National Forum

Killkenny vs Waterford (hurling)

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Cody owes Kilkenny nothing in all his years as manager he never once took payment for training the Senior team or attending medal presentations up and down the country. There are managers and coaches getting paid under the table. When your championship Year is on the line of course things happen in the heat of the moment.He will always admit defeat when his team loses and to him second is last. The same must be said for Kilkenny people I've sat beside many over the years and last night walking out of the game many commented on how great it was to see Waterford fans celebrating after so many years of hurt.
On the game itself Kilkenny were out fought and Waterford were probably worth their 7 point win but if Kilkenny had hurled the way they had in the last 10 minutes I think they would have won.
Kilkenny will always be competitive and going out this early won't do them any harm. Time to charge the batteries and I can guarantee we'll see a wounded cat next year with sharper claws ready for battle.
Well done to Waterford nice to a get monkey off the back but they will need to improve there almost afraid to win at times. Need to close out games better if Tipp or Galway were up 7 points with 6 minutes to go they wouldn't let Kilkenny back into the game.

WildPundit (Tipperary) - Posts: 1709 - 09/07/2017 10:03:50    2012812

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Yeah but are KK really out? I keep thinking somehow like the Terminator they're still not gone :)

Maroonatic (Galway) - Posts: 1060 - 09/07/2017 10:32:49    2012830

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Replying To bulmccabe:  "couldn't help it, smiling like a chesire cat pardon the pun kk fans, but being from a football county that would burn every hurly if they could it's great to be able to take in so many great games in one weekend. If it weren't for the presents I would only have been at the munster final, guess sometimes they do be listen to my rants in the kitchen. On a side note fair play to kk who battled like demons to get to extra time but maybe the mileage told at the end. Has been some 20yr run for them and cody and we can only admire their achievements. Going off track again what a game from the tipp footballers to oust cavan, going from the reports they really blew cavan away, nice to see a team playing football for a change."
ah I think hurling needs for Kilkenny to rest up a while...as I say elsewhere, other counties in Leinster got some terrible trimmings which I and many think put these counties back years...just hope some team like Waterford/Galway/Wexford or Clare now win it out..KK look knackered..wouldnt be surprised if theres a bit of unrest there...

Fairplayalways (Offaly) - Posts: 1035 - 09/07/2017 14:03:29    2012941

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I'd have been pretty peeved as a substitute to see Richie hogan being brought back on in extra time, he's offered little in the championship this year in my opinion.

Bon (Kildare) - Posts: 1929 - 09/07/2017 15:04:20    2012989

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Replying To endgame:  "Cockney cat.Raise a glass to Waterford and wish them well.Kilkenny won't be away for long.That's for sure.It would be great to see Waterford win the All-Ireland and I have no connection with the county."
endgame: I'll gladly raise a glass to Waterford, and Wexford too. I backed Waterford to win the AI at the beginning of the year, although I would have happily lost that bet yesterday. No one likes to see their county lose; but looking at the bigger picture, it's not good for the sport for one team to dominate for so long. I can now sit back and enjoy what could be a vintage year of hurling.

Cockney_Cat (UK) - Posts: 2485 - 09/07/2017 15:40:30    2013023

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Jennifer malone meets Pauric Mahony again, picture tells a thousand stories , my moment of the year so far

Damothedub (Dublin) - Posts: 5193 - 09/07/2017 15:45:07    2013032

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Congratulations to Waterford, better team in extra time. Ran at KK defence and got 2 goals in that period.
Should have won in normal time, but froze in last 10 minutes. Makes up for last year's disappointment.
Will be a very open All Ireland series this year

Where to for Kilkenny, tneir great spirit got them a draw after 70 minutes, but too many players looked ordinary yesterday. They probably need to add new faces to freshen things up.
Their underage teams are successful, maybe in a few years they will be contenders, but not as dominant as the last 10-15 years.

thelongridge (Offaly) - Posts: 1758 - 09/07/2017 16:02:39    2013062

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Replying To tiobraid:  "Been saying the same for the last few years. Could also be the reason (scoring goals) Galway wont win the All Ireland tho"
I guess you two guys need to stay on the same page as either of you are not too swift. Four goals scored and could have been two more.

