National Forum

Kerry's easy path

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It's laughable. Connacht and Leinster are no stronger than Munster and never really were. The difference is Kerry have had better players over the years, as unpalatable as that fact is for the begrudgers.

Ulster has been very competitive since the 90s, and yes this certainly puts those teams at a bit of a disadvantage. Nobody else has any right to complain. To see dubs on here whining about kerrys easy path is simply hilarious.

GeniusGerry (Kerry) - Posts: 2105 - 01/06/2017 19:00:33    1993214

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Replying To clondalkindub:  "That's cause Cork playing hurling to so we respect their achievement a bit more. You played Clare Tipp and Clare to get to an All Ireland semi in what world do you think that's a fair system? no one is disputing your the kings of football but sweet Jesus yous have had it handy over the years and to then say "oh Clare are improving" Do me a favour they'll be gone missing again in no time just like Wexford in 08 or Leitrim in '94. In '97 just to reach a final you played Waterford Clare and Cavan ffs. At least I can admit if Leinster stays the same for another 50 years then Dublin will win a heap more of Sams cause it's so handy right now, but Meath and Kildare will be back soon it won't last forever them being so bad. You'd swear hoganstand was making their article up."
Don't forget dublin 95. Clare qualified for the quarters, they could just have easily gotten Dublin. You can't blame the lack of quality in the GAA on Kerry. We keep hearing about how tough the other provinces are but what happened donegal in 14 or tyrone on 15? We have won every single game we ever played in the qualifiers against teams from every province.
The Dubs love bigging themselves up by piggybacking on Kerry's success in the 70's and 80's but mick o Dwyer said the toughest team kerry played against during that period was cork.
In any decade, any Kerry fan would have happily switched with the Dubs to only have Meath to contend with as opposed to Cork

as_ky (Kerry) - Posts: 535 - 01/06/2017 19:02:44    1993216

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Replying To OLLIE:  "
Replying To TheHermit:  "[quote=OLLIE:  "[quote=TheHermit:  "And as a final comment on this, to see a poster from Dublin going on about another county having a easy provincial route! Jesus wept. :D

P.S. to be a little more serious, Munster the weakest Liam? Really? When's the last time a team from Connacht won an All-Ireland or a team from Leinster outside Dublin?

How come since the advent of the back door there has only been three All-Ireland's contested by teams from the same province and twice it was Cork/Kerry!

In fact since 2001, tell me how many times a team from Connacht or Leinster (outside of Mayo and Dublin) have even reached an AL semi-final! I'll tell you, twice: Meath 01 and 09!

Long love the Munster football championship and give me Clare v Kerry any day over Down and Armagh this Sunday!"
Don't forget Kildare in 2010. They reached the All Ireland semi-final."
My apologies, I forgot Kildare got that far. I thought they lost to Down in the Q-final but it was actually us they beat, will we ever beat them in the Championship!,"]I am sure Kerry will beat Down one day in the Championship. I thought the Kingdom would finally do it in 2010."]I thought so too, but it wasn't to be. It was one of those rare days when Kerry just didn't perform in Croke Park. Tomas and Galvin (I think) were suspended too that match. And we missed about 4 goal chances that usually Gooch or Star would have put away in their sleep. After the epic extra time replay win in the Munster final down in PUC I thought we had another All-Ireland in our sights that year. Ah well, fair play to Down that year. If only they had a bit more of that belief in themselves in the final they could have taken Cork.

TheHermit (Kerry) - Posts: 6354 - 01/06/2017 19:09:08    1993218

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Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "Since the qualifiers began we have played 12 qualifier games and we have won all 12, that's a100% record and we are the only team in the country to have such a record .

100%

So who want to explain that one?"
Wee will take a look at the teams that Kerry have faced in the qualifiers.

2002: beat Wicklow
2002: beat Fermanagh
2002: beat Kildare
2006: beat Longford
2008: beat Monaghan
2009: beat Longford
2009: beat Sligo
2009: beat Antrim
2012: beat Westmeath
2012: beat Tyrone
2012: beat Clare

Kerry can only beat what's put in front of them. Only two of them teams have won All Ireland's. Tyrone last won it in 2008, while Kildare last won it in 1928.

