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Replying To Furlong1949: "Dublin supporters. Welcome to Meath footballers Tyrone footballers and Clare hurlers world. There has been massive increase in criticism regards Dublin recently. This is very unusual. I cannot remember much or any criticism of the Dubs in 90s or 00s. They werent as sucessful of course. When Dublin won in 2011 there was alot of praise and people saw this as good thing. 7 years later the Dubs are being heavily criticised. I have a theory why?.
In the GAA world if anything new or unprecedented happens people are more likely to criticise. Let me explain. When kilkenny Tipp or Cork win liam Mcarthy or kerry Dublin Cork or Galway win Sam everything is rosey in GAA land. Any other county is nearly always criticised if they suceed. Anything unprecedented , outside the traditional top counties it gets more criticism. Well of course Dublin are a traditional county. When Dublin win 1 All Ireland there is no problem. But Dublin winning 6 in 8 years. That is unprecedented. When kilkenny or kerry win multiple All.Irelands there is little criticism. This is not new or unprecedented. People accept this.
Yes the Dubs are being treated unfairly. There is a definite difference in the way kilkenny or kerry or praised when they win multiple All.Irelands. The Dubs get criticised . The reason is say you are beaten by a team. You say Meath are to rough, Tyrone play puke football and underhand tactics Clare are to physical and Dublin have a money advantage. Then it gives a county an excuse. It like they were not beaten fairly. Its like they were not beaten at all. I dont know if that makes sense. But there is no doubt, people accept kilkenny and kerry winning 4 in a row. But not Dublin. The same way people accept kilkenny Tipp and Cork winning hurling titles, but not Clare.
Here is some examples
In late 80s Galway won 3 hurling titles. This was unprecedented for Galway. Galway were heavily criticised at the time for ruining hurling with their short passing possession game. 20 years later Cork won a two in a row with a more possession game. They were described as revolutionising the game and highly praised.
In late 90s Clare won 2 titles in 3 years. This was unprecedented for Clare. Clare were heavily criticised at the time for bringing to much physicality to the game of hurling. 10 years later kilkenny won 4 in a row bringing physicality to a level we had never seen before in hurling. They were called greatest team ever.
In 60s Down won 3 All-Irelands . This was unprecedented for Down and new. Down at the time were called upstarts. They were criticised at the time for ruining football by a playing a short passing possession game. In the next decade kerry and Dublin won All-Irelands with a more hand passing game. The Dubs and kerry were called grreatest teams ever.
In 1988 Meath won two in a row..This was unprecedented for Meath and new. In 88 final Meath were criticised and the final was criticised for being a rough match. It was a tough hard match between two big physical teams. Nothing more nothing less. 5 years earlier Dublin won an All-Ireland in the most violent final in Irish sporting history. The Dublin players were praised and called heroric and labeled the 12 Apostles.
In 00s Tyrone won 3 All-Irelands this was unprecedented. Tyrone had a defensive system with sweepers and blanket defence. There football was called puke football and they were criticised for underhand tactics eg sledging. Donegal won All All Ireland in 2012 with a more defensive system they were labelled as destroying gaelic football. Kerry in 2014 won an All-Ireland with a defensive system eg sweepers blanket defence. There was no criticism , they were praised.
Dublin won 6 All-Irelands in 8 years in this decade. This is unprecedented and new in the GAA world
.They are criticised about their finances and money buying All-Irelands. In 70s kerry won 8 Sams in 00s kilkenny won 6 All-Irelands they were not criticised at all.
So to Dublin supporters welcome to Meath Tyrone and Donegal footballers and Clare and Galway hurlers world. Any county that has unusual levels of sucess outside the norm are criticised in gaa land." "When kilkenny or kerry win multiple All.Irelands there is little criticism"
This is a joke, right?
ballydalane (Kilkenny) - Posts: 1246 - 07/09/2018 22:35:39
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Replying To ballydalane: ""When kilkenny or kerry win multiple All.Irelands there is little criticism"
This is a joke, right?" Lol I spotted that too. Also stating the 2014 Kerry team received no criticism, I had a chuckle to myself there. This place went in to meltdown after that final, that team were called the 'worst team ever' to win one, 'stole' the All Ireland etc.
That's nitpicking though, great posts Furlong they are an interesting read fair play to you.
GeniusGerry (Kerry) - Posts: 2105 - 08/09/2018 09:23:33
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Replying To Furlong1949: "Dublin supporters. Welcome to Meath footballers Tyrone footballers and Clare hurlers world. There has been massive increase in criticism regards Dublin recently. This is very unusual. I cannot remember much or any criticism of the Dubs in 90s or 00s. They werent as sucessful of course. When Dublin won in 2011 there was alot of praise and people saw this as good thing. 7 years later the Dubs are being heavily criticised. I have a theory why?.
