There's no promotion of hurling yet 70 million is being spent on Pairc Ui Chaoimh. I know its not all GAA money but even still it's crazy money. If they spent even half that there would be a lot left over for the promotion of hurling. There are six counties that have a good foundation to build upon. Laois Westmeath Offaly Kerry Carlow Antrim but they need to be helped along. Come All Ireland final day it will all be forgotten about as the GAA bask in all their glory. They don't want to expand the game.

crikey (Australia) - Posts: 355 - 07/07/2015 09:58:22    1748987

Royaldunne, if hurling is so "boring", why is there always a massive reaction when it's showcased to foreigners? Take that plank off your shoulder, lad.

Something "football people" should remember is hurling is a higher-scoring game than football. A 10 point win in football is a hammering while may have been quite a competitive hurling game.

Something else "football people" complain about in football is the lack of 50/50 one-on-one duels in the modern game & an over-reliance on the handpass. Now those same people want to see more of that in hurling???

As for the hurling championship not being competitive enough so far, you'd have to look at Wexford, Dublin, Limerick, Offaly, Antrim & maybe Cork and suggest they themselves need to reassess their preparations because they appear to have gone backwards. Kilkenny, Tipperary, Waterford & Galway have all upped their performances & Laois & Westmeath have made progress.

keeper7 (Longford) - Posts: 4088 - 07/07/2015 11:36:25    1749088

football first
County: All
Posts: 930

1748238
Hurling has a serious problem with the lack of competitiveness. In this weekend's qualifiers, there was was average winning margin of greater than 12 points - the result was never in doubt in any of the games. Many games have become a series of rucks, before one team manages to extricate the sliotar and belt it aimlessly down the field.

I think the game suffers from the lack of any serious analysis of playing styles in the media. Analysis based on cliches actually masks serious problems in the game. For example, overcarrying is endemic: the four-step rule is routinely ignored, and any ref who actually tries to apply the rules on personal fouls is generally criticized for "not letting the game flow".

You make some good points. I completely disagree with the belting the ball aimlessly down the field.

You are right about the rucks though. They are ugly. Ultimately certain skills are barely seen in hurling these days. If a fella tries to double on the ball in the air, pull on the ground etc he will be dragged off immediately. It is all about possession - you must catch in the air and you must control on the ground. Obviously as the opposition you don't want them to do either. The go to ways of stopping catch the ball in the air is to push down/flick up on the helmet if you are standing behind. To stop them controlling the ball on the ground, you grab their hand until they fumble the ball. This is what leads to endless amounts of rucks.

Hurling is definitely every bit as cynical as football and always has been.

Not to be all negative. We still have fantastic skills. Hooking, blocking, striking on the turn, sidelines from distance. All-Ireland finals are still brilliant..

bennybunny (Cork) - Posts: 3917 - 07/07/2015 12:24:25    1749139

Hurling can never be boring, the skill level will always take the breath away.

realdub (Dublin) - Posts: 8597 - 07/07/2015 13:05:34    1749175

Hurling is the best of the Gaelic games by a mile. I know most of ye are sick to death of watching Kilkenny dominate hurling year after year but what are they meant to do about it? Sure you dont hear the soccer fans complaining about their game...

mayo_hurler (Mayo) - Posts: 113 - 07/07/2015 13:18:50    1749187

realdub
County: Dublin
Posts: 4887

1749175 Hurling can never be boring, the skill level will always take the breath away.
______________

Very well said

It's more to do with competitiveness

Just like the football... it's the same counties year in year out

Although there's been a better spread of AI's won in the Football since 2010

It's still the same teams looking to win it

Hurling is a truly great game like football but structurally both codes need work

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20601 - 07/07/2015 13:28:14    1749195

jimbodub agree more teams have won in the football but as a % of teams in the championship Hurling is very close

DoireCityFC (Derry) - Posts: 1580 - 07/07/2015 13:35:31    1749200

the 2013/2014 hurling finals boring???!! ffs they were the two best sporting spectacles for the last 2 years.sundays leinster final ?joe cannings classic goal? tj reids exhibition of score taking? would you rather watch a borefest ireland 0 england 0 ?? in every competition there will be a lot of one sided matches,its the nature of sport..and for what its worth tipp will win all ire this year

kavvie (Clare) - Posts: 505 - 07/07/2015 13:48:16    1749211

It goes in cycles I suppose. Hurling was very good last year and to a lesser extent the year before, wheras football was poor enough until the semi-finals. There have been many a year when football has been better than hurling though.

Hurling has been very poor this year, it has been very easy to predict most games beforehand and there have been no shocks (Laois beating Offaly wasn't a shock). There hasn't been any big shocks in fotball either I suppose, apart from Antrim beating Laois maybe, (Wexford beating Down was a surprise but not a huge shock and they will give Derry a game too) but the potential for shocks is always bigger in football, and that why it will generate more interest overall.

