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Replying To beano: "Its good to see you have such a good memory to remember something posted anonymously online a few years ago. You must have a lot of time on your hands.
And how am I displaying a 'kick them when they are down' mentality, especially when just yesterday evening someone else on here claimed that we're essentially a Joe McDonagh level team? In fact, I was very measured in my post-game comment yesterday and didn't stick the knife into anyone in particular.
But the truth is, being five up in injury-time, and even responding to one sucker-punch goal with an immediate point, but still not managing to hold on for the win, isn't good enough. Just like losing to Westmeath last year (in similar circumstances) was depolarable. That is a fact.
My initial point still stands, we took more stock from beating KK the last two years when defeat in those two games didn't define their season in the slightest. That is a fact too. I may have got mixed-up in how the other results went, fair enough, but then again I clearly don't have the same memory as your almighty self. I was looking at how our immediate positive result vs KK affected both parties- and they have won the last two Leinster titles despite losing to us. Again, a fact.
Ever feel like your talking to a brick wall?" Well it was hard to forget given it was the most digusting, needless and below the belt comment I've probably ever read here. Don't worry I've plenty going on in my life but pots and kettles when it comes to needless digs.
I replied to that poster and told them its a wiff of those lads who call in on Talksport giving out about there PL team. I agree 100% not closing out the game yesterday was unforgivable, please read back the comments and tell me where I said anything otherwise? I've said myself before the Westmeath game last year was unacceptable anyone who thinks otherwise is living on another planet. I honestly don't know 1 person who taught we had a good year because we bet KK, all I know is people who taught we had a bad year because of last day situation we ended up in and I'm in that camp too. I'm still completely baffled how you think little was on the line for KK in 2022 when a defeat meant they were totally reliant on Galway doing them a favour v Dublin. What showed your true colours and kick them when your down mentality was your needless efforts to play down the KK wins since 2018, claimed only 1 game KK needed to win out of 4 when infact it was the other way around. You tripped yourself up due to your trigger happy approach.
Thanks I do have a good memory, 1 of the few things I'm useful for, your not talking to brick wall, you just posted alot of inaccurate information today, got challenged on it and now here we are.
TerribleFootwork (Wexford) - Posts: 1760 - 22/04/2024 13:53:06
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Replying To wexford2012: "Liam griffin has in the past spoken about 'hurling being a way of life' well Last year when we played Kilkenny this never to me felt more visceral, more intense, more real as if that way of life was hanging by a thread. Maybe it was just me but that day felt like we were all stepping into the area, that we would as supporters go above and beyond, cheer, barrack, clap, hoot and hollower - yes weren't on the pitch but we would be that oft spoken about '16th man.'
In marked contrast yesterday in Wexford park the atmosphere was muted, it didn't feel like championship, I don't think there was a single 'Wexford, Wexford chant' which was strange.
I realise I am stepping on dangerous ground as people reacted strongly last year when the county chairman pointed the poor Wexford support being a part of the reason our u20s lost to Offaly in Carlow but I believed at the time he was right and still do.
This sense prompted me to check what research has to tell us and
"One study found that when athletes receive frequent encouragement, effort levels increased by up to 7%. Performing in front of a crowd can also provide a positive distraction from fatigue. Focusing on the crowd and thriving off their atmosphere and energy has been demonstrated to be an effective strategy to help athletes when they are tiring and about to 'hit the wall'."
This article went onto talk about visual aids/stimulus saying:
"Fans often use visual aids flags, banners, etc Visual representations of encouragement can be used to create an atmosphere that influences athletes both physically and psychologically. In fact, it has been found to help boost the physical strength of athletes by up to 8%. This effect was most apparent during high intensity performances, which makes it the perfect strategy for the World Cup."
So please don't get me wrong I'm not blaming supporters but do want to explore something. In post-match analysis yesterday many people I spoke to felt there missing in Wexford, that as a county, despite huge passion, we keep suffering big collapses. You don't see this with the other serious hurling counties. This is bigger than one group of players, bigger than any manager, even bigger than the county board members. We have not won a minor all Ireland since 1968 - 56 years…or even appeared in one since 1985 (39 years). Why is this?
