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You Couldn't Pay Me To Go And Watch A Game Of Football

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Replying To PoolSturgeon:  ""People must have really loved the new tactics of getting people behind the ball".

That is the most spectacular misanalysis and most superficial reading of things I've seen in some time.

Ever think it could be that county rivalry was at its peak back then, the 14 man behind the ball tactic was being endured by fans as a transitory blip rather than a new permanent feature of the game, and the professional rugby game in Ireland was only just emerging from the shadows of the GAA on its pathway of exponential growth and offering an alluring alternative means of entertainment when pitted beside boring blanket defence Gaelic football?"

My point is about attendances and not reading too much into them without examining the circumstances.

MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 12450 - 22/12/2018 16:06:54    2155001


Cricket is more entertaining then gaelic football these days, zzzzz

PyatPree (Cork) - Posts: 337 - 22/12/2018 16:57:03    2155002


Replying To PyatPree:  "Cricket is more entertaining then gaelic football these days, zzzzz"
Go talk on a Cricket thread so like a good lad

Sweetspot (Kildare) - Posts: 121 - 22/12/2018 17:11:34    2155003


Replying To PyatPree:  "Cricket is more entertaining then gaelic football these days, zzzzz"
the reason it is not entertaining for the Cork fan is because Cork are not playing well. If Cork team did well I bet there would be no complaints. Slán

galwayford (Galway) - Posts: 1512 - 22/12/2018 17:33:30    2155005


I think some of the rules should try and improve player safety. Not just the entertainment value. GAA players are amateurs and will not get paid if they are injured.

galwayford (Galway) - Posts: 1512 - 22/12/2018 17:40:28    2155009


Replying To Sweetspot:  "Go talk on a Cricket thread so like a good lad"
Theres more then one sport in G.A.A then football

PyatPree (Cork) - Posts: 337 - 22/12/2018 18:43:53    2155016


Attendances were declining year on year. 11 years in a row attendances declined. 11 years in a row is not a blip , is not a 1 off , 11 years in a row declining attendances are a thread, are a pattern are a decade or more , a generation of declining attendances. 2017 saw an upturn what are chances if u take out extra super 8 games we have decline on last years numbers.

Lets look at the 2017 and 2018
Leinster final 2017 kildare v Dublin around 60000
leinster final 2018 laois v Dublin around 41000
Decline in leinster

Ulster Final 2017 Tyrone v Down 31912
Ulster Final 2018 Donegal v Fermanagh 28280
Average attendance for Ulster championship match in 2017 was 15581
Average attendance for Ulster championship match in 2018 was down to 12370
Decline in Ulster

Quater finals ( I know there is change with Super 8 but if we take quater finals 2017 with first matchs in Croker there is a decline )
Quater final 2017
Kerry v Galway/ Roscommon v Mayo 65746
Tyrone v Armagh/ Dublin v Monaghan 82000
Super 8 First Round Croker
Dublin v Donegal/Roscommon v Tyrone 53501
Kerry v Galway/Kildare v Monaghan 30740

I know it not like with like but still there was 43% decrease from last years quarter finals to the opening week of super 8.

All Ireland Semi final 2017 kerry v Mayo 66195 draw
All Ireland Semi final 2017 kerry v Mayo 53032
All Ireland semi final 2017 Dublin v Tyrone 82300
All Ireland semi final 2018 Dublin v Galway 54106
All Ireland semi final 2018 Tyrone v Monaghan 49496

This years semi finals were the worst attended this decade
This years semi final 2018 was Dublins lowest attendance for All-Ireland semi final in 23 years
This years semi finals were lowest since 2009
This years semi finals 2018 were 30% lower then 2017 semi finals
I think its first time ever the football attendances were less then hurling semi final attendances
This years is lowest attendance for Dublin semi final since 1993 when Clare played Dublin and 57793 attended the game. This was more or less capacity as Croke Park was being redeveloped at the time in 93.
So you probaly have to go back to 1985 for a comparable poor attendance for Dublin semi final when 40295 turned up for Mayo v Dublin semi final.

So with leinster finals and Ulster declining this year. A big drop in Ulster championship match this year. A big drop at All Ireland semi final stage , a drop.we have not seen for Dublin in two or three decades. We had extra replay at semi final.stage in 2017 . And with Mayo out earlier of the championship. Mayo have probaly biggest fanbase after Dublin. If you compare attendances for 2017 and this year 2018 leaving out extra super 8 games. It looks almost certain we can draw conclusion again this year attendances delined after upturn last year. So the thread of attendance declining continues . Only the super 8 matchs cover up the decline. Thats why the GAA introduced the super 8 games.
Furlong1949 (Meath) - Posts: 551 - 07/12/2018 19:33:11 2153635

Just quoting Furlongs 2018 numbers from the other thread.

