Tyrone don't have the players of the 00s anymore.
They have to play a game that makes them competitive and this is it.
I see little difference between them Armagh or Donegal.
Dublin lucky to get out with a draw in the end.

westkerry (Kerry) - Posts: 1250 - 08/03/2015 10:01:09    1700236

Tyrone committed 6 fouls and no bookings. That is virtually as clean a game of football as you can possibly play. No fouling, no cynicism, nothing nasty. (By comparison, Dublin committed 26 fouls and had several yellow cards.) Now, pulling 15 men behind the ball, a tactic we also used in the last 2 games, is not something that I enjoy watching, and I don't think that it will ultimately win us anything. However, it's Mickey Harte's prerogative to use such tactics and, if his side plays within the rules, it seems unfair to portray it as some death knell for football.
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I don't think it's unfair at all. Football is about entertainment and we all pay good money into games to be entertained. Both Donegal and Tyrone came to Croke Park and threw 15 fellas in their own 45 from the first min. Both claim that they do this because they don't have the players to play football. I will be interested to see how Derry and Monaghan approach the game when we play them. Is this truly a province wide tactic now to stop teams? On the foul count, I will reserve judgment until I see this on TV but at the match it appeared as though every time a Tyrone player got inside the Dublin 45 and a Dublin player put a hand on him, he went to ground for the kickable free. Again I will reserve judgement on that one but Dublin players had three defenders around them all of the time and were not hitting the deck. On the plus side for Tyrone they were well organised and very fit, fitter than Dublin. Dublin on the other hand, very worryingly, had no plan. So much for the lessons learned in last year's semi, we looked clueless, also probably the worst I've seen us play, executing the basics, in a long time.

It's not going to be any easier in Castlebar next week. We need a couple of wins now to stay up.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4700 - 08/03/2015 10:02:39    1700237

Great game. Much improved Tyrone

IsMise (Tyrone) - Posts: 119 - 08/03/2015 10:05:51    1700238

West Kerry tryin to out psych again. Kerry did what it takes to beat Donegal They always do just whatever it takes rules or no.
Design and organisation will win every time over formless art in shootout mode. The days of standing back admiring the Kingdom cos they are not to be challenged are gone since 2003 so too with Dublin. Wake up smell the coffee Good defence is a joy to behold too

cjx (Tyrone) - Posts: 270 - 08/03/2015 10:57:06    1700253

In boxing terms , its like one boxer after a lot of losses decides to stay in the corner all night with his gloves covering his face and hopes the other lad tires of trying to hit him and eventuslly will catch him with a few sneaky ones on the counter. It works in one fight and then other average boxers decide to try the same and while they dont win their fights its only on points that they lose and they dont get knocked out . Its easier to implement than tring to train to be skillfull but sadly other skillfull Boxers start doing the same. Ali got sucker punched to it last year , but hopefully this year he will have learned and these sparring sessions are only a rope a dope ;)

AthCliath (Dublin) - Posts: 4347 - 08/03/2015 11:23:23    1700260

Where does Joxer live? we have an amateur game played for joy the fact that he or she or anyone pays is incidential.This is not for him it is for the game. The paying customer is irrelevant to GAA in many ways as GAA is not simply or primarily a commercial entity. The gate mnoney is only a donation to keep the games developing and development in defence must be countered by development in attack that will and is happening Just becuse Jim Gavin clearly has not got a clue how to go about that development is the problem for Dublin and to the benefit of the rest of us now even if it is not to the benefit of game in the longer term. Others, not Gavin, will crack the attacking developments we need and that I await with interest; as I do the return of Colm Cooper.

cjx (Tyrone) - Posts: 270 - 08/03/2015 11:30:12    1700261

Joxer. You seem worried that Dublin had no plan. You also seem puzzled by the free count.

I can assure you there is an answer to both. Dublin's plan was clearly to foul Tyrone players breaking out of defence to stop quick counter attacks.

I'm not having a go at Dublin but that certainly looked like a pre-planned tactic on the night.

I wouldn't anticipate this will be highlighted on the highlights programme tonight so if you want to see it ye should watch the full game which will be repeated on setanta I think.

tyroneed (Tyrone) - Posts: 753 - 08/03/2015 11:36:17    1700264

CJX you are spot on, we learned that in 2013 when we shipped a awful score against the Dubs.

The difference is we have the forwards along with defence,
Tyrone can defend with 15 guys but you don't have a marque forward like us or Dublin.

We did not put 15 guys behind the ball against Donegal, we kept are shape and didn't break up in huge numbers.