OLLIE (Louth) - Posts: 12224 - 01/06/2017 19:29:52    1993230

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Replying To OLLIE:  "Wee will take a look at the teams that Kerry have faced in the qualifiers.

2002: beat Wicklow
2002: beat Fermanagh
2002: beat Kildare
2006: beat Longford
2008: beat Monaghan
2009: beat Longford
2009: beat Sligo
2009: beat Antrim
2012: beat Westmeath
2012: beat Tyrone
2012: beat Clare

Kerry can only beat what's put in front of them. Only two of them teams have won All Ireland's. Tyrone last won it in 2008, while Kildare last won it in 1928."
Roscommon 2002 or was that a Q-final?

TheHermit (Kerry) - Posts: 6354 - 01/06/2017 19:41:29    1993236

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Replying To greatpoint:  "And what does that have to do with the price of butter in Listowel?"
Well it mean we win even when we're not playing in Munster, that's 12 out of 12 wins in the qualifiers 100% record kid ;-)

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 01/06/2017 19:42:07    1993237

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Replying To OLLIE:  "Cork in the Munster Final in 2015 after a replay."
Wow.

Almost two years and played in a final and semi.

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4445 - 01/06/2017 19:44:22    1993238

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Kerry have it easy in Munster especially given how competitive the games are in all the other provinces. But that's not the only problem. They have also won the most National Leagues and percentage wise as many Leagues as Championships. So something needs to be done about division one.

As for Kilkenny the new proposal is that for a trial period they should be made play with one hand tied behind their back (they can choose which one). If that doesn't work then both hands should be tied.

And don't get me started on the Cork ladies and all the handy All Irelands they have won ….

ky_dub (Kerry) - Posts: 16 - 01/06/2017 19:51:21    1993241

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Replying To TheUsername:  "Wow.

Almost two years and played in a final and semi."
Wow is right. They were All Ireland Champions holders back then.

OLLIE (Louth) - Posts: 12224 - 01/06/2017 19:54:43    1993243

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I think Limerick have played in two quarter finals in recent years.

Killarney.87 (Tipperary) - Posts: 2513 - 01/06/2017 20:05:10    1993249

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It will all be corrected by next year with the super 8s. The Ulster council would do well to run the fixtures earlier next year. The u21 farce we faced this year was pretty much their fault, not the structure of the competition

Donegalman (None) - Posts: 3830 - 01/06/2017 20:13:38    1993252

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Replying To TheUsername:  "Wow.

Almost two years and played in a final and semi."
Well what do you want?

The provincial winners to all play off in the Q-finals instead?

Clare got to the Q-final last year on merit, ditto Kildare the year before and Tyrone in the semi after. It was an open draw for the qualifier winners and they all got Kerry.

In 2014 to win the title we beat Cork, Donegal and Mayo - 3 Division one teams.

Some years you get drawn against the big guns all the way , some years you get some of the lesser lights along the way. That's sport.

As one of my fellow countymen said above, Dublin have no leg to stand on when it comes to whinging about the provincial set up.

And Kerry's domination wasn't built on Croke Park's money either ;D

TheHermit (Kerry) - Posts: 6354 - 01/06/2017 20:16:09    1993255

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At the end of the day, when it comes down to the business end of the season all ireland semis and the final, teams have plenty of time to prepare themselves and be fresh and ready. You can put all your excuses forward that you want but everyone knows the real championship starts in croker when there is no excuses to be had and nowhere to hide. We have won the all ireland 37 times and each time we done the necessary at the business end when it all counts.

as_ky (Kerry) - Posts: 535 - 01/06/2017 20:23:02    1993256

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Replying To OLLIE:  "Wee will take a look at the teams that Kerry have faced in the qualifiers.