In the GAA world if anything new or unprecedented happens people are more likely to criticise. Let me explain. When kilkenny Tipp or Cork win liam Mcarthy or kerry Dublin Cork or Galway win Sam everything is rosey in GAA land. Any other county is nearly always criticised if they suceed. Anything unprecedented , outside the traditional top counties it gets more criticism. Well of course Dublin are a traditional county. When Dublin win 1 All Ireland there is no problem. But Dublin winning 6 in 8 years. That is unprecedented. When kilkenny or kerry win multiple All.Irelands there is little criticism. This is not new or unprecedented. People accept this.
Yes the Dubs are being treated unfairly. There is a definite difference in the way kilkenny or kerry or praised when they win multiple All.Irelands. The Dubs get criticised . The reason is say you are beaten by a team. You say Meath are to rough, Tyrone play puke football and underhand tactics Clare are to physical and Dublin have a money advantage. Then it gives a county an excuse. It like they were not beaten fairly. Its like they were not beaten at all. I dont know if that makes sense. But there is no doubt, people accept kilkenny and kerry winning 4 in a row. But not Dublin. The same way people accept kilkenny Tipp and Cork winning hurling titles, but not Clare.
Here is some examples
In late 80s Galway won 3 hurling titles. This was unprecedented for Galway. Galway were heavily criticised at the time for ruining hurling with their short passing possession game. 20 years later Cork won a two in a row with a more possession game. They were described as revolutionising the game and highly praised.
In late 90s Clare won 2 titles in 3 years. This was unprecedented for Clare. Clare were heavily criticised at the time for bringing to much physicality to the game of hurling. 10 years later kilkenny won 4 in a row bringing physicality to a level we had never seen before in hurling. They were called greatest team ever.
In 60s Down won 3 All-Irelands . This was unprecedented for Down and new. Down at the time were called upstarts. They were criticised at the time for ruining football by a playing a short passing possession game. In the next decade kerry and Dublin won All-Irelands with a more hand passing game. The Dubs and kerry were called grreatest teams ever.
In 1988 Meath won two in a row..This was unprecedented for Meath and new. In 88 final Meath were criticised and the final was criticised for being a rough match. It was a tough hard match between two big physical teams. Nothing more nothing less. 5 years earlier Dublin won an All-Ireland in the most violent final in Irish sporting history. The Dublin players were praised and called heroric and labeled the 12 Apostles.
In 00s Tyrone won 3 All-Irelands this was unprecedented. Tyrone had a defensive system with sweepers and blanket defence. There football was called puke football and they were criticised for underhand tactics eg sledging. Donegal won All All Ireland in 2012 with a more defensive system they were labelled as destroying gaelic football. Kerry in 2014 won an All-Ireland with a defensive system eg sweepers blanket defence. There was no criticism , they were praised.
Dublin won 6 All-Irelands in 8 years in this decade. This is unprecedented and new in the GAA world
.They are criticised about their finances and money buying All-Irelands. In 70s kerry won 8 Sams in 00s kilkenny won 6 All-Irelands they were not criticised at all.
So to Dublin supporters welcome to Meath Tyrone and Donegal footballers and Clare and Galway hurlers world. Any county that has unusual levels of sucess outside the norm are criticised in gaa land." What an absolutely brilliant and thought provoking post.
Thats exceptional analysis A Chara. One of the best things ive read ever on here, take a bow.
TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4445 - 08/09/2018 09:41:41
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Replying To Furlong1949: "Dublin supporters. Welcome to Meath footballers Tyrone footballers and Clare hurlers world. There has been massive increase in criticism regards Dublin recently. This is very unusual. I cannot remember much or any criticism of the Dubs in 90s or 00s. They werent as sucessful of course. When Dublin won in 2011 there was alot of praise and people saw this as good thing. 7 years later the Dubs are being heavily criticised. I have a theory why?.
In the GAA world if anything new or unprecedented happens people are more likely to criticise. Let me explain. When kilkenny Tipp or Cork win liam Mcarthy or kerry Dublin Cork or Galway win Sam everything is rosey in GAA land. Any other county is nearly always criticised if they suceed. Anything unprecedented , outside the traditional top counties it gets more criticism. Well of course Dublin are a traditional county. When Dublin win 1 All Ireland there is no problem. But Dublin winning 6 in 8 years. That is unprecedented. When kilkenny or kerry win multiple All.Irelands there is little criticism. This is not new or unprecedented. People accept this.