Finally I don't think Dublin or Kerry need to learn anything from Tyrone as soon as you start winning you are quick
enough to tell everyone that you reinvented the wheel.

westkerry (Kerry) - Posts: 1250 - 08/03/2015 12:05:13    1700273

tyroneed
County: Tyrone
Posts: 480

1700264
Joxer. You seem worried that Dublin had no plan. You also seem puzzled by the free count.

I can assure you there is an answer to both. Dublin's plan was clearly to foul Tyrone players breaking out of defence to stop quick counter attacks.

I'm not having a go at Dublin but that certainly looked like a pre-planned tactic on the night.

I wouldn't anticipate this will be highlighted on the highlights programme tonight so if you want to see it ye should watch the full game which will be repeated on setanta I think.
----
Indeed I do inttend to watch the full game again, although real rugby league over on Sky seems more attractive. It just seems extraordinary that Tyrone players only seemed to go down inside the Dublin 45 when a slight player such as McCaffrey laid a hand on a giant like Cavanagh for example.

As for the other Tyrone poster claiming that this is not supposed to be entertainment, you've certainly got that right buddy. If that's the kind of muck you are paying into Omagh to see then I would start asking for a refund. I have news for you, the GAA is a large corporate business. Go figure.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4700 - 08/03/2015 12:11:09    1700275

So Dublin very lucky to come away with the draw and Tyrone deserving of the 2 points. Not the same take on the match as a few of the Dubs on here but we have to trust the media - right lads?

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 08/03/2015 12:14:21    1700276

This ultra defensive system is not for the betterment of the game or joyous to watch and it will not be counteracted in the near future because of its simplicity and will only encourage other teams to employ similar game plan. Underage teams playing this stuff also means it is probably here to stay. Mores the pity because it is desperate to watch and will put people of attending games that are likely to serve this up.

Dubh_linn (Dublin) - Posts: 2312 - 08/03/2015 12:37:57    1700285

Dublin didn't play well......we get that.

Tyrone played negative football. If Dublins tactic was to foul Tyrone coming out of defence, they weren't that good at it! However, Tyrone players threw themselves to the ground at every contact inside Dublins 45. Some will say that's cheating, but they were rewarded for it. The ref was poor, gave them a free every time they went down.

I don't blame Tyrone on this, I blame the ref.

The irony was Dublin were trying to break the Tyrone lines, and getting dragged, fouled and tripped.... The ref didn't seem interested in awarding Dublin frees. Dublin players were trying to stay on their feet.

The referee had his whistle in his mouth when Tyrone were attacking.......he had his whistle in his hand when Dublin were attacking.

The blanket 13 man defence works against attacking teams if you have a poor referee. If the ref had given Dublin the frees Tyrone were getting, Dublin would have been out of sight!

At the moment, negative football gets rewarded against Dublin.

The elephant in the room when dealing with the Donegal template is the lack of effective officiating.

JayP (Dublin) - Posts: 1772 - 08/03/2015 12:50:20    1700287

Joxer spoofing the same patronizing rubbish for the past few years , the biggest recipients of this 'corporation ' are the Dubs , handed every advantage the organisation has had to offer and some are still complaining . Not most Dublin fans are like this - thankfully . Good point for Tyrone !

TheRightStuff (Donegal) - Posts: 1688 - 08/03/2015 13:09:47    1700293

what a great game of football and the best tyrone display in ages...it was such an intriguing game with end to end football and excellent defending displays from both teams...contrast this with the borefest of a hurling game...56 scores..and hardly a tackle put in...tyrone were superb in the tackle and then running at dublin at pace caused them all sorts of problems...tyrone actually played 14 men behind the ball (not 15)...dublin only ever left two men in attack when defending so it wasn't just one team using defensive cover...the quality of defending was excellent particularly from tyrone..dublins tactic in the second half of dragging tyroe men to the ground when coming out of defence was obviously decided at half time...so much for gavin and his "pure" football...peter harte and mattie donnelly had outstanding games..

mayotyroneman (Tyrone) - Posts: 1821 - 08/03/2015 13:16:09    1700295

TheRightStuff
County: Donegal
Posts: 520

1700293
Joxer spoofing the same patronizing rubbish for the past few years , the biggest recipients of this 'corporation ' are the Dubs , handed every advantage the organisation has had to offer and some are still complaining . Not most Dublin fans are like this - thankfully . Good point for Tyrone !