Canuck (Waterford) - Posts: 2673 - 09/07/2017 18:29:11    2013233

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Exciting match but more scrappy than quality hurling which I'm afraid is the norm for Kilkenny performances these days. Waterford deserved the win. It was as disjointed a championship performance from a Kilkenny team as I've ever seen. There are good young hurlers in Kilkenny but there needs to be a serious overhaul of how we approach matches from a tactical point of view because, aside from the technical deficiencies of the team, which are plentiful, it's obvious that there is no gamelan going into matches, it's just lump it in long and high and hope for the best. Could get away with it when we had great players but not now. It's depressing when you compare it to the quality of ball going into the Cork full forward line today.

ballydalane (Kilkenny) - Posts: 1246 - 09/07/2017 21:10:42    2013386

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Replying To ballydalane:  "Exciting match but more scrappy than quality hurling which I'm afraid is the norm for Kilkenny performances these days. Waterford deserved the win. It was as disjointed a championship performance from a Kilkenny team as I've ever seen. There are good young hurlers in Kilkenny but there needs to be a serious overhaul of how we approach matches from a tactical point of view because, aside from the technical deficiencies of the team, which are plentiful, it's obvious that there is no gamelan going into matches, it's just lump it in long and high and hope for the best. Could get away with it when we had great players but not now. It's depressing when you compare it to the quality of ball going into the Cork full forward line today."
I was making that point even when ye were winning. The great KK team had ridiculous ball winning forwards...every one of them. Once the Cork team went, there was no back could come close to them in the air until Tipp started to challenge....but KK were still winning more ball more often than not.
I'd say Cody might shake up his backroom team again next year to counteract this. It's a big blow to the development of the new players to be gone already.

tiobraid (Tipperary) - Posts: 4119 - 10/07/2017 08:25:03    2013642

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Replying To Canuck:  "I guess you two guys need to stay on the same page as either of you are not too swift. Four goals scored and could have been two more."
Fair point but you have to agree they haven't scored enough goals over the last few years? Excellent goals on Saturday.

tiobraid (Tipperary) - Posts: 4119 - 10/07/2017 08:27:28    2013644

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Replying To tiobraid:  "I was making that point even when ye were winning. The great KK team had ridiculous ball winning forwards...every one of them. Once the Cork team went, there was no back could come close to them in the air until Tipp started to challenge....but KK were still winning more ball more often than not.
I'd say Cody might shake up his backroom team again next year to counteract this. It's a big blow to the development of the new players to be gone already."
I don't think it matters who Cody has in his backroom team, his basic philosophy won't change - "we're going to lump it in long and high and you're going to like it, and if you don't we'll put someone else in that does." Kilkenny forwards don't show for balls any more and shur why would they? They know the ball is going to be lumped in long and high, no point in making a run looking for a pass in front of them.

An interesting vignette from the match on Saturday night, Lester Ryan (who in fairness hurled well when he came on but his use of the ball has always been poor in my opinion) with plenty of time to pick a pass, lumped the ball in long and high to Richie Hogan. Waterford defender won the ball and was then fouled by Hogan. Hogan berated Ryan, jabbing his finger into the Thurles turf to say "hit the fecking ball in low!!" Amazing that this wouldn't have been discussed or planned before a major championship match. Hogan's confidence and form has been very poor but the quality of ball going into him is also a factor in that. If he was getting the type of ball that the Cork full forwards were getting yesterday, his confidence and form would come back.

ballydalane (Kilkenny) - Posts: 1246 - 10/07/2017 09:55:33    2013726

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Replying To ballydalane:  "I don't think it matters who Cody has in his backroom team, his basic philosophy won't change - "we're going to lump it in long and high and you're going to like it, and if you don't we'll put someone else in that does." Kilkenny forwards don't show for balls any more and shur why would they? They know the ball is going to be lumped in long and high, no point in making a run looking for a pass in front of them.

An interesting vignette from the match on Saturday night, Lester Ryan (who in fairness hurled well when he came on but his use of the ball has always been poor in my opinion) with plenty of time to pick a pass, lumped the ball in long and high to Richie Hogan. Waterford defender won the ball and was then fouled by Hogan. Hogan berated Ryan, jabbing his finger into the Thurles turf to say "hit the fecking ball in low!!" Amazing that this wouldn't have been discussed or planned before a major championship match. Hogan's confidence and form has been very poor but the quality of ball going into him is also a factor in that. If he was getting the type of ball that the Cork full forwards were getting yesterday, his confidence and form would come back."
It's ahrd for anyone to argue with you in fairness. The only game I remember KK having a tactic was when ye targeted John O'Keefe in the 2011 (I think) final but that was still high ball into Shefflin. How do you change it considering the backs are used to driving it in long. The likes of Paul Murphy and Tommy Walsh always hit it in high and long.
There'll never be a team of forwards again as good in the air as Larkin, Power, Reid, Shefflin, etc.

tiobraid (Tipperary) - Posts: 4119 - 10/07/2017 12:43:15    2013931

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