I would love to believe that football attendances are on the increase but I've got eyes, I can't stick my head in the sand.
I do believe as Furlong attested to that the dominance of one county does lead to apathy elsewhere his figures about the last time we had a team who dominated to this degree (Kerry in the late seventies and early eighties) were eye opening. However I also believe that the quality of football outside of a couple of counties and maybe the quality of coaching is also causing a problem. Money may be up and I think the season ticket was a great idea to get cash in early but having a season ticket and actually attending matches are different things.

cavandub (Cavan) - Posts: 63 - 24/12/2018 11:18:59    2155082


A lot of the 'problem' with football currently stems from the frustration & boredom of Dublin's domination imo. 31 teams know that they have 'no chance'. That's a large chunk of frustration right there. Supporters/media etc would get a way better bang out of it, if 10/12 teams were seriously contending for Sam each season. They'd put up with any sort of 'entertainment', if their teams could get a sniff of the ultimate prize. I don't remember any rewards for artistic impression after the all-ireland finals of '80 or '83 or '88, but there was less criticism on 'the state of football', because a few teams were in the hunt. The current one horse race is very predictable!

Pope_Benedict (Galway) - Posts: 2235 - 28/12/2018 11:25:10    2155180


Its an interesting point. Likely some truth in it in all honestly, i would be lying if i said that i have seem some teams playing Dublin and trying to keep the score down or have withered psychologically. I was watching the semi final against Galway and final against Tyrone over Christmas and both teams built up healthy leads, under normal circumstances those counties with those leads are winning games bu Dublin can turn a 5-7 point lead in three phases of play, the did in both those games. Then its containment from the opposition teams and the spectacle lowers.

For your point though where does the responsibility lie. I would argue that Dublin are superb entertainment, i haven't left a Dublin match in about 12 years now and not been hugely entertained by the quality of football (maybe Donegal 2011 actually).

We have seen attendances fall this year in key games that would traditionally have been close to full houses. But yet we have seen every team bar Tyrone come to Croke Park to play Dublin with a blanket defense or revert to it half way through the game to keep the score down. That really lowers the sense of excitement and general spectacle as the Dubs go about unpicking the lock.

To be perfectly frank, while teams have a defeatist approach or change their natural game to playing Dublin their is a responsibility on other counties. Take Galway as an example they had great success with the defensive system largely throughout the league and championship, that was a yearly strategy, but did they honestly think they would turn up in Croke park in the heat of the summer with it and 1) score enough to beat Dublin and 2) keep Dublin out. Not having a go at Galway by the way, Galway started well then went itno their shell and psychologically withered and the game was over after 30 mins and the entertainment decreased. but it just illustrates the approach. Not having a go at Galway by the way,

So while i acknowledge there is a border and fatigue with Dublin, Dublin are the most entertaining team in the championship in regard to the football they play and consistent standard in playing open and attractive football. Dublin still pull the biggest crowds, 8-15k + at league games and 50k for games in the latter stages of the championship. You do well in round of the championship or league not to have Dublin's game as the highest attendance. I know you are not criticizing Dublin here.

I suppose my point is when it comes to Dublin and the fatigue and bordem where does the responsibility lie, is it up to other counties to move away from defensive systems and percentage cynical football for the sake of making games entertaining or is it about winning matches, or Dublin not to be so good or handicap in some way. For me i think many counties need to look at themselves and what they are contributing to the evolution of the game. Galway will feel they have had a great year getting to semi final and league final, but how their style of play and approach to playing Dublin and how they went into a defensive shell playing DUblin in the semi after 30 mins, was never going to win an All Ireland and they contribute to that cycle of apathy, frustration and bordem of Dublin winning again. So again where does the burden and responsibility lie?

For quality Dublin, with one or two others are propping up the championship. My own opinion 2018 was a bit of an anominally. Kerry and Mayo had particularly bad years and latter games in the championship had teams with relatively small populations, as did the some of the provincial finals. A resurgent Mayo and Kerry 2019 to have a cut of the Dubs, will get man juices flowing again, cant wait.

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 2379 - 28/12/2018 12:22:04    2155181


No team is unbeatable. Kerry in 1982 were considered practically unbeatable. But Séamus Darby, Matt Connor and Eugene McGee thought otherwise.

galwayford (Galway) - Posts: 1512 - 29/12/2018 12:10:26    2155237


Replying To Convert1:  "Neil Moyna's of DCU comment on current senior and intercounty football not to mention 3rd level inter college being a turn off. What do folks think.
For me I have to agree with him that defensive systems and 14/15 men behind the ball in your own half is a turn off.
Hurling or rugby now have far more appeal.
No enjoyment to watch and I can imagine no enjoyment to play as well.
Maybe the 5 new rules being tested might breath some life into the game.
For a game I enjoyed to play, coach and watch now becoming something i do not feel worth watching anymore."
Niall Moyna said, "you couldn't pay me to go and watch a game of football". His own county, Monaghan had a great season . They won 5 games in Division One and beat Dublin in Croke Park. They then got to an All Ireland semi final . They played 9 championship matches winning 6 of them drawing with Kerry in a cracking game and losing 2 matches. Moyna went to none of those games. However he told us that he did attend one inter county this year. What game was that ? You got it .... the All Ireland Final. According to himself he can't stand football yet he takes up a seat that many football fans would have loved to be in.

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 4969 - 30/12/2018 17:39:51    2155304


Replying To galwayford:  "No team is unbeatable. Kerry in 1982 were considered practically unbeatable. But Séamus Darby, Matt Connor and Eugene McGee thought otherwise."
Very true Galwayford. Dublin's dominance will end someday.

thelongridge (Offaly) - Posts: 1086 - 31/12/2018 12:35:49    2155337