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Replying To clondalkindub: "But there has to be a bigger picture , Dublin won't always be as good as they are now, I honestly don't think Gaelic football can keep getting people to pay money to watch that type of game. Ive stop going to home league games involving northern teams cause it's a bore fest. I know it will probably never be what it was but 15 players in their own half is brutal stuff to watch." Take a look closer to home. Dublin play a blanket aswell with or without northern teams been involved!!!!!!!!!
letterkennyGuy (Donegal) - Posts: 153 - 27/02/2017 11:19:21
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Replying To clondalkindub: "But there has to be a bigger picture , Dublin won't always be as good as they are now, I honestly don't think Gaelic football can keep getting people to pay money to watch that type of game. Ive stop going to home league games involving northern teams cause it's a bore fest. I know it will probably never be what it was but 15 players in their own half is brutal stuff to watch." I see you point clondalkindub. Dublin do a good job promoting their season tickets and league games. The prospect of 3 home games against 3 northern teams that will set up defensively must be a hard sell!
Defensive games aren't all bad though and I though yesterdays game was one of the better ones. Maybe it was the teams involved as you say - Dubs unbeaten record on the line made it interesting.
In my opinion It's as much the fear of losing possession is the problem as much as the mass defensive. There were an awful lot of chances yesterday where guys had a yard of space 35 / 40 yards out but opted to recycle possession rather than shoot. It's so hard to win the ball back with the other side playing the possession game too no risky shots are taken but more often than not the ball was lost in the search of the a perfect opportunity.
Donegal had a good chance to win this game but kept passing the ball around probing for the perfect opportunity and ended up caught by the final whistle.
dahayeser (Cork) - Posts: 337 - 27/02/2017 11:39:14
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Replying To jacktheDub: "It was a bit like Donegal last year they started of the league more attack minded then as soon as Dublin come along they revert to type I have always felt if teams pushed up on Dublin more and put more pressure on them they will get more joy. On yesterday's game on the balance of play Dublin probably deserved the win felt Donegal were living of scraps a bit. 2 extremely poor goals cost us and Rock missed a few free's which in the end is why we didn't win. Couple of big games for Dublin coming up we want to make the league final." I was shocked to see how defensive Dublin were against a very inexperienced Donegal team which was highlighted by that period of poscession Donegal had in the last minute.They were faced by a complete Blue blanket and were unable to find an opening,True they were looking for the perfect opening and afraid to lose the ball,Maybe they could have gambled a bit more.
gunman (Donegal) - Posts: 1057 - 27/02/2017 11:52:23
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Dublin usually play more men in defence when they play against northern teams, it's just to counteract the tactic. Considering how badly they got burned by Donegal in 14 it's no surprise they set up this way. Kerry used that tactic in the final against Donegal in 14 and it worked wonders.
Dublin don't play a blanket against the likes of Kerry or Mayo, yes they get men back but never to the 13/14 men behind the ball that we saw yesterday. I've seen Dublin play large numbers in defence but still rack up large scores.
Look at the difference in the number of completed kick passes in yesterdays game, Dublin and Kerry are able to mix it up. They're not restricting themselves to the one style of play
keithlemon (Australia) - Posts: 920 - 27/02/2017 12:01:01
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Anyone who can get players fitness level up to the point where they can cover 14 km in a game are going to pull everyone back and counterattack. Dublin same as others believe it or not.
With increased fitness levels GAA could make game more attractive by trying out 13 a side. Option of increasing size of pitches obviously not as easy to do.