Yes the Dubs are being treated unfairly. There is a definite difference in the way kilkenny or kerry or praised when they win multiple All.Irelands. The Dubs get criticised . The reason is say you are beaten by a team. You say Meath are to rough, Tyrone play puke football and underhand tactics Clare are to physical and Dublin have a money advantage. Then it gives a county an excuse. It like they were not beaten fairly. Its like they were not beaten at all. I dont know if that makes sense. But there is no doubt, people accept kilkenny and kerry winning 4 in a row. But not Dublin. The same way people accept kilkenny Tipp and Cork winning hurling titles, but not Clare.
Here is some examples
In late 80s Galway won 3 hurling titles. This was unprecedented for Galway. Galway were heavily criticised at the time for ruining hurling with their short passing possession game. 20 years later Cork won a two in a row with a more possession game. They were described as revolutionising the game and highly praised.
In late 90s Clare won 2 titles in 3 years. This was unprecedented for Clare. Clare were heavily criticised at the time for bringing to much physicality to the game of hurling. 10 years later kilkenny won 4 in a row bringing physicality to a level we had never seen before in hurling. They were called greatest team ever.
In 60s Down won 3 All-Irelands . This was unprecedented for Down and new. Down at the time were called upstarts. They were criticised at the time for ruining football by a playing a short passing possession game. In the next decade kerry and Dublin won All-Irelands with a more hand passing game. The Dubs and kerry were called grreatest teams ever.
In 1988 Meath won two in a row..This was unprecedented for Meath and new. In 88 final Meath were criticised and the final was criticised for being a rough match. It was a tough hard match between two big physical teams. Nothing more nothing less. 5 years earlier Dublin won an All-Ireland in the most violent final in Irish sporting history. The Dublin players were praised and called heroric and labeled the 12 Apostles.
In 00s Tyrone won 3 All-Irelands this was unprecedented. Tyrone had a defensive system with sweepers and blanket defence. There football was called puke football and they were criticised for underhand tactics eg sledging. Donegal won All All Ireland in 2012 with a more defensive system they were labelled as destroying gaelic football. Kerry in 2014 won an All-Ireland with a defensive system eg sweepers blanket defence. There was no criticism , they were praised.
Dublin won 6 All-Irelands in 8 years in this decade. This is unprecedented and new in the GAA world
.They are criticised about their finances and money buying All-Irelands. In 70s kerry won 8 Sams in 00s kilkenny won 6 All-Irelands they were not criticised at all.
So to Dublin supporters welcome to Meath Tyrone and Donegal footballers and Clare and Galway hurlers world. Any county that has unusual levels of sucess outside the norm are criticised in gaa land." Do you not get tired posting the same list of statistics over and over again?
kildare73 (Kildare) - Posts: 854 - 08/09/2018 10:26:43
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Dublin GAA representative in 2011 - "From a financial point of view we do need to be pushing for provincial status. Right now we have about 20% of the country's population...So it doesn't make sense that we should still be considered one 32th of the country, rather than 1/5"
This is the same argument I've made regards provincial status and the traditional values of the Railway Cup.
legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7871 - 08/09/2018 15:50:12
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Replying To legendzxix: "Dublin GAA representative in 2011 - "From a financial point of view we do need to be pushing for provincial status. Right now we have about 20% of the country's population...So it doesn't make sense that we should still be considered one 32th of the country, rather than 1/5"
This is the same argument I've made regards provincial status and the traditional values of the Railway Cup." We....
Is that all the journalists.
TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4445 - 08/09/2018 16:12:21
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http://www.punditarena.com/features/emackenna/mackenna-monday-dublin-railway-cups/
TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4445 - 08/09/2018 16:13:44
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Replying To TheUsername: "http://www.punditarena.com/features/emackenna/mackenna-monday-dublin-railway-cups/" I'm confused. Dublin got €16,612,847. Over 10 years. Which would work out per registered player, of which we have 39,000 I believe, at €42 per year. Is this excessive? I've seen other figures of €274 per registered player being bandied about by McKenna. Can anybody clarify?
Jackeen (Dublin) - Posts: 4097 - 08/09/2018 17:45:13
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I thought the same until someone told me a story about an awards dinner which some Dublin and tyrone player's attended. I was told that most of the attendees had their fill of food etc but a couple of Dublin players were given pre prepared lunchboxes. If this is true it takes dedication and professionalism to a new level in the GAA. It's a bit like the sky cycling team who talk about marginal gains and how much they contribute to their success.