Hurling is heading towards the inevitable winner being Kilkenny or Tipp final whereas in football Dublin are ahead but could be caught by Donegal/Kerry/Cork/Mayo who in turn could be caught Monaghan.

county man (Limerick) - Posts: 1102 - 07/07/2015 13:52:55    1749216

Gaelic Football isnt a truely 'great' game. Lets get real here on this Tuesday afternoon. As ball games go its pretty average. Id rate it after soccer,rugby, aussie rules,rugby league and basketball. But its better than Olympic Handball and netball and volleyball. The game has no proper tackle. Its stuck between soccer and rugby. The sooner guys can tackle around the waist below the shoulders the better. The black card nonsense is making it worse aswell. Either that or be a whole lot more liberal with the shoulder tackle. Look at Lacrosse ...hurling could look at Lacrosse too by the way. They have a great shoulder tackle.

BanTarleton (Clare) - Posts: 181 - 07/07/2015 14:09:55    1749241

Galway were clueless but a team like Waterford I reckon would take the cats unless they let the occasion get to them. Tipp or Cork would have a very good chance too.

Cork would get eaten alive by Kilkenny.

Marooned (Galway) - Posts: 2224 - 07/07/2015 14:19:51    1749255

haha its funny i stated most of this as the debate about football needing two tiers was raging
that we had last year as many one sided games in hurling and will this year
and was told that they were one off games
that the top 8 teams were all of the same level and ability and can beat each other on any given day
amazing how opinions change in a few short weeks

hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 07/07/2015 14:20:02    1749256

My opinion on hurling never varies.Brilliant game,and yes Kilkenny have been hugely dominant over the last 10-15 years.It is the greatest team in GAA history,lets not forget.But theyve had tough games most years.Who knows when their dominance may end?But i enjoy watching them.They are a credit to the sport.Even when they dish out a hammering,i enjoy watching it.And yes hill,the top 8 teams can beat each other on any given day.The remaining 8 games in the championship will all be great occasions.A team may win well in the end,but most games are hard to call before throw in.Unlike a lot of football games,where the result is known beforehand.

cuederocket (Dublin) - Posts: 5084 - 07/07/2015 14:38:58    1749279

football has 4 main contenders to win the championship in everybody eyes
dublin,kerry,donegal and mayo
hurling has 2 main contenders to win the championship in everybodys eyes
kilkenny and tipperary

football has 2 seeking to break into that 4 to challenge in everybodys eyes
cork and monaghan
hurling has 1 seeking to break into that 2 to challenge in everybodys eyes
waterford

football then has a group who can beat each other below
tyrone,meath,westmeath,roscommon,tipperary,armagh,derry,galway
hurling then has a roup who can beat each other below
cork,galway,limerick,dublin,clare

I fail to see where people can say hurling has far more even and competitive teams meeting?

hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 07/07/2015 15:52:57    1749347

Can someone from these counties tell me a bit more about the state of hurling in their county - westmeath, laois, offaly, kerry, Carlow and Antrim.

I would say that Dublin, the 5 munster teams, KK, galway and now wexford are all competing well underage and while westmeath and carlow have managed the odd result underage they need more success at minor and under-21. Actually my own county probably has the most serious underage problems of these elite counties...

So in the 6 counties above, how many gaa clubs are there? How many play hurling? What grades are the clubs at?I think a county with 20 hurling clubs competing in competitive junior, intermediate and senior hurling should be able to churn out decent underage teams on a consistent basis. There are surely 20 clubs in each of these counties. While a competitive club scene is crucial, offaly shows that that is not everything. The comparison was made by cheddar plunkett on radio 1 again the other night saying that there are so many full time gaa coaches in dublin (60 I think) and only 4 in dublin. Surely it's not beyond the GAA to come up with a system whereby resources can be put into the areas that need them most - not having a go off dublin, as cheddar said, their success at every level shows that their system is working. So if resources can be put into laois in a way that would impact them in a very real way like someone competent appointed to oversee training schools, a collective colleges team put together like dublin and waterford have done in the past and an objective to contest an under15 schools leinster final or whatever set and reports back to a hurling committee as to how these aims are being met or not.
The hardest part about spreading a sport is receiving goodwill and getting volunteers. I would think that there are plenty of people in laois who are happy to give up two hours a week toward helping out but you need competent people overseeing how things are implemented and to drive it on and to demand results, resources and the cooperation of all clubs. You can't force clubs to play but from my experience people are pretty open to at least allowing coaches to visit and to spread the good word.
KK's dominance and offaly's decline are depressing but I don't think they are a sign of the times in general. I think we are playing a higher standard all the time, driven on by tipp and KK and that several counties would be close to breaking into the elite if they were simply given that extra coordination and investment from a hurling ccommittee and hurling officers in each of the counties.

