerry would have a field day. I'm only winding ye up cos ye love trivialising extremely important things when it suits ye. Whether the player did it intentionally or not, ye'd want to sort it out cos it's the sending Kerry player. A boxer was sent home from the Olympics for something similar. Trying to sweeping it under the carpet is the reason why it doesn't sit well with me." How do you know what's being swept under the carpet? And what's the implication in making that statement? Are you suggesting the Kerry GAA are behind keeping this hidden? Was this information leaked when it should not have been? Is it usually the case that players who failed tests are given bans in secret. There seems to be no transparency and that is Croke Park's issue not the Kerry GAA's. It seems to me the Kerry GAA was simply told Sports Ireland would be issuing a statement and they in turn issued their own last night to show they were aware of the incident and that it had been dealt with. A fella could have had a cold, or a pain in his back or something. He might of just go into the chemist to get an asprin not realising it contained something that's on the banned list. I mean a county panel is +30 players, they have jobs, they are amateurs. Yes the county medical team should be making players aware what they can and can't take but its very easy to see how a mistake can happen every now and again. I personally don't see what's the problem, bare the bigger issue of veiled nature of these tests/bans. BTW O'Mahoney's case was years ago, I don't like your insinuation that it happened recently and a seemingly strained attempt to link these things together. And I don't think any fair minded person would or should be making a 'field day' out of something like this, whatever county a player is from. TheHermit (Kerry) - Posts: 6354 - 28/05/2017 21:13:38 1991620 Link
Think there is a report coming up on Sunday game-could be interesting The_Fridge (Tyrone) - Posts: 2088 - 28/05/2017 22:03:50 1991641 Link
Replying To arock: "Cyclists, Boxers and Athletes are one-on-one our solo performers whether they are amateuers are not is irrelevant. There are 15 players on a GAA team the advantage is miniscule and just moral window dressing and for that a player gets pilloried, 4 year ban and become a virtual outcast, ridiculous and dangerous way to treat people." Cycling is very much a team sport. To say otherwise would suggest you know little about the sport. extranjero (Wexford) - Posts: 375 - 28/05/2017 22:21:37 1991652 Link
Replying To TheHermit: "How do you know what's being swept under the carpet? And what's the implication in making that statement? Are you suggesting the Kerry GAA are behind keeping this hidden? Was this information leaked when it should not have been? Is it usually the case that players who failed tests are given bans in secret. There seems to be no transparency and that is Croke Park's issue not the Kerry GAA's. It seems to me the Kerry GAA was simply told Sports Ireland would be issuing a statement and they in turn issued their own last night to show they were aware of the incident and that it had been dealt with. A fella could have had a cold, or a pain in his back or something. He might of just go into the chemist to get an asprin not realising it contained something that's on the banned list. I mean a county panel is +30 players, they have jobs, they are amateurs. Yes the county medical team should be making players aware what they can and can't take but its very easy to see how a mistake can happen every now and again. I personally don't see what's the problem, bare the bigger issue of veiled nature of these tests/bans. BTW O'Mahoney's case was years ago, I don't like your insinuation that it happened recently and a seemingly strained attempt to link these things together. And I don't think any fair minded person would or should be making a 'field day' out of something like this, whatever county a player is from." I was referring mainly to Croke Park with regards lack of transparency. I don't buy into the argument of, I had a cold and I went down to the shop and bought the wrong thing. Unless these lads live under a rock they have heard of all the high profile drugs bans across all sports. Regardless as to when the first one happened it is 2 for Kerry now and that it a fact. Whatever happened along the way this needs to be sorted out so it doesn't happen again. It's embarrassing for all concerned. Killarney.87 (Tipperary) - Posts: 2513 - 28/05/2017 22:31:23 1991660 Link
Replying To extranjero: "Cycling is very much a team sport. To say otherwise would suggest you know little about the sport." You know full well what i mean you just don't like my argument so you throw that ridiculous childish curve ball out, athletes and boxers are all part of a team too! that was NOT what I meant but I know you know. But you clearly know diddly squat about PED's if you think Derry's number 4 taking PEDs would have changed the result today, THAT was my point my only point but I suspect it was way way to subtle for you to grasp it must be a challenge discussing anything with you. BTW in fact if all 15 Derry players took them it would have made no difference. arock (Dublin) - Posts: 4895 - 28/05/2017 22:56:23 1991664 Link
Replying To Killarney.87: "I was referring mainly to Croke Park with regards lack of transparency. I don't buy into the argument of, I had a cold and I went down to the shop and bought the wrong thing. Unless these lads live under a rock they have heard of all the high profile drugs bans across all sports. Regardless as to when the first one happened it is 2 for Kerry now and that it a fact. Whatever happened along the way this needs to be sorted out so it doesn't happen again. It's embarrassing for all concerned." So Kerry are the only county this has happened to? TheHermit (Kerry) - Posts: 6354 - 28/05/2017 23:12:42 1991669 Link
