HoganStand GAA Football and Hurling

National Forum

Timing of substitutions

(Oldest Posts First)

You need to Login to Post

With many goalkeepers now taking quick kick-outs it has become apparent that managers are timing the introduction of subs to disrupt the opposition kick-out, the ball regularly being returned to the goalie for a retake of the kick-out to facilitate the introduction of a sub. These stoppages add nothing to the game as a spectacle. Surely in inter-county games where there is always a fourth official this official should take full responsibility for the introduction of subs and the withdrawal of the substituted player, no need for the game to stop. Very frustrating when a well placed kick-out has to be retaken because of this cynical tactic. sligo joe (Dublin) - Posts: 674 - 13/02/2017 14:59:33 1956186 Link
Replying To sligo joe: "With many goalkeepers now taking quick kick-outs it has become apparent that managers are timing the introduction of subs to disrupt the opposition kick-out, the ball regularly being returned to the goalie for a retake of the kick-out to facilitate the introduction of a sub. These stoppages add nothing to the game as a spectacle. Surely in inter-county games where there is always a fourth official this official should take full responsibility for the introduction of subs and the withdrawal of the substituted player, no need for the game to stop. Very frustrating when a well placed kick-out has to be retaken because of this cynical tactic." You be suprised how long it takes for a sub and how you described it is way over top Dellboypolecat (Tyrone) - Posts: 15069 - 13/02/2017 15:16:55 1956197 Link
Jim Gavin is a master of this, in the drawn game v Mayo last September every time Clarke was taking a quick kick out well into the 2nd half a Dublin sub appeared in the sideline wanting to come on, the ref delayed the kick out to allow the sub to come on and by the time the ref restarted the game every Mayo player was marked by a Dublin player, it is allowed within the rules of the game and Gavin isn't breaking any rules, if the GAA want to stop this then they have to change the rules stating that a sub who wants to come on at a kick out can only come on when it's your goalie taking a kick out not your opponent. The same kind of tactics happen when a team is winning near the end where players seem to drop when a gust of wind hits them or start bringing on subs to break the cycle of the game and break opponents concentration. I can't see it ever changing and I'd do the same if I were manager of a team riverboys (Mayo) - Posts: 1389 - 13/02/2017 15:27:08 1956210 Link
As it stands, there is not a 4th official. Therefore the only opportunity to make a sub is when the ball goes out of play. That would mean a 45, sideline ball, kickout or free. It would be interesting to see a breakdown of stats on when subs happen most frequently from above list. Is it cynical? Probably more tactically astute than cynical. No less cynical than running down clock with slow free taking. But that could be seen as tactical too. Donegalman (None) - Posts: 3830 - 13/02/2017 15:38:08 1956223 Link
Replying To Donegalman: "As it stands, there is not a 4th official. Therefore the only opportunity to make a sub is when the ball goes out of play. That would mean a 45, sideline ball, kickout or free. It would be interesting to see a breakdown of stats on when subs happen most frequently from above list. Is it cynical? Probably more tactically astute than cynical. No less cynical than running down clock with slow free taking. But that could be seen as tactical too." Ok Donegalman, I used wrong terminology, the official term is Sideline Official and according to the Official Guide and the Referee's Handbook "A Sideline Official shall officiate at all senior inter-county games" his duties include recording full and temporary substitutions and displaying the numbers of same, and also to display the amount of added time to be played. I'm just suggesting that if he was given full control of substitutions without the need to stop play it would put a stop to the situation where the ball has to be returned to the goalie to retake the kick-out. I would welcome any tweaking of the rules that prevents tactical stoppages but I believe that this is one that could be eradicated quite easily. sligo joe (Dublin) - Posts: 674 - 13/02/2017 16:11:57 1956240 Link
Is this topic for real? Checkers (UK) - Posts: 24 - 13/02/2017 16:40:36 1956261 Link
Replying To Donegalman: "As it stands, there is not a 4th official. Therefore the only opportunity to make a sub is when the ball goes out of play. That would mean a 45, sideline ball, kickout or free. It would be interesting to see a breakdown of stats on when subs happen most frequently from above list. Is it cynical? Probably more tactically astute than cynical. No less cynical than running down clock with slow free taking. But that could be seen as tactical too." I'd imagine quickest would be when most substitutions take place as there are more quickest then any other form of dead ball in the majority of games. gotmilk (Fermanagh) - Posts: 4971 - 13/02/2017 16:50:51 1956267 Link
I didn't mean sideline official, I meant 4th official. 2 linesmen and a ref. Outside of this we are starting to count umpires and match stewards which is counter intuitive. My main point is that subs are put on at tactical times the same way that free kicks are taken slowly, tactical also. Donegalman (None) - Posts: 3830 - 13/02/2017 16:58:28 1956270 Link
Replying To gotmilk: "I'd imagine quickest would be when most substitutions take place as there are more quickest then any other form of dead ball in the majority of games." Not quickest, i meant most. gotmilk (Fermanagh) - Posts: 4971 - 13/02/2017 17:19:05 1956282 Link
The team that is winning will always try to come up with ways to break up the momentum of the chasing team and also try to run the clock down. I'm sure I heard Tomas O'Shea, when commenting on a team that let a lead slip over the last few minutes, that it wouldn't have happened with them as they would have caused a 'flare-up' to break the game up and stop the momentum of the other team. If there was an area marked out close to the dug out and management could only sub a player after had to moved into that area, in the course of play, it would speed up the change over process and cut down on 'the long, slow, walk across the field. It would be simply a matter of the player stepping over the side-line and his replacement doing likewise. As the ref would have been informed through his ear phone, it would simply be a waving on process and not require the game to be stopped. neverright (Roscommon) - Posts: 1648 - 13/02/2017 19:53:14 1956352 Link
Replying To neverright: "The team that is winning will always try to come up with ways to break up the momentum of the chasing team and also try to run the clock down. I'm sure I heard Tomas O'Shea, when commenting on a team that let a lead slip over the last few minutes, that it wouldn't have happened with them as they would have caused a 'flare-up' to break the game up and stop the momentum of the other team. If there was an area marked out close to the dug out and management could only sub a player after had to moved into that area, in the course of play, it would speed up the change over process and cut down on 'the long, slow, walk across the field. It would be simply a matter of the player stepping over the side-line and his replacement doing likewise. As the ref would have been informed through his ear phone, it would simply be a waving on process and not require the game to be stopped." sick of these rediculous substitutions in injury time to run down the clock..all very well saying the time can be added on but it breaks concentration and momentum..no subs should be allowed in injury time, impose the cards correctly and no hassle if a fellah clocks the star player of the other team, give the aggressor a straight red for it..should substitutions be allowed, posession should be given to the opposite team, either from goal keeper or half way etc..see then if you are a point up and offer to make a sub, you hand over posession the other team..that would work... Fairplayalways (Offaly) - Posts: 1034 - 14/02/2017 16:52:46 1956730 Link
we just need the officials to do their job properly. that would solve most issues during games. s goldrick (Cavan) - Posts: 5518 - 15/02/2017 13:46:05 1957088 Link