At senior level I believe we suffered significant psychological damage that persists to this day, from the hammers Brian Cody's Kilkenny meted out to us, at some level this is impacting teams to this day. We lack confidence, lack belief, lack real ambition or expectation. Yes, we latch onto any scrape of success but we go from high to low, hero to zero, we're either winning the all-Ireland or we're the worst team in history - we have little ability as a county to maintain perspective. We seem to have excuse after excuse to explain away problems, to numb the pain that facing reality brings.
The conclusion in rather bleak as the scale of the problem appears daunting BUT we have to address it and start making changes." Good interesting post. I agree it is a way of life for us and being relegated to the Joe McDonagh is unthinkable . The atmosphere yesterday was disappointing not sure if I'd put it down to the performance or stop start nature of the game
Afinestick96 (Wexford) - Posts: 145 - 22/04/2024 13:54:49
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Replying To Past hurler: "Brian Cody used to say that if grown adult players can't lead and make decisions on the field of play for themselves in game management situations he didn't want them on his team.
Michael Fennelly used to take it upon himseif in big matches to drop into defence when Kilkenny were ahead to pack out the defence and reduce a goal chance.
Management me hole, surely lads are hurling long enough to close out a 5 point lead in the 71st minute." 100% agree with this comment, grown adult intercounty hurlers should be able to make some form of decisions on the pitch themselves and not be have to be directed by management to do every single little thing!
wexfan09 (Wexford) - Posts: 32 - 22/04/2024 14:13:40
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Replying To wexford2012: "Liam griffin has in the past spoken about 'hurling being a way of life' well Last year when we played Kilkenny this never to me felt more visceral, more intense, more real as if that way of life was hanging by a thread. Maybe it was just me but that day felt like we were all stepping into the area, that we would as supporters go above and beyond, cheer, barrack, clap, hoot and hollower - yes weren't on the pitch but we would be that oft spoken about '16th man.'
In marked contrast yesterday in Wexford park the atmosphere was muted, it didn't feel like championship, I don't think there was a single 'Wexford, Wexford chant' which was strange.
I realise I am stepping on dangerous ground as people reacted strongly last year when the county chairman pointed the poor Wexford support being a part of the reason our u20s lost to Offaly in Carlow but I believed at the time he was right and still do.
This sense prompted me to check what research has to tell us and
"One study found that when athletes receive frequent encouragement, effort levels increased by up to 7%. Performing in front of a crowd can also provide a positive distraction from fatigue. Focusing on the crowd and thriving off their atmosphere and energy has been demonstrated to be an effective strategy to help athletes when they are tiring and about to 'hit the wall'."
This article went onto talk about visual aids/stimulus saying:
"Fans often use visual aids flags, banners, etc Visual representations of encouragement can be used to create an atmosphere that influences athletes both physically and psychologically. In fact, it has been found to help boost the physical strength of athletes by up to 8%. This effect was most apparent during high intensity performances, which makes it the perfect strategy for the World Cup."
So please don't get me wrong I'm not blaming supporters but do want to explore something. In post-match analysis yesterday many people I spoke to felt there missing in Wexford, that as a county, despite huge passion, we keep suffering big collapses. You don't see this with the other serious hurling counties. This is bigger than one group of players, bigger than any manager, even bigger than the county board members. We have not won a minor all Ireland since 1968 - 56 years…or even appeared in one since 1985 (39 years). Why is this?
At senior level I believe we suffered significant psychological damage that persists to this day, from the hammers Brian Cody's Kilkenny meted out to us, at some level this is impacting teams to this day. We lack confidence, lack belief, lack real ambition or expectation. Yes, we latch onto any scrape of success but we go from high to low, hero to zero, we're either winning the all-Ireland or we're the worst team in history - we have little ability as a county to maintain perspective. We seem to have excuse after excuse to explain away problems, to numb the pain that facing reality brings.
The conclusion in rather bleak as the scale of the problem appears daunting BUT we have to address it and start making changes." Good post, I know some people on here and elsewhere are maligning the quality of our forwards and wonder where we would be without Chin but I think in terms of ability, we're not as far as behind as some like to make us out to be e.g I'm not sure anyone can say that a trio of TJ Reid-Adrian Mullen-Eoin Cody is that far ahead quality-wise of Chin-ROC-Mac.
