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Not a CPA member, I was a member of a similar previous organisation that originated in the North that got chewed up & spat out by the GAA as well. Ifeel sorry for the genuine efforts put in by the well known & very genuine members of the CPA who through frustration took action but have being openly ridiculed, mocked & embarrassed by the senior leadership of the GAA. The CPA has no future now & they should just leave it & let those who continue to talk out of both sides of their mouths be exposed for what they are. moc.dna (Galway) - Posts: 1212 - 09/12/2019 02:45:41 2253881 Link 0 |
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Hopefully when the GAA look at the GPA they'll find a new players body that is inclusive and people championing the club game feel they have a voice. I think we'd all want that but I have to admit to feeling confused to what the CPA actually want in terms of fixtures because whilst there are some flaws and clarifications required I don't see the task force as being a whitewash. In fact I'd praise the CPA for being part of a report that won't be entirely well received by inter county teams. Lets see what happens after it's debated around the country and every member ultimately wants clubs and inter county teams to have something they can live with, it may be the task force is encouraged to tweek things further. I do think the CPA should have stayed on board during and until after the debate though but that's just an opinion. Again it's an opinion from the outside but it looks like the CPA maybe wanted the season split down the middle with for eg inter county from Jan to June (early July) and clubs thereafter. I don't ever see this being the solution and I actually don't reckon most GAA members would want this either.
sam1884 (UK) - Posts: 999 - 09/12/2019 10:14:40 2253899 Link 0 |
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The CPAs biggest problem is they don't seem to have any real solution to the problems themselves, because there is no consensus among club players. Nor can there be really, a perfect fixture calendar for a 30 year old club footballer in Fermanagh would look very different to a perfect fixture calendar for a 20 year old dual player in Cork. The 'April for clubs' idea was first raised by the CPA and Croke Park made big changes to allow it happen - 2 years later and I don't really think there is any club player who thinks it is now a good idea. The only way the CPA can be successful is by working at county board level, but there is not much glamour or national media attention involved in that.
Soma (UK) - Posts: 2630 - 09/12/2019 11:59:54 2253920 Link 0 |
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I wrote to make it 2x 16 for 4-4-1-1 - div 1 teams would go for that.
omahant (USA) - Posts: 2570 - 10/12/2019 14:04:44 2254104 Link 0 |
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I think they've had quite a broad approach but have had some core goals they've wanted to achieve. To remove the qualifiers. Which is key, given the uncertainty they create in when the county team will be playing. They've also looked to maximise the number of club only weekends. Which I think has been a little bit of a mistake. They haven't paid enough attention to when these games are being played. As Sean Kelly wrote in the independent, there needs to be a running of the inter county and club competitions in parallel. That could be done more easily if there was a league style championship. There's been resistance it appears to end the inter county season sooner and it's meant that a significant amount of big club games are played before the inter county season and that's probably not much good to anyone. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4207 - 10/12/2019 17:48:17 2254156 Link 7 |
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I'm not sure the qualifiers do make much difference really, all counties have to plan as if they will reach the final no matter how unrealistic and qualifiers are generally played alongside the provincial competition. The CPA wanted April for clubs which they got, but also wanted all intercounty games except the final played by mid July. To have that schedule makes it almost impossible to play club championship games during the intercounty season as there would not be available weekends. I get the impression the CPA leadership don't want to sign up to anything or even bring forward meaningful solutions as they know there is no consensus among their members. Soma (UK) - Posts: 2630 - 10/12/2019 22:01:11 2254214 Link 0 |
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Reduce the League to three divisions of 11, 11, and 10. The third division has a spot reserved for Kilkenny if they ever want to rejoin. Add in the provincials and a straight knockout All-Ireland series for the 4 provincials champions, Tier 2 champions, and top 11 placed teams in the League. Every teams gets a minimum 11-12 games. To use Donegal as an example. 10 League games + 4 Ulster games + 4 All-Ireland games = 18 games. Hawkeye9212 (Donegal) - Posts: 266 - 10/12/2019 23:04:58 2254223 Link 0 |
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Yep that seems good. I'd make sure to schedule club games between league games. Otherwise spot on. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4207 - 11/12/2019 07:05:02 2254234 Link 7 |
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How many supporters would be interested in going to 18 intercounty games in a season though? Even now we see supporters pick and choose the super 8 games they go to, with games getting average crowds and poor atmospheres. Then you also have to consider county's like Galway and Cork where there would be supporters who would follow both the hurlers and footballers where attendances for both would fall. It would be interesting to know if players would prefer more games in front of smaller crowds, or less games but in front of bigger crowds?