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Still an apologist I see TRS. Oh and by the way, who is by far the biggest contributor to the corporation? Just saying.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4700 - 08/03/2015 13:27:58    1700297

Well im glad i was in pt last night, by sounds of it the dubs Tyrone game was a disaster.
A game of football was played in navan, not rugby.

royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 08/03/2015 13:35:18    1700298

AthCliath
County: Dublin
Posts: 3570

1700260
In boxing terms , its like one boxer after a lot of losses decides to stay in the corner all night with his gloves covering his face and hopes the other lad tires of trying to hit him and eventuslly will catch him with a few sneaky ones on the counter. It works in one fight and then other average boxers decide to try the same and while they dont win their fights its only on points that they lose and they dont get knocked out . Its easier to implement than tring to train to be skillfull but sadly other skillfull Boxers start doing the same. Ali got sucker punched to it last year , but hopefully this year he will have learned and these sparring sessions are only a rope a dope ;)



Tell that to floyd mayweather :).

duke_raul (Tyrone) - Posts: 993 - 08/03/2015 13:47:57    1700303

These defensive tactics have been introduced because of a win at all costs mentality... professionalism. Many will say that players aren't being paid and that the game is still amateur. That may be the case but are the managers amateur? They are the people who call the shots.
I'm afraid this is how it will be for the forseeable future unless crowd numbers collapse or some other unforeseen circumstance force the hands of the powers that be.
Some counties are more defensive than others and some more successful at using the tactic than others. Some non-Ulster counties supporters have claimed the high moral ground and claim they aren't defensive but that is only because they have a policy of fouling opponents in midfield every time they threaten an attack - they don't need a blanket defence.

When you have professionalism/professional attitudes you will always have some teams set up defensively. It all depends on the philosophy of the manager and the personnel available. Look at soccer where some teams are known as being defensively minded. It is just a fact of life. Other teams know what they will be faced with and its up to them to break the syatem down.

Rugby is now going down the same defensive road to the extent that they are thinking of changing the rules to reward attacking play.

Maybe that's the way the GAA should be thinking of going?

As far as Tyrone are concerned they are adopting a style that suits the personnel presently available. It does seem that there is now a plan which is progress.

BIG SACKS (Tyrone) - Posts: 1681 - 08/03/2015 13:51:55    1700307

Big Sacks.....

Agree with what you said there. Teams are gonna cut their cloth accordingly of course.

Reward attacking play...... But that was the most disappointing part about last nights game. Dublin tried time and time to break the lines and poor reffing, not giving blatant fouls meant Dublin could not get ahead on the scoreboard. Tyrone went down very easily and the ref awarded frees.

If refs won't reward attacking play what chance has the game got?

Like I know every fan supports their county etc, but Tyrone fouled constantly. And the ref just let them. What's clear is there is a fear, because of the anti Dublin sentiment at the moment, a fear of giving Dublin decisions as the media will say "The refs want Dublin to win....the GAA want Dublin to win, Dublin will win everything etc."

So the most attacking team of our current era and penalised for playing a brand of football easy on the eye...... And the officiating is so biased against them. Like fans will start voting with their feet.

JayP (Dublin) - Posts: 1772 - 08/03/2015 14:35:36    1700318

JayP
County: Dublin
Posts: 1022

1700318
Big Sacks.....

Agree with what you said there. Teams are gonna cut their cloth accordingly of course.

Reward attacking play...... But that was the most disappointing part about last nights game. Dublin tried time and time to break the lines and poor reffing, not giving blatant fouls meant Dublin could not get ahead on the scoreboard. Tyrone went down very easily and the ref awarded frees.

If refs won't reward attacking play what chance has the game got?

Like I know every fan supports their county etc, but Tyrone fouled constantly. And the ref just let them. What's clear is there is a fear, because of the anti Dublin sentiment at the moment, a fear of giving Dublin decisions as the media will say "The refs want Dublin to win....the GAA want Dublin to win, Dublin will win everything etc."

So the most attacking team of our current era and penalised for playing a brand of football easy on the eye...... And the officiating is so biased against them. Like fans will start voting with their feet.

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Agree with all of this and all of what Big Sacks said. Crowd numbers will begin to dwindle however, no doubt. If a Tyrone man above says that this is the most defensive that he has ever seen them setup then we know what the future holds. Last night will be viewed as a 'success' and that's the scary thing. More of the same to come. Other teams, Dublin included, will be forced to adapt. You can get past 15 defenders in such a small space as the opposition 45 area kick passing. You would be defying the laws of physics otherwise.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4700 - 08/03/2015 15:02:17    1700335