But where KK are streets ahead of us is that they play every game with intensity whereas we seem only to raise our level on special occasions. No matter how big or small out technical, physical, and tactical limitations are right now, our single biggest limitation is the gap between our two ears
ElGranSenor (Wexford) - Posts: 278 - 22/04/2024 14:20:07
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Replying To TerribleFootwork: "Well it was hard to forget given it was the most digusting, needless and below the belt comment I've probably ever read here. Don't worry I've plenty going on in my life but pots and kettles when it comes to needless digs.
I replied to that poster and told them its a wiff of those lads who call in on Talksport giving out about there PL team. I agree 100% not closing out the game yesterday was unforgivable, please read back the comments and tell me where I said anything otherwise? I've said myself before the Westmeath game last year was unacceptable anyone who thinks otherwise is living on another planet. I honestly don't know 1 person who taught we had a good year because we bet KK, all I know is people who taught we had a bad year because of last day situation we ended up in and I'm in that camp too. I'm still completely baffled how you think little was on the line for KK in 2022 when a defeat meant they were totally reliant on Galway doing them a favour v Dublin. What showed your true colours and kick them when your down mentality was your needless efforts to play down the KK wins since 2018, claimed only 1 game KK needed to win out of 4 when infact it was the other way around. You tripped yourself up due to your trigger happy approach.
Thanks I do have a good memory, 1 of the few things I'm useful for, your not talking to brick wall, you just posted alot of inaccurate information today, got challenged on it and now here we are." Just 2 things to clarify, I'm wrong myself Kilkenny didn't need to win 3 out of 4, they needed win 1 out of 4 and get a win or draw from another 2 out of those 4 to ensure they got the desired end result.
Also I'm not accusing you of a 'kick them when they're down' mentality based solely on the last 24 hours, you've a bit of form for it.
TerribleFootwork (Wexford) - Posts: 1760 - 22/04/2024 15:02:19
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Replying To ElGranSenor: " Replying To wexford2012: "Liam griffin has in the past spoken about 'hurling being a way of life' well Last year when we played Kilkenny this never to me felt more visceral, more intense, more real as if that way of life was hanging by a thread. Maybe it was just me but that day felt like we were all stepping into the area, that we would as supporters go above and beyond, cheer, barrack, clap, hoot and hollower - yes weren't on the pitch but we would be that oft spoken about '16th man.'
In marked contrast yesterday in Wexford park the atmosphere was muted, it didn't feel like championship, I don't think there was a single 'Wexford, Wexford chant' which was strange.
I realise I am stepping on dangerous ground as people reacted strongly last year when the county chairman pointed the poor Wexford support being a part of the reason our u20s lost to Offaly in Carlow but I believed at the time he was right and still do.
This sense prompted me to check what research has to tell us and
"One study found that when athletes receive frequent encouragement, effort levels increased by up to 7%. Performing in front of a crowd can also provide a positive distraction from fatigue. Focusing on the crowd and thriving off their atmosphere and energy has been demonstrated to be an effective strategy to help athletes when they are tiring and about to 'hit the wall'."
This article went onto talk about visual aids/stimulus saying:
"Fans often use visual aids flags, banners, etc Visual representations of encouragement can be used to create an atmosphere that influences athletes both physically and psychologically. In fact, it has been found to help boost the physical strength of athletes by up to 8%. This effect was most apparent during high intensity performances, which makes it the perfect strategy for the World Cup."
So please don't get me wrong I'm not blaming supporters but do want to explore something. In post-match analysis yesterday many people I spoke to felt there missing in Wexford, that as a county, despite huge passion, we keep suffering big collapses. You don't see this with the other serious hurling counties. This is bigger than one group of players, bigger than any manager, even bigger than the county board members. We have not won a minor all Ireland since 1968 - 56 years…or even appeared in one since 1985 (39 years). Why is this?
At senior level I believe we suffered significant psychological damage that persists to this day, from the hammers Brian Cody's Kilkenny meted out to us, at some level this is impacting teams to this day. We lack confidence, lack belief, lack real ambition or expectation. Yes, we latch onto any scrape of success but we go from high to low, hero to zero, we're either winning the all-Ireland or we're the worst team in history - we have little ability as a county to maintain perspective. We seem to have excuse after excuse to explain away problems, to numb the pain that facing reality brings.