Ashrules (Dublin) - Posts: 518 - 27/02/2017 12:22:49
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Replying To letterkennyGuy: "Take a look closer to home. Dublin play a blanket aswell with or without northern teams been involved!!!!!!!!!" Dublin adjust to whatever team their playing against and yes they drop players back but not every single time they lose possession. Donegal lost possession yesterday every single man runs back to defend apart from one forward every so often stays up front. The only way to beat a blanket team is to copy the exact same as them. your own supporters (who were sound) were giving out saying the game is gone to sh*te with this defensive stuff.
clondalkindub (Dublin) - Posts: 9926 - 27/02/2017 12:34:27
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Both teams used yesterday to learn something and in that aspect it worked out well. Not correct to say Dublin had same tactic as Donegal. Dublin didn't leave one forward up on his own. Dub forwards tracked and tackled hard on Donegal backs but they generally kept their forward position.
Dilemma for Donegal, in containing Dublin, is how do they get enough chances themselves going forward? Two goals helped of course but unlikely to get same chances in a big game. Mayo somewhat have the same dilemma. Have proved they can make it difficult for Dublin but do not quite have enough to outscore them.
poguemahone (Dublin) - Posts: 365 - 27/02/2017 12:37:12
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The definition of insanity is doing the same mistake over and over. Thankfully we didnt do this yesterday. We played kerry 3 weeks ago in a very open game of football, and our young players simply could not keep up with kerry. Thankfully, the following week we tightened up a bit and won. We tightened up even more yesterday and took a point out of a game against one of the best teams ever to play the game. All within a month, Donegal with a brand new team of youngsters made an adjustment and are competitive again. Was the game exciting? It was enthralling to be at it. The skills of tackling and pressure passing at a complete sprint were on display for the entire game. There were no hold ups, nor were there any cynical attempts to stop the game flowing. It had one yellow card i believe in 70 minutes of football, perhaps there was another, but I cant remember it. It had 3 goals. There was never more than 4 points between the sides, and for most of the game, the margin was more like 2. This is what I want to pay in and see.
There is a mater of opinion about the choice to recycle the ball rather than to put it into a congested area and hope for the best. I think that teams being patient is something that the more astute football supporter who understands the game will get. Turn overs are now a major factor in the winning and losing of matches.
The game changes over time. The time of 'backs in front of your man' would not get you very far in the last 30 years, yet it was a very important tactic up until the mid to late 80s. There is a long list here of tactical changes that have been made to the game over time. The game adapts and evolves. So too do the rules. There will be another tweak before long, a team that comes from somewhere and sees a trend or an advantage by doing something some other way. The rest will follow.
Donegalman (None) - Posts: 3830 - 27/02/2017 13:43:04
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Replying To waynoI: "Hill, its a team game.
Not a game for individuals.
All successful teams in every single sport play as a team no matter how good/skilful one individual is.
My point is, I agree with you to a point, 1v1, forward v defender it takes a great defensive skill to come out of that 1v1 with possession. But doing what Donegal do, and lets not just say Donegal, because we absolutely 100% do it at times, and did so today, takes the whole team to perform it. Its really not as simple as just getting 14 lads behind the ball and filling space, There is more to it than that, If it was as simple as what you make it, Clare or Limerick could do it in a one off game against Kerry and make It as competitive and difficult to score as we found it today, And Donegal too.
Offaly couldn't just wake up on a sunday morning of a game against the dubs in croker and say, right lads we will play everyone behind the ball and keep it close for 70 minutes or keep it competitive, get a draw or even beat us. It takes weeks, months, even years of practice to get it off too a T.
Sport is about winning, Teams will enjoy what they do when they are winning. Its as simple as that.
Fans are the same, If you said to a Meath man tomorrow, Or an Offaly, Clare, or Sligo fan if they would care if they play amore defensive plan if it meant winning a provincial crown and possibly competing against the top 4 or 5 teams in the country in croker, they would bite your arm off.