Replying To arock: "You know full well what i mean you just don't like my argument so you throw that ridiculous childish curve ball out, athletes and boxers are all part of a team too! that was NOT what I meant but I know you know. But you clearly know diddly squat about PED's if you think Derry's number 4 taking PEDs would have changed the result today, THAT was my point my only point but I suspect it was way way to subtle for you to grasp it must be a challenge discussing anything with you. BTW in fact if all 15 Derry players took them it would have made no difference." If Derry had 15 players under the influence of PED's today, I would suggest it would VERY MUCH have influenced the result!! What I was simply alluding to in your previous comment was that old fallacy that arises time and again, ".....oooohhh its a team sport, soccer/hurling/rugby/football/etc....doping has no influence as it's all about the skill....." But this simply is not the case. Corticsosteroids....EPO....Blood Transfusions.........and much, much more... You see, all these little things add up, one thing increases strength, something else for stamina, something else to aid recovery times from fatigue and injury. So you can take a good player, who can then train for longer, recover quicker, run faster and longer, hit harder....and suddenly a good player becomes something that little bit more special! So you gave me an example of Derry today. But take a closer result instead. Lets say, Waterford V Cork. 1 point game. Nail biting stuff. Now lets suppose 1 team had a half a dozen players on a limited PED programme. Suddenly player X can run at full pelt for the full 70+ minutes, instead of 65. Suddenly player Y on the opposing team is closed down that little bit quicker in the 71st minute, and as fatigue bites he can't get that potential levelling or game winning shot away..... THAT is where PED's affect outcomes in games, skill be damned! How's that for "subtle"? extranjero (Wexford) - Posts: 375 - 28/05/2017 23:32:50 1991676 Link
Replying To arock: "Cyclists, Boxers and Athletes are one-on-one our solo performers whether they are amateuers are not is irrelevant. There are 15 players on a GAA team the advantage is miniscule and just moral window dressing and for that a player gets pilloried, 4 year ban and become a virtual outcast, ridiculous and dangerous way to treat people." I think u miss the whole point about doping. The actual reason it was introduced was to protect participants because doping is seriously bad for your health. While your point about a team getting a very minor advantage if 1 player dopes, what about the player that is competing with the doper for that position on the team. If it gets to the stage that players feel they must dope to compete you end up like cycling, athletics, wrestling etc with participants dying in their sleep A long way from where GAA is at the moment granted but it is a lot easier to kill this at source rather than trying to fix a broken sport. Look at the state of Athletics & Cycling. Can you believe any of it??? Do you want to take a risk with GAA. Transparency is the key. Mayonman (Galway) - Posts: 1826 - 29/05/2017 09:03:38 1991711 Link
You know whats funny - when I saw a few of the people posting their opinions I laughed as I was able to remember the stance they took on a few controversial and high profile cases over the last few seasons which didn't involve their own County. In fact, I went a looking to make sure I remembered right and the hypocrisy is astounding from some. One minute they are happy to hound the amateur sportsman and for trial by media but in other cases it is just an innocent mistake and how dare anyone castigate them or tarnish their reputations. But carry on as you are - tis only an observation. Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 29/05/2017 09:52:31 1991733 Link
Replying To Offside_Rule: "You know whats funny - when I saw a few of the people posting their opinions I laughed as I was able to remember the stance they took on a few controversial and high profile cases over the last few seasons which didn't involve their own County. In fact, I went a looking to make sure I remembered right and the hypocrisy is astounding from some. One minute they are happy to hound the amateur sportsman and for trial by media but in other cases it is just an innocent mistake and how dare anyone castigate them or tarnish their reputations. But carry on as you are - tis only an observation." The neck on some posters here never ceases to amaze me. Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12116 - 29/05/2017 10:48:11 1991745 Link
Replying To Mayonman: "I think u miss the whole point about doping. The actual reason it was introduced was to protect participants because doping is seriously bad for your health. While your point about a team getting a very minor advantage if 1 player dopes, what about the player that is competing with the doper for that position on the team. If it gets to the stage that players feel they must dope to compete you end up like cycling, athletics, wrestling etc with participants dying in their sleep A long way from where GAA is at the moment granted but it is a lot easier to kill this at source rather than trying to fix a broken sport. Look at the state of Athletics & Cycling. Can you believe any of it??? Do you want to take a risk with GAA. Transparency is the key." The problem now with cycling is it's too successful in catching dopers. People equate positive tests with the whole sport being dirty, whilst ignoring