The conclusion in rather bleak as the scale of the problem appears daunting BUT we have to address it and start making changes." Good post, I know some people on here and elsewhere are maligning the quality of our forwards and wonder where we would be without Chin but I think in terms of ability, we're not as far as behind as some like to make us out to be e.g I'm not sure anyone can say that a trio of TJ Reid-Adrian Mullen-Eoin Cody is that far ahead quality-wise of Chin-ROC-Mac. But where KK are streets ahead of us is that they play every game with intensity whereas we seem only to raise our level on special occasions. No matter how big or small out technical, physical, and tactical limitations are right now, our single biggest limitation is the gap between our two ears"
Afinestick96 (Wexford) - Posts: 145 - 22/04/2024 15:18:44
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Replying To Viking66: "He is. Hurt hamstring." Is Cian Molloy likely to be back for Saturday? Praying Jippo can get himself back full training this week we really need him against Galway
Afinestick96 (Wexford) - Posts: 145 - 22/04/2024 15:21:55
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Replying To wexfan09: "100% agree with this comment, grown adult intercounty hurlers should be able to make some form of decisions on the pitch themselves and not be have to be directed by management to do every single little thing!" Agree. Michael Fennelly was able to do that because no Kilkenny player would let that free be taken that fast.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12101 - 22/04/2024 15:41:18
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Remember that post myself TerribleFootwork, disgusting is the word and unfounded is another.
One of my closest Wexican friends was very upset by that as his son was on the team.
ExiledInWex (Dublin) - Posts: 1140 - 22/04/2024 15:46:34
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Replying To Doylerwex: "That's fair. We have to take that on the Chin.
We can't seem to buy a bit of luck at the moment, and me going on about it is probably part of the problem. Loser's mindset." It is natural to curse your luck when 2 goals go in but the problem in Wexford is the lack of goal scoring threat at the other. You can score 3 points in a gale and have to work your socks off to get them, some times just get the bloody ball in there and see what the outcome is has a place in the game. Backs hate fast ball and if its coming in fast you have less chance to deal with it. But we needed a goal, why didn't you get 10-12 bodies inside their own 45 and snuff it out? It was naive.
But its done now and on to the next challenge.
ExiledInWex (Dublin) - Posts: 1140 - 22/04/2024 15:53:21
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Replying To ExiledInWex: "It is natural to curse your luck when 2 goals go in but the problem in Wexford is the lack of goal scoring threat at the other. You can score 3 points in a gale and have to work your socks off to get them, some times just get the bloody ball in there and see what the outcome is has a place in the game. Backs hate fast ball and if its coming in fast you have less chance to deal with it. But we needed a goal, why didn't you get 10-12 bodies inside their own 45 and snuff it out? It was naive.
But its done now and on to the next challenge." I agree we really lack that killer instinct of putting teams to the sword when they are their for the taking. On Saturday we need to show a ruthless edge when we get our purple patch we need to put the game out of sight. The longer Antrim stay in the game the more confidence they will gain. They are not the side they were last year and we need to attack them from the off. It could come down to score difference if ourselves and Dublin fail to get a result over KK and galway
Afinestick96 (Wexford) - Posts: 145 - 22/04/2024 16:12:33
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Replying To Afinestick96: " Replying To ElGranSenor: "[quote=wexford2012: "Liam griffin has in the past spoken about 'hurling being a way of life' well Last year when we played Kilkenny this never to me felt more visceral, more intense, more real as if that way of life was hanging by a thread. Maybe it was just me but that day felt like we were all stepping into the area, that we would as supporters go above and beyond, cheer, barrack, clap, hoot and hollower - yes weren't on the pitch but we would be that oft spoken about '16th man.'
In marked contrast yesterday in Wexford park the atmosphere was muted, it didn't feel like championship, I don't think there was a single 'Wexford, Wexford chant' which was strange.
I realise I am stepping on dangerous ground as people reacted strongly last year when the county chairman pointed the poor Wexford support being a part of the reason our u20s lost to Offaly in Carlow but I believed at the time he was right and still do.