2002: beat Wicklow
2002: beat Fermanagh
2002: beat Kildare
2006: beat Longford
2008: beat Monaghan
2009: beat Longford
2009: beat Sligo
2009: beat Antrim
2012: beat Westmeath
2012: beat Tyrone
2012: beat Clare

Kerry can only beat what's put in front of them. Only two of them teams have won All Ireland's. Tyrone last won it in 2008, while Kildare last won it in 1928."
Exactly we can only play what's put in front of us , but it doesn't matter as we'd adapt and overcome and dominate in whatever province ye'd like to put us.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 01/06/2017 20:43:24    1993262

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Replying To TheHermit:  "Well what do you want?

The provincial winners to all play off in the Q-finals instead?

Clare got to the Q-final last year on merit, ditto Kildare the year before and Tyrone in the semi after. It was an open draw for the qualifier winners and they all got Kerry.

In 2014 to win the title we beat Cork, Donegal and Mayo - 3 Division one teams.

Some years you get drawn against the big guns all the way , some years you get some of the lesser lights along the way. That's sport.

As one of my fellow countymen said above, Dublin have no leg to stand on when it comes to whinging about the provincial set up.

And Kerry's domination wasn't built on Croke Park's money either ;D"
I think anyone who says Kerry and Dublin come out of tough provinces is being disingenuous mate. There are only two teams from those provinces in Div 1.

I would accept Kerry can only play what's put in front of them, but in that time:

Dublin have played and beaten, Mayo (twice), Kerry, Donegal, Kerry and Mayo (twice).

Mayo have played: Donegal, Dublin (Twice), Tyrone, Dublin (twice)

It's an amazing bit of luck when you consider the rest period other bigger provinces don't get. As I sad Kerry can only play who they are drawn against, but it is very lucky.

The nub of the article really for me, is not so much about critising Kerry, but how having a decent team in Munster and the make up of the Munster championship gives an advantage for August/Sep football.

I think what is also worth noting Is Dublins dominance of the game has coincided with Leinster maybe dropping to a similar standard of Munster historically. There may be an arguement there that Dublin and Kerry are sharing a level playing field, equity and many of the same advantages of enabling preparation for freshness in Aug/Sep for the first team ever.

Thus maybe they are going toe to toe in terms of equity for the first time ever. The result in terms of dominance are interesting. So far.......:)

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4445 - 01/06/2017 20:44:47    1993265

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Replying To as_ky:  "At the end of the day, when it comes down to the business end of the season all ireland semis and the final, teams have plenty of time to prepare themselves and be fresh and ready. You can put all your excuses forward that you want but everyone knows the real championship starts in croker when there is no excuses to be had and nowhere to hide. We have won the all ireland 37 times and each time we done the necessary at the business end when it all counts."
I'm not so sure it does mate, it does for Kerry and Dublin. But there are clearly provinces bing disenfranchised and blocked from growing through expierence in the championship. There was one team from Leinster in Div 1 this year the same from Munster there was 4 from Ulster.

Both me and you are already looking at Semi finals pairings, there are 3 division 1 teams in Ulster going to traipse around the country, playing weekly flog themselves to xhaustion, to get to somewhere Kerry and Dublin are going to be without breaking a sweat. That is wrong.

The Championship always has and still is inequitable and pathways have been easier for some frequently at different times in history.

Not sure that justifies gloating.

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4445 - 01/06/2017 20:54:00    1993269

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Replying To TheUsername:  "I think anyone who says Kerry and Dublin come out of tough provinces is being disingenuous mate. There are only two teams from those provinces in Div 1.

I would accept Kerry can only play what's put in front of them, but in that time:

Dublin have played and beaten, Mayo (twice), Kerry, Donegal, Kerry and Mayo (twice).

Mayo have played: Donegal, Dublin (Twice), Tyrone, Dublin (twice)

It's an amazing bit of luck when you consider the rest period other bigger provinces don't get. As I sad Kerry can only play who they are drawn against, but it is very lucky.