the fact that cyclists are the most rigorously tested athletes on the planet, and that the UCI are actively trying to catch dopers, unlike other sports organisations, who are acutely aware of the reputational damage to a sport caused by doping infringements, and so have no interest in catching dopers in their sport. So for example, a cyclist may be caught and sanctioned for blood transfusions, but in other sports they would not, as they are not being adequately tested. Indeed, illegal blood transfusions was one of Lance Armstrongs cheating methods. Several years back the French musician Johnny Haliday mentioned in an interview how he'd go to a specialist clinic for blood transfusions, and how refreshed and energetic he'd feel after it. And who gave him the idea for such a treatment, but his good friend Zinedine Zidane.....but of course this is all innocent! There's countless other inconsistencies like this as regards differing attitudes to doping in different sports. For sure cycling has problems, but no different to any other professional sports from what I can see. extranjero (Wexford) - Posts: 375 - 29/05/2017 10:54:49 1991750 Link
My stance hasn't changed one iota since this subject first raised his head , regards the secrecy absolutely correct as long as due process has been followed, we are not as some seem to think ENTITLED to know everything from the start a lot of drug issues become soap operas like Sharapova most recently , these guys have jobs and college careers innuendo could be very harming for them , I believed that then and I believe it now , as it was a kerry player the smugness in some of the posts stink which is sad. If someone is cheating they need to dealt with , if lads are doing things to there bodies they also need to be educated, there is also a duty of care if lads start to bulk up our game is physical enough as it is. Damothedub (Dublin) - Posts: 5193 - 29/05/2017 10:56:26 1991751 Link
Replying To arock: "Cyclists, Boxers and Athletes are one-on-one our solo performers whether they are amateuers are not is irrelevant. There are 15 players on a GAA team the advantage is miniscule and just moral window dressing and for that a player gets pilloried, 4 year ban and become a virtual outcast, ridiculous and dangerous way to treat people." The advantage you or anyone else deem it to give to a player is completely irrelevant. If the substance is prohibited and you fail the test, that's the end of it. HurlingSnob (Dublin) - Posts: 220 - 29/05/2017 11:50:16 1991772 Link
I am presuming that GAA intercounty players are informed of which medications pose a risk and are told to inform their GP. Over the counter medications that breach anti-doping rules are a problem especially in relation to cough/cold/sinus/hay fever mixes. Some are ok to take but you are required to stop taking 24 hours before competition. I'm not saying this is the case with the recent Kerry incident but I do think the substance that he took should be published (not just the ingredient but the actual brand). Also as this relates to the 2016 league final, it seems an unecessary long time for the Irish Sports Anti-Doping groups to be dealing with it. Surely it could be more time efficient? kerrykerry (Kerry) - Posts: 1779 - 29/05/2017 12:26:53 1991790 Link
I have a number of concerns 1. 14/15 months after the incident it becomes public - while last yr 2 young individuals were named ( one a Monaghan lad) even before an investigation 2. He served 12 months suspension for allegedly taking something by accident - i don't buy into that, if it was an accident , come out with it and let us know, 3. Was he suspended - or was he training with the County seniors 4. Why wasn't this made public - if he's a drug cheat - name and shame - if he's innocent then he has everyone's backing...... and get his good name cleared 5, For Thomas O' Shea to come out with 'he's a great lad, from a respected family etc - that doesn't buy with me ...... either you are innocent or guilty 6. Big county mentality - if this lad was from Antrim/Wicklow /Roscommon i do believe it would have been published and made public to the media....... it is in the public's interest... it is the tax payer who is paying for the various drugs testing and the wheresabout - group.... etc 7. We need to be clean - but I do believe that certain individuals are using performace enhancing 'measures' in most counties..... we are naieve if we think that it isn't happening........... 8. By ignoring this we are sticking our head in the sand cuchulainn35 (Armagh) - Posts: 1671 - 29/05/2017 13:13:21 1991804 Link
Secrecy does no one any favours. Not the player, the GAA as a whole or the Anti Doping agency. Process should be clear. What bugs me is the timelines involved, they don't add up. Maybe there was a reporting inaccuracy causing the confusion but as it stands the following is being reported: February 2017 One pending anti doping case (this case) according to Anti Doping Agency May 2017 Player has served his suspension according to Kerry County Board May 2017 Anti Doping Agency hopes to have its written decision completed in next few weeks Ban is reported as being for 6 months. How can you be banned before the written decision??? If the ban was implemented in Feb how is it already served??? And as I said before this does the player involved no favours Mayonman (Galway) - Posts: 1826 - 29/05/2017 14:07:04 1991825 Link
Seems our Dermo isn't the only man capable of appealing to the max! http://m.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/sport-ireland-confirm-that-kerry-footballer-brendan-osullivan-tested-positive-for-a-banned-stimulant-35766914.html Jackeen (Dublin) - Posts: 4097 - 29/05/2017 14:44:01 1991840 Link