This sense prompted me to check what research has to tell us and
"One study found that when athletes receive frequent encouragement, effort levels increased by up to 7%. Performing in front of a crowd can also provide a positive distraction from fatigue. Focusing on the crowd and thriving off their atmosphere and energy has been demonstrated to be an effective strategy to help athletes when they are tiring and about to 'hit the wall'."
This article went onto talk about visual aids/stimulus saying:
"Fans often use visual aids flags, banners, etc Visual representations of encouragement can be used to create an atmosphere that influences athletes both physically and psychologically. In fact, it has been found to help boost the physical strength of athletes by up to 8%. This effect was most apparent during high intensity performances, which makes it the perfect strategy for the World Cup."
So please don't get me wrong I'm not blaming supporters but do want to explore something. In post-match analysis yesterday many people I spoke to felt there missing in Wexford, that as a county, despite huge passion, we keep suffering big collapses. You don't see this with the other serious hurling counties. This is bigger than one group of players, bigger than any manager, even bigger than the county board members. We have not won a minor all Ireland since 1968 - 56 years…or even appeared in one since 1985 (39 years). Why is this?
At senior level I believe we suffered significant psychological damage that persists to this day, from the hammers Brian Cody's Kilkenny meted out to us, at some level this is impacting teams to this day. We lack confidence, lack belief, lack real ambition or expectation. Yes, we latch onto any scrape of success but we go from high to low, hero to zero, we're either winning the all-Ireland or we're the worst team in history - we have little ability as a county to maintain perspective. We seem to have excuse after excuse to explain away problems, to numb the pain that facing reality brings.
The conclusion in rather bleak as the scale of the problem appears daunting BUT we have to address it and start making changes." Good post, I know some people on here and elsewhere are maligning the quality of our forwards and wonder where we would be without Chin but I think in terms of ability, we're not as far as behind as some like to make us out to be e.g I'm not sure anyone can say that a trio of TJ Reid-Adrian Mullen-Eoin Cody is that far ahead quality-wise of Chin-ROC-Mac. But where KK are streets ahead of us is that they play every game with intensity whereas we seem only to raise our level on special occasions. No matter how big or small out technical, physical, and tactical limitations are right now, our single biggest limitation is the gap between our two ears"
Really what the OP should've said is that Chin, Rory and Damien would be standout players on a Liam McCarthy team, which all 3 are. All 3 would make any team, including Limericks.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12101 - 22/04/2024 16:39:07
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Replying To Afinestick96: "Is Cian Molloy likely to be back for Saturday? Praying Jippo can get himself back full training this week we really need him against Galway" Not sure. Nothing concrete coming out of camp. Whispers were that 3 other lads who started against Dublin apart from Richie were touch and go. The fact all 3 played til the final whistle is very encouraging. Hopefully we have a fully fit panel for the Galway game, and that we keep them all fully fit for the Carlow and Kilkenny games.
Bottom line is if we have any ambitions past just finishing 3rd we should be giving ourselves a chance against Galway and Kilkenny in the Round Robin games. If we don't then we don't deserve to get out of Leinster. And what would then be the point if we did finish 3rd, as we would likely be hammered in an AIQF.
Players and management need to start believing. Really believing. And playing every game as if its knockout. I think we could surprise a few people if that happens, not least of all ourselves.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12101 - 22/04/2024 16:45:37
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Replying To ExiledInWex: "It is natural to curse your luck when 2 goals go in but the problem in Wexford is the lack of goal scoring threat at the other. You can score 3 points in a gale and have to work your socks off to get them, some times just get the bloody ball in there and see what the outcome is has a place in the game. Backs hate fast ball and if its coming in fast you have less chance to deal with it. But we needed a goal, why didn't you get 10-12 bodies inside their own 45 and snuff it out? It was naive.
But its done now and on to the next challenge." Someone should've kicked the ball into the Slaney for that last free in.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12101 - 22/04/2024 16:46:59
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Replying To Viking66: "Someone should've kicked the ball into the Slaney for that last free in." Im sure the management team will review the video analysis and the lads will watch that back in training tomorrow night
Afinestick96 (Wexford) - Posts: 145 - 22/04/2024 16:53:37
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Replying To Doylerwex: "I disagree but there's really no point getting into it at this stage.