Soma (UK) - Posts: 2630 - 11/12/2019 10:42:19 2254256 Link 0 |
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It's 18 games if they make it to the All-Ireland and provincial finals. Supporters picking and choosing which games they go to happens in every sport. It's not a problem.
Hawkeye9212 (Donegal) - Posts: 266 - 11/12/2019 11:10:43 2254264 Link 0 |
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A super 8s game this year with 2356 people at it. I'd want to be sure there is an appetite out there for more games before making any big changes, I don't think there is. Playing in front of half empty stadiums is not just demoralising for players, fans get bored of poor atmospheres too and start to stay away. Fewer games but with bigger crowds would seem to be a better approach.
Soma (UK) - Posts: 2630 - 11/12/2019 14:51:28 2254298 Link 0 |
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Most of the early games in the League will have low attendances but players expect that. We can't have fewer games without ditching either the League or Provincial championships. I like the format because it gives every team something to play for. The Super 8s game between Roscommon and Cork was a meaningless game but none of the players seemed demoralised because it was one the best games of the season. One of semi-finals had a low attendance as well. I'd be happy to ditch the Provincials and just have a championship based on League performance.
Hawkeye9212 (Donegal) - Posts: 266 - 11/12/2019 15:33:59 2254302 Link 0 |
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Any interviews with players generally want more games regardless of the crowds. I think games between the really top teams would get good turnouts. I'd think you find that with a league based championship there'd be a lot of home support and maybe less away support. That wouldn't be a problem if season tickets were packaged appropriately. I could imagine Kerry v Dublin in Killarney in a league based competition as part of championship being widely attended. I'd imagine lower level teams wanting to play meaningful matches at a better time in the calendar. As I say interviews in the media with players always seem to allude to that. I don't know if attendances would fall either. The group games in the Hurling championships have increased average attendances at games. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4207 - 11/12/2019 16:56:49 2254321 Link 8 |
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11 team divisions gives every 4 home and away games. The home sides will have good attendances. To take Div 1 as an example. Let's say Donegal get home games against Galway, Meath, Dublin, and Monaghan. I can't see any of those games being poorly attended. Away games to Dublin, Mayo, Roscommon, and Fermanagh will get decent crowds as well. Division 2 games will get good crowds now that a place in the All-Ireland Championship is at stake.
Hawkeye9212 (Donegal) - Posts: 266 - 11/12/2019 17:49:39 2254334 Link 0 |
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Croke Park often get criticised for only thinking about the elites but when the affect new formats might have on attendances are brought up, the games mentioned here are Dublin v Kerry and Donegal v Tyrone. Of course these will always have a decent crowd, but the lads playing 9 league games in division 3, or 10 league games in division 2, with maybe the last 4 or 5 of them utterly meaningless?!? There are meaningless league games now of course but at least they are still of use as preparation for the bigger games ahead.
Soma (UK) - Posts: 2630 - 11/12/2019 23:28:32 2254367 Link 0 |
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It seems like you're making the argument to scrap every sports League in the world. Div 3 teams still have to prepare for Tier 2.
Hawkeye9212 (Donegal) - Posts: 266 - 12/12/2019 10:13:05 2254385 Link 0 |
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As I've said before, I think the crowds issue and marketing of the weaker counties is over emphasised by the pundit space. If you read articles with those from weaker counties they value the league hugely and would just like it played at a better time. I get similar from my mates who have/still do play for Antrim. The last 4/5 games in these leagues won't be meaningless, certainly not in division 2 with promotion, relegation and tier 1 entry all up for grabs. As Hawkeye says Division 3 teams have to prep for provincial and their All Ireland tier 2 competitions. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4207 - 12/12/2019 10:44:15 2254397 Link 6 |
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The league as it is now is a very good competition but played too early in the year. My preference would be to split each league up into 2 sections and play each side home and away with 6 games for all. The report covers a number of things, and something I haven't seen mentioned anywhere is the proposal to make minor a development grade with no All-Ireland final. The proposal is to have the senior All-Ireland finals as stand alone games which to me seems a terrible idea. Soma (UK) - Posts: 2630 - 12/12/2019 19:32:23 2254498 Link 0 |
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Teams should be playing a wide spread of teams in a league. Wicklow won't gain by playing London, Wexford, and Limerick twice.
Hawkeye9212 (Donegal) - Posts: 266 - 12/12/2019 20:05:07 2254514 Link 0 |
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I tried to do this with my 2 Confs of 16 - each team plays 4 teams from each of 3 divs (excl divs 1v4, 2v2 & 3v3).
omahant (USA) - Posts: 2570 - 12/12/2019 22:46:05 2254563 Link 0 |