And I guarantee you right now that their attendances at games would increase tenfold." If someone told me that Wicklow would win a Leinster playing that crap I certainly wouldn't be biting their arm off.I've been going to games all my life and it has become unwatchable in its present state
L
dubarra (Wicklow) - Posts: 541 - 27/02/2017 15:23:18
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Replying To Fairplayalways: "watched the 1st half and I have to say I enjoyed it given the condition of pitch etc...was out walking for second half so only heard updates on headphones on radio one...couldnt believe it only ended 2-05 to 1-08...maybe the second half was very defensive but the 1st certainly wasnt..." So you enjoyed the first half so much that you went for a walk rather than watch the second half. How did you manage to take your eyes off it at all I wonder
dubarra (Wicklow) - Posts: 541 - 27/02/2017 15:30:29
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Replying To dubarra: "If someone told me that Wicklow would win a Leinster playing that crap I certainly wouldn't be biting their arm off.I've been going to games all my life and it has become unwatchable in its present state
L" But you could just delude yourself into thinking the opposition started it and high-horse your way to your first ever Leinster title without giving a flying f*** what style you played.
Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12120 - 27/02/2017 15:58:25
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regarding this thread, did you see the goal scored in the EFL cup by Southampton that was ruled out. It was a perfectly good goal but ruled offside. Gaelic not only sport with problems.
galwayford (Galway) - Posts: 2519 - 27/02/2017 16:01:33
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Replying To royaldunne: "The game itself as a spectecle on TV was appalling of course been there it's going to be intense and exciting, but as a neutral sitting back it can be hard to watch. Now don't get me wrong Donegal are perfectionists at defensive game and it takes some amount of training and skill to do it that good. I can see both sides. No point in Donegal going man to man and getting hammered by the better players instead do what they do best (btw Dublin are probably next best at it) but it's hard watching on tele." What type of football does Meath play. Galway will knock the stuffing out of them in Navan. I hope.
galwayford (Galway) - Posts: 2519 - 27/02/2017 16:03:15
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Replying To dubarra: "If someone told me that Wicklow would win a Leinster playing that crap I certainly wouldn't be biting their arm off.I've been going to games all my life and it has become unwatchable in its present state
L" lol
Lockjaw (Donegal) - Posts: 9136 - 27/02/2017 16:09:20
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Funny how tight defending is never a problem in other sports. In soccer or rugby, a lock-down defence is praised; the onus is on the opposition to find a way through, instead of crying about the game now being 'too difficult for the poor attackers'.
There are two reasons for all the crying:
- superiority complex: it allows a certain type of Southern pundit feel superior (Donegal is technically in the so-called 'South', but as we all know, there isn't even a rail link to it from the South, and they're now planning to scrap even the bus link); and
- an inability to move with the times: it derives from a view that Gaelic football is about 14 outfield players staying in their own wee patch of grass and competing 'man to man' (while colleens dance at crossroads etc)
In reality, nowadays, there are only seven positions on a modern Gaelic football team:
1. Man-marker
2. Channel blocker
3. Line breaker
4. Midfield anchor
5. Midfield linkman
6. Shooter
7. Point of attack
See:
http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/columnists/paddy-heaney/new-position-needed-on-line-ups-333297.html
This is why those bitter old has-beens in the Sunday Game are no longer fit for purpose - they don't seem to understand the modern game - or, more likely, don't wish to acquire any new tricks - and instead of trying to clue up about it and, you know, move with the times, they sit there reliving the footballing equivalent of the steam age and bitching about the present.
Still, I suppose all the bitching keeps them happy
essmac (Tyrone) - Posts: 1141 - 27/02/2017 16:19:09
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Replying To galwayford: "regarding this thread, did you see the goal scored in the EFL cup by Southampton that was ruled out. It was a perfectly good goal but ruled offside. Gaelic not only sport with problems." Yeah once I saw a tennis match and a ball that was in was called out. Really makes you think.
Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12120 - 27/02/2017 16:20:30
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Considering the ground conditions, I thought the Donegal/Dublin game had many excellent qualities. The ability of ball-carriers to twist and turn at pace and under pressure, on such a slippery surface, had to be applauded. Backs had to be extremely disciplined in going in to the tackle as once committed to the tackle it was nearly impossible to get any traction to stop. In the rugby international played yesterday, the England players were unable to think 'on their feet' and had to wait for their coach to tell them, at half-time, how to combat Italian tactics. In Ballyboffey, the players did their thinking on the pitch and it was intriguing to watch both sets of players trying a variety of approaches to get through tight defences. I must say that I thoroughly enjoyed the game. Of course there were some negatives in the game but it is more interesting and enjoyable to concentrate on all the positives.
neverright (Roscommon) - Posts: 1648 - 27/02/2017 17:24:30
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Replying To essmac: "Funny how tight defending is never a problem in other sports. In soccer or rugby, a lock-down defence is praised; the onus is on the opposition to find a way through, instead of crying about the game now being 'too difficult for the poor attackers'. There are two reasons for all the crying: - superiority complex: it allows a certain type of Southern pundit feel superior (Donegal is technically in the so-called 'South', but as we all know, there isn't even a rail link to it from the South, and they're now planning to scrap even the bus link); and - an inability to move with the times: it derives from a view that Gaelic football is about 14 outfield players staying in their own wee patch of grass and competing 'man to man' (while colleens dance at crossroads etc) In reality, nowadays, there are only seven positions on a modern Gaelic football team: 1. Man-marker 2. Channel blocker 3. Line breaker 4. Midfield anchor 5. Midfield linkman 6. Shooter 7. Point of attack See: http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/columnists/paddy-heaney/new-position-needed-on-line-ups-333297.htmlThis is why those bitter old has-beens in the Sunday Game are no longer fit for purpose - they don't seem to understand the modern game - or, more likely, don't wish to acquire any new tricks - and instead of trying to clue up about it and, you know, move with the times, they sit there reliving the footballing equivalent of the steam age and bitching about the present. Still, I suppose all the bitching keeps them happy"
GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7346 - 27/02/2017 18:52:18
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Replying To essmac: "Funny how tight defending is never a problem in other sports. In soccer or rugby, a lock-down defence is praised; the onus is on the opposition to find a way through, instead of crying about the game now being 'too difficult for the poor attackers'. There are two reasons for all the crying: - superiority complex: it allows a certain type of Southern pundit feel superior (Donegal is technically in the so-called 'South', but as we all know, there isn't even a rail link to it from the South, and they're now planning to scrap even the bus link); and - an inability to move with the times: it derives from a view that Gaelic football is about 14 outfield players staying in their own wee patch of grass and competing 'man to man' (while colleens dance at crossroads etc) In reality, nowadays, there are only seven positions on a modern Gaelic football team: 1. Man-marker 2. Channel blocker 3. Line breaker 4. Midfield anchor 5. Midfield linkman 6. Shooter 7. Point of attack See: http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/columnists/paddy-heaney/new-position-needed-on-line-ups-333297.htmlThis is why those bitter old has-beens in the Sunday Game are no longer fit for purpose - they don't seem to understand the modern game - or, more likely, don't wish to acquire any new tricks - and instead of trying to clue up about it and, you know, move with the times, they sit there reliving the footballing equivalent of the steam age and bitching about the present. Still, I suppose all the bitching keeps them happy"
Also yesterday a rugby team of limited ability came up with a perfectly legal way of playing to stop a superior opponent that made the game a bit of a farce to watch and play in, similar to the blanket defence in football - within hours there were serious calls for rule changes.
As for the 7 positions it is woeful nonsense - for a start I'd love to know how many sides currently play with no goalkeeper like you seem to suggest
Soma (UK) - Posts: 2630 - 27/02/2017 19:38:37
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In fairness to donegal they made a game of it with a team missing so many ..was'nt dublins best either side out either but a good enough test on a crap mudhole of a pitch in febuary..come championship time dubs will raring to go..not sure that donegal can offer much more to be honest..
GGdub (Dublin) - Posts: 260 - 27/02/2017 19:56:08
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