It was a miracle ye won in croke park last year." Really. Unless you consider one team taking their chances and another not then it was hardly miraculous.
Scoreboard is only thing that counts. Not fortuitous goals. Not to mention penalties.
BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 2589 - 22/04/2024 17:03:09
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Replying To Viking66: "Not sure. Nothing concrete coming out of camp. Whispers were that 3 other lads who started against Dublin apart from Richie were touch and go. The fact all 3 played til the final whistle is very encouraging. Hopefully we have a fully fit panel for the Galway game, and that we keep them all fully fit for the Carlow and Kilkenny games.
Bottom line is if we have any ambitions past just finishing 3rd we should be giving ourselves a chance against Galway and Kilkenny in the Round Robin games. If we don't then we don't deserve to get out of Leinster. And what would then be the point if we did finish 3rd, as we would likely be hammered in an AIQF.
Players and management need to start believing. Really believing. And playing every game as if its knockout. I think we could surprise a few people if that happens, not least of all ourselves." I agree we should just be happy to scrape through to the All Ireland Series in third place . We are capable of beating Galway or Kilkenny if we get likes of Jippo and Jacko back on the field and everyone playing to their ability. We firstly need a good performance on Saturday to get ourselves back in the running.
Afinestick96 (Wexford) - Posts: 145 - 22/04/2024 17:12:01
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Replying To Afinestick96: "I agree we really lack that killer instinct of putting teams to the sword when they are their for the taking. On Saturday we need to show a ruthless edge when we get our purple patch we need to put the game out of sight. The longer Antrim stay in the game the more confidence they will gain. They are not the side they were last year and we need to attack them from the off. It could come down to score difference if ourselves and Dublin fail to get a result over KK and galway" I do fear as a team we are just a little bit too nice sometimes.
tearintom (Wexford) - Posts: 1353 - 22/04/2024 17:14:37
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We had three good goal chances, one with casey drop out of his hand and pull on it and was cleared off the line, another with liam og racing in on goal and then Dunbar save. Another time we had liam og running down the centre and he turned around and threw it to Rory who was out on the wing. Two things and I compare us to kk, kk would have won that game against Dublin by 7 to 8 points with the possession wexford had. Why, they don't cough up soft scored like us, two they would have taken at least 2 out of the three changes, three they would never do what liam og did as mentioned above and finally they work like dogs for the whole game all game every game. They are who we need to try and copy and spire too at all times
hunting (Wexford) - Posts: 954 - 22/04/2024 17:22:17
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Replying To ExiledInWex: "It is natural to curse your luck when 2 goals go in but the problem in Wexford is the lack of goal scoring threat at the other. You can score 3 points in a gale and have to work your socks off to get them, some times just get the bloody ball in there and see what the outcome is has a place in the game. Backs hate fast ball and if its coming in fast you have less chance to deal with it. But we needed a goal, why didn't you get 10-12 bodies inside their own 45 and snuff it out? It was naive.
But its done now and on to the next challenge." Being clinical is the problem for me, we had 2 shots on goal in 2nd half yesterday, 1 from Dunbar was to easy for the goalkeeper and the other from Liam Og that went wide, would have had 1 in the 1st half too if the handpass to Casey had stuck, in fairness ye had 1 aswel when O'Donnell made the run down the centre. Your right its groundhog day stuff for us, remembering the missed chances against ye the last 2 years and giving away the goals ala Westmeath last year.
Round robin is a much a mental challenge as it is physical to me and it can all change so quickly, Cork Clare under massive pressure next weekend after so much positivity around them the last few weeks and Waterford could build some momentum now after being written off, we need to park yesterday now and go full steam now for Saturday, I wouldn't buy into scoreline yesterday with Antrim, I think the likes of themselves, Westmeath etc. are almost mentally already beaten before the game against Kilkenny and Galway and sniff an opportunity against ourselves and Dublin, and that's understandable given we've dropped points v Westmeath and Dublin have v Antrim in the last campaign. If we can get a win and good performance on Saturday it could go a bit of the way to getting yesterday's sucker punch out of the system.
TerribleFootwork (Wexford) - Posts: 1760 - 22/04/2024 17:32:25
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