The nub of the article really for me, is not so much about critising Kerry, but how having a decent team in Munster and the make up of the Munster championship gives an advantage for August/Sep football.

I think what is also worth noting Is Dublins dominance of the game has coincided with Leinster maybe dropping to a similar standard of Munster historically. There may be an arguement there that Dublin and Kerry are sharing a level playing field, equity and many of the same advantages of enabling preparation for freshness in Aug/Sep for the first team ever.

Thus maybe they are going toe to toe in terms of equity for the first time ever. The result in terms of dominance are interesting. So far.......:)"
The article is a barely veiled attempt to discredit Kerry's record.

Connact is no stronger than Munster. Mayo and Galway should have more All Irelands, why don't they if all you need is a weak province?

Leinster was always competitive enough but I'd question the standard quite frankly. Dublins main rival has always been Meath, who have roughly the same championship record as Cork. Have Dublin really had it that much harder over the years? I don't think so. They always had a reasonable path to August football as well, but just weren't good enough to capitalise until recent years. That's not Kerry's fault.

GeniusGerry (Kerry) - Posts: 2105 - 01/06/2017 21:10:30    1993279

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Replying To GeniusGerry:  "The article is a barely veiled attempt to discredit Kerry's record.

Connact is no stronger than Munster. Mayo and Galway should have more All Irelands, why don't they if all you need is a weak province?

Leinster was always competitive enough but I'd question the standard quite frankly. Dublins main rival has always been Meath, who have roughly the same championship record as Cork. Have Dublin really had it that much harder over the years? I don't think so. They always had a reasonable path to August football as well, but just weren't good enough to capitalise until recent years. That's not Kerry's fault."
To be fair mate, when you look at the spread of All -Irelands across the years per province , a fair proportion of counties in Leinster have won it. In fact a lot of Leinster counties did it by beating Kerry through the decades.

I'm not here to defend Dublin, we do what we do. I will let other posters decide on the historical strength of Leinster and comparatively its strength to Munster historically.

I think both are of an equal footing of standard presently. It is fascinating the Dublins dominance contemporarily speaking in modern times, when given the same standard of compition provincially with Kerry. I think that's the nub of the aeticl really, both counties are enjoying the same advantage presently.

It's just an analysis really, on what we are seeing provinically and who is winning all Ireland's and likely contributing factors.

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4445 - 01/06/2017 21:41:35    1993291

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Replying To TheUsername:  "To be fair mate, when you look at the spread of All -Irelands across the years per province , a fair proportion of counties in Leinster have won it. In fact a lot of Leinster counties did it by beating Kerry through the decades.

I'm not here to defend Dublin, we do what we do. I will let other posters decide on the historical strength of Leinster and comparatively its strength to Munster historically.

I think both are of an equal footing of standard presently. It is fascinating the Dublins dominance contemporarily speaking in modern times, when given the same standard of compition provincially with Kerry. I think that's the nub of the aeticl really, both counties are enjoying the same advantage presently.

It's just an analysis really, on what we are seeing provinically and who is winning all Ireland's and likely contributing factors."
Most of the Munster counties have also won it at some stage, and Cork are one of the top tier footballing counties historically.

I think Kerry's advantage is overplayed, however I do agree that Ulster teams have a raw deal and a restructure of the championship is long overdue.

GeniusGerry (Kerry) - Posts: 2105 - 01/06/2017 22:46:59    1993316

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any thread on this about dublin's easy past , its not like there is anyone to come within 10 points of them in leinster and that's how many years now???

fact of the matter is kerrys route is no harder then dublins, mayo the same bar one game against galway . , munnster is harder then both provinces this year only ulster is stronger ,

cork clare and tipperary lose players every year to hurling and still all will be operating from division 2 up and last year reached the 4th round, 1/4 finals and semi finals respectably , much further then several connacht or leinster teams , its a bullshit argument and a good job there is so much hurling in munster given how bad some of the traditional football counties have gone

GameOfThrones (Clare) - Posts: 3 - 01/06/2017 22:56:28    1993320

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