hurlinspuds (Cork) - Posts: 1494 - 07/07/2015 16:48:33    1749395

Hurling has only 14 counties competing for the All Ire,and 6 of these are gone quite early- Carlow,Antrim,Laois,Westmeath,Offaly,Wexford.The remaining 8 counties are all good teams,capable of beating each other.Its dissapointing how far back Offaly have fallen.Wexford have some good U21 teams over last 3 years,so there is plenty of optimism their.Its sad for me to say,but i dont think Carlow,Laois or Westmeath are of the same standard as the other 8 big boys.
In football,we have 33 teams,with basically half of them not having much hope of provincial honours - London,New York,Waterford,Limerick,Carlow,Leitrim,Wicklow,Louth,Antrim,Longford,Tipperary,Wexford,Fermanagh,Clare,Westmeath(wait till Sunday),Cavan,Laois.Thats a lot of counties,and every year quite a few of them will get beaten out the gate.The odd time,they will come with a good team like Cavan & Tipp lately,but theyve still not even got to a provincial final.It is all to predictable for the first few months.From the quarter finals on,its quite entertaining,with teams of a similiar standard going head to head.But the provincials are,in the main,a borefest.
I like hurling & football equally,2 great games that make every summer pass so quickly.The structures are far from perfect though,and change seems to happen at a snails pace.If it happens at all.Until it does,well just have to make do with what we have.Warts 'n all.

cuederocket (Dublin) - Posts: 5084 - 07/07/2015 17:05:19    1749413

Hurling spuds.

I am not from Carlow but I know they have only about 18 teams in total (over half of them would be clubs second teams). I think they have 8/9 clubs that play hurling (Mount Leinster, Erins Own, Naomh Eoin, Naomh Brid, Balinkillen, St Mullins, Carlow Town, Palatine and Tullow - I think that is all they have). Ultimately they have less teams and clubs to pick from then the Carrigdhoun division in Cork (and that is one of our smaller divisions). They are massively punching above their wait.

bennybunny (Cork) - Posts: 3917 - 07/07/2015 17:13:20    1749416

Thanks bennybunny. I just had a google there and it seems from the carlow website that they have 28 clubs. It's not easy to see how many play hurling at adult or juvenile level.

Other initiatives that may help counties like carlow are to create divisional teams across clubs to compete at whatever level.
If you joined two football only clubs together and trained the juveniles of those clubs together then a long term aim could be put in place to have a new adult team competing in 10 years time. Results don't come about overnight.
Another one has already been done to a certain extent, adult and juvenile teams competing in KK underage. Competing in a 'b' competition even in kk is better craic than playing the same 3 clubs over and over and the standard is probably much higher.

hurlinspuds (Cork) - Posts: 1494 - 07/07/2015 17:51:55    1749445

cuederocket
County: Dublin
Posts: 2413

1749413
Hurling has only 14 counties competing for the All Ire,and 6 of these are gone quite early- Carlow,Antrim,Laois,Westmeath,Offaly,Wexford.The remaining 8 counties are all good teams,capable of beating each other.Its dissapointing how far back Offaly have fallen.Wexford have some good U21 teams over last 3 years,so there is plenty of optimism their.Its sad for me to say,but i dont think Carlow,Laois or Westmeath are of the same standard as the other 8 big boys.
In football,we have 33 teams,with basically half of them not having much hope of provincial honours - London,New York,Waterford,Limerick,Carlow,Leitrim,Wicklow,Louth,Antrim,Longford,Tipperary,Wexford,Fermanagh,Clare,Westmeath(wait till Sunday),Cavan,Laois.Thats a lot of counties,and every year quite a few of them will get beaten out the gate.The odd time,they will come with a good team like Cavan & Tipp lately,but theyve still not even got to a provincial final.It is all to predictable for the first few months.From the quarter finals on,its quite entertaining,with teams of a similiar standard going head to head.But the provincials are,in the main,a borefest.
I like hurling & football equally,2 great games that make every summer pass so quickly.The structures are far from perfect though,and change seems to happen at a snails pace.If it happens at all.Until it does,well just have to make do with what we have.Warts 'n all.


kilkenny have won 16 out of the last 19 leinster championships
so you can hardly complain that half of the 32 in football havent a chance of winning a provincial.
that leaves nearly everybody in leinster without a hope in hurling
we have won one in 70 something years like and we would be considered one of the main contenders.

hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 07/07/2015 18:37:05    1749467

Yes Jimbo I agree with that!

realdub (Dublin) - Posts: 8597 - 07/07/2015 18:44:56    1749471