Smiler21 (Tyrone) - Posts: 46 - 08/09/2018 21:41:01
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Really disappointed that people can't just admire this Dublin team and the work been done within the county.
If Dublin was spilt in two, does that mean that an astreix beside every county that wins an All Ireland is needed? Who would want to win dam, knowing that a county had to be spilt for them to win. I doubt kerry, mayo would be very happy. Thats a tarnished All Ireland in my opinion. Also, where does it stop? How many counties should be spilt and into how many splits till every county is equal to leitrim? Its just not possible. In regards to funding, there is huge competition for the hearts and minds within the city. Most of the league of Ireland is in Dublin. Leinster Rugby is huge, basketball also. For every GAA club there's about 3 soccer clubs. Di we teally want to give these codes the upper hand on the GAA??
Rohanhorsemaste (Tipperary) - Posts: 26 - 08/09/2018 23:16:36
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Replying To GeniusGerry: "Lol I spotted that too. Also stating the 2014 Kerry team received no criticism, I had a chuckle to myself there. This place went in to meltdown after that final, that team were called the 'worst team ever' to win one, 'stole' the All Ireland etc.
That's nitpicking though, great posts Furlong they are an interesting read fair play to you." Thanks Geniusgerry.
Yes there is criticism of kilkenny and kerry but it is mild and less severe compared to the criticism of other counties. People accept the greatness of kerry and kilkenny teams easier then other teams. Kerry and kilkenny deserve praise for all their extraordinary great players and great teams. But anything outside the norm in GAA in sucess is heavily criticised.
Was a kilkenny team or kerry ever criticised by GAA president after All Ireland final ?, was kerry or kilkenny teams ever described as playing puke hurling or puke football or called as destroying gaelic football or hurling. When kilkenny or kerry won a massive match in Croker were there calls ever into liveline to Joe Duffy the next day?. This is a different level of criticism. Tyrone Meath Donegal now Dublin footballers, Clare and Galway hurlers have faced. Kerry and Kilkenny havr faced criticised but is not as extreme or as severe as other counties. People accept the greatness of kilkenny hurling and kerry hurling. Of course you have people in Tipp criticising kilkeeny or some say kerry have an easy run to the finals. ( Something I dont agree with). But again its mild compared to the onslaught other counties face.
When Clare hurlers won in 95 it was welcome. By 97 the criticism was extreme and Clare were hated in GAA traditional hurling counties. When Galway won in 1980 it was welcome. By 1988 Galway hurlers were heavily criticised. The 1989 hurling semi final with Tipperary is the tensest roughest match I ever saw in Croker in hurling. After the match a Tipp fan ran on the field and screamed into Cyril Farrells face " I hate u Farrell.". That was the widespread feeling in hurling traditional counties at the time, that feeling of hatred towards Galway 87 88.
Look at limerick already people are criticising JP McManus. If limerick win 2 or 3 more All Irelands in next 5 or 6 years this criticism will reach fever pitch.
If Waterford win hurling title. It will be welcome. But if they win 2 or 3 they will be heavily criticised. Already McGrath gets serious criticism for sweeper system .
If Mayo win Sam. It will be welcome. But if they win 2 or 3 it will be criticised. Anything new or unprecedented outside the norm in terms of sucess in GAA is heavily criticised.
It not just GAA. look at soccer. Who was the most criticised and hated sucessful team in soccer in last 50 years, the most criticised. That was leeds Utd in 70s. The only team to win league titles outside the big 4 cities of london liverpool Manchester and Birmingham. lecister won a league it was welcome as it was a win for underdog and seen as a one off. If they were to win 2 or 3 leagues watch the criticism grow. Forests sucess was seen down to genius of Clough. The only other teams outside the big 4 cities were Blackburn and Leeds. Blackburn were accused of buying the league. But leeds who had the most consistent sucess, outside big 4 cities and the clubs in those cities, were the most criticised team and hated team in last 50 years in English soccer. So even it is an element that occurs even in professional sports. It just something I have noticed throughout the years.
Furlong1949 (Meath) - Posts: 1067 - 09/09/2018 00:03:01
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Replying To TheUsername: "What an absolutely brilliant and thought provoking post.
Thats exceptional analysis A Chara. One of the best things ive read ever on here, take a bow." Thanks The Username, your a gentleman.
Furlong1949 (Meath) - Posts: 1067 - 09/09/2018 00:11:33
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Replying To kildare73: "Do you not get tired posting the same list of statistics over and over again?" Fair enough.
But what I will say, is I like to back my argument up with stats and facts. So if I make point I always back it up with stats or a fact. I know its a bit repetitive, but thats how I roll.
I could have said the championship has been competitive for a long time. But if i give 10 stats to show that it makes my point stronger. Thats how I contribute to the forum. Im to old to change my ways now. Sorry for the repetition.
Furlong1949 (Meath) - Posts: 1067 - 09/09/2018 00:17:02
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Replying To Smiler21: "I thought the same until someone told me a story about an awards dinner which some Dublin and tyrone player's attended. I was told that most of the attendees had their fill of food etc but a couple of Dublin players were given pre prepared lunchboxes. If this is true it takes dedication and professionalism to a new level in the GAA. It's a bit like the sky cycling team who talk about marginal gains and how much they contribute to their success." Ah well, if someone told you a story then that clears it up.
What's your take on vampires and UFOs ?
Dubh_linn (Dublin) - Posts: 2312 - 09/09/2018 07:48:49
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Replying To Jackeen: "I'm confused. Dublin got €16,612,847. Over 10 years. Which would work out per registered player, of which we have 39,000 I believe, at €42 per year. Is this excessive? I've seen other figures of €274 per registered player being bandied about by McKenna. Can anybody clarify?" The naysayers are blinded by the big numbers (money) but somehow they can't/won't see how little it actually is given the number of players in Dublin.
arock (Dublin) - Posts: 4897 - 09/09/2018 09:38:33
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Replying To Jackeen: "I'm confused. Dublin got €16,612,847. Over 10 years. Which would work out per registered player, of which we have 39,000 I believe, at €42 per year. Is this excessive? I've seen other figures of €274 per registered player being bandied about by McKenna. Can anybody clarify?" Does that figure include free helmets and hurls for every under age player in Dublin? Just asking because a friend of mine needed both for his son and it was gona cost him £70. He has a friend in Dublin who told him he'd get him sorted. When he asked how much it would cost his friend told him not to worry, under age players in Dublin get them for free. That would be quite an annual bill.
SaffronDon (Antrim) - Posts: 2386 - 09/09/2018 10:57:20
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Replying To Furlong1949: "Fair enough.
But what I will say, is I like to back my argument up with stats and facts. So if I make point I always back it up with stats or a fact. I know its a bit repetitive, but thats how I roll.
I could have said the championship has been competitive for a long time. But if i give 10 stats to show that it makes my point stronger. Thats how I contribute to the forum. Im to old to change my ways now. Sorry for the repetition." The problem is you spend too much time looking backwards and not enough time talking about the future and the modern game. It's a very different game now and most of the commentary about even the last decade doesn't apply anymore. Fair enough back up your comments if you want but i think we need to look forwards, not backwards.
kildare73 (Kildare) - Posts: 854 - 09/09/2018 11:17:09
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Replying To SaffronDon: "Does that figure include free helmets and hurls for every under age player in Dublin? Just asking because a friend of mine needed both for his son and it was gona cost him £70. He has a friend in Dublin who told him he'd get him sorted. When he asked how much it would cost his friend told him not to worry, under age players in Dublin get them for free. That would be quite an annual bill." More fake news I'm afraid. Not in my club which is one of the larger clubs in Dublin too.
Jackeen (Dublin) - Posts: 4097 - 09/09/2018 12:17:41
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Replying To SaffronDon: "Does that figure include free helmets and hurls for every under age player in Dublin? Just asking because a friend of mine needed both for his son and it was gona cost him £70. He has a friend in Dublin who told him he'd get him sorted. When he asked how much it would cost his friend told him not to worry, under age players in Dublin get them for free. That would be quite an annual bill." There is no way that that is true.
It's an even more ridiculous idea that the one about the team getting their food delivered to them for breakfast, lunch and dinner everyday.
MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13718 - 09/09/2018 12:48:37
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Replying To kildare73: "The problem is you spend too much time looking backwards and not enough time talking about the future and the modern game. It's a very different game now and most of the commentary about even the last decade doesn't apply anymore. Fair enough back up your comments if you want but i think we need to look forwards, not backwards." Not sure both things need to be mutually exclusive, there is definitely a place in this community for those who have experience of the past to share that knowledge and wisdom and analysis of how it applies to the current context. Particularly the analysis on reaction on how success is digested in the regular GAA mindset. I dont always agree with Furlong, but he wrote some terrific stuff and provides great back up for his analysis, i really enjoy his posts.
TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4445 - 09/09/2018 12:56:59
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