National Forum

The Talent Drain

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David Clifford making headlines again tonight but Kerry fans excitement is quelled by the fact we know fine well he might follow the likes of Kennelly, Walsh and O'Connor and head to Oz. Kerry are not the exception here, effecting counties across the country. Really takes away from the game when it is getting robbed of its future superstars.
The GAA should have implemented a plan long ago to tackle this but they have been non responsive as of yet. You can have a packed Croke Park on all ireland final day and the stewards get paid more than the lads on the pitch. Surely it is time now to bring is some form of monetary reward, my proposal would be to take the golf route and award prize money depending on how well the team does and for the money to be divided up amongst the squad.

as_ky (Kerry) - 10/05/2017 21:30:20    1985823

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You want to pay 1000 players to avoid losing 1 or 2 to professional sport every few years?????

Westfester (Limerick) - 10/05/2017 22:01:22    1985834

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It is every year and it's not just Oz we lose players to. Plenry have to move to find work

as_ky (Kerry) - 10/05/2017 22:26:37    1985845

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Replying To as_ky:  "David Clifford making headlines again tonight but Kerry fans excitement is quelled by the fact we know fine well he might follow the likes of Kennelly, Walsh and O'Connor and head to Oz. Kerry are not the exception here, effecting counties across the country. Really takes away from the game when it is getting robbed of its future superstars.
The GAA should have implemented a plan long ago to tackle this but they have been non responsive as of yet. You can have a packed Croke Park on all ireland final day and the stewards get paid more than the lads on the pitch. Surely it is time now to bring is some form of monetary reward, my proposal would be to take the golf route and award prize money depending on how well the team does and for the money to be divided up amongst the squad."
Ya only the like of Kerry, Dublin and again a push half dozen others at best would benefit from this, rich get richer, the Wiclows, Leitrims and Carlows etc of this world on the hind tit me thinks... go back to the drawing board

Bainisteoir (National) - 10/05/2017 23:04:01    1985856

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Replying To as_ky:  "It is every year and it's not just Oz we lose players to. Plenry have to move to find work"
That's life.

waynoI (Dublin) - 11/05/2017 08:36:11    1985873

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Going pro on a knee jerk reaction like this is not the answer. Still I understand your frustration and I do feel the GAA should be doing something or at least encouraging something to be done by the business community. Even as a Cork man I would hate to see David Clifford go. I am glad I saw Maurice Fitz, Peter the Great, the Gooch and many more. the Kerry lads in particular tormented us but when the dust settles years later a reasonable GAA person will look back and think those guys were class, I'm glad I got to see them in the flesh playing our game.

Setanta O'hAlpin was a huge loss to Cork and to the GAA in general. Surely there was an opportunity for one or more business to give him a well paid ambassadorial role, let him train pretty much full time and line out for both Cork teams. I am surprised there wasn't even a possibility of this happening.

Hopefully Kerry will be more proactive and creative. A schools coaching role, a college scholarship and Kerry Group Ambassador, that should financially top what the Aussies are offering - its up to the lad himself after that but at least we would have thrown out hat in the ring to keep this amazing talent in our game.

dahayeser (Cork) - 11/05/2017 10:26:30    1985895

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Every county loses players , when was it any different ?
A lot of players are professionals in their chosen professions , are we saying they would chose sport over becoming a Teacher Doctor, Fireman ?
If we believe in equality are we playing ladies footballers ?
Do we play Camoigie players ?
How many games constitute payment , there are different squads for O Byrne cup , League and Championship ?
Do minors get paid or should they chose a college career ?
Under 21s should they be paid ?

Talent drain when you've just won another Munster championship in Minor , are league champions in Senior , talk about knee jerk reaction to losing a handful of players

Damothedub (Dublin) - 11/05/2017 10:47:31    1985901

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Replying To as_ky:  "David Clifford making headlines again tonight but Kerry fans excitement is quelled by the fact we know fine well he might follow the likes of Kennelly, Walsh and O'Connor and head to Oz. Kerry are not the exception here, effecting counties across the country. Really takes away from the game when it is getting robbed of its future superstars.
The GAA should have implemented a plan long ago to tackle this but they have been non responsive as of yet. You can have a packed Croke Park on all ireland final day and the stewards get paid more than the lads on the pitch. Surely it is time now to bring is some form of monetary reward, my proposal would be to take the golf route and award prize money depending on how well the team does and for the money to be divided up amongst the squad."
Why haven't you shown such concern for other counties like Laois, Carlow, Mayo, Kildare or Down for example, who in the past have lost very talented players to Ozzie Rules. Why would anyone with an interest in sport want to deny these obviously talented young lads the opportunity to have a genuine career in professional sport. The outrage now rings a bit hollow. I'm alright Jack....until now

Weary (None) - 11/05/2017 11:04:40    1985906

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Come on how many counties loose young player to emigration and the career paths they take.

The argument to pay inter county players is mad. Having a professional sport on an Island of 5.5 million is unsustainable.

yew_tree (Mayo) - 11/05/2017 11:12:34    1985914

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Replying To Damothedub:  "Every county loses players , when was it any different ?
A lot of players are professionals in their chosen professions , are we saying they would chose sport over becoming a Teacher Doctor, Fireman ?
If we believe in equality are we playing ladies footballers ?
Do we play Camoigie players ?
How many games constitute payment , there are different squads for O Byrne cup , League and Championship ?
Do minors get paid or should they chose a college career ?
Under 21s should they be paid ?

Talent drain when you've just won another Munster championship in Minor , are league champions in Senior , talk about knee jerk reaction to losing a handful of players"
Yes damo if funding is there the players would be full time players and not work in a profession. That's how professionalism works..
We can still believe n equality and not pay female players. Is the support their to pay women in terms of TV coverage, attendance at games?
The players would either receive grants or payment per games played and it would mean counties using core squad which get top payment and if they want to use others they pay them on a per game basis just like any other pro sport.
Minors wouldn't get paid unless you introduced pro academies and all players would still be going to college as it's not as if they'll earn enough to not have to work after playing. And please could you not put a space after the end of a sentence and the comma/full stop. It's so wrong!!!!

ormondbannerman (Clare) - 11/05/2017 11:32:17    1985921

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You can count on one hand how many lads have made it over there.
You need a lot of hands to count how many didn't and are back home.

Superglue (Kerry) - 11/05/2017 11:53:27    1985925

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Replying To ormondbannerman:  "Yes damo if funding is there the players would be full time players and not work in a profession. That's how professionalism works..
We can still believe n equality and not pay female players. Is the support their to pay women in terms of TV coverage, attendance at games?
The players would either receive grants or payment per games played and it would mean counties using core squad which get top payment and if they want to use others they pay them on a per game basis just like any other pro sport.
Minors wouldn't get paid unless you introduced pro academies and all players would still be going to college as it's not as if they'll earn enough to not have to work after playing. And please could you not put a space after the end of a sentence and the comma/full stop. It's so wrong!!!!"
I will ignore your the grammar Nazism
You have answered all my questions as you always do from a point that you couldn't possibly be wrong in one aspect I have admire your total arrogance, I put questions out there that no one could possibly answer , the top brass and 5 committees would struggle to answer, but you nailed it in 10 mins, I know county players and I know they love their life , some are very content with what they achieved in both life and sport and would have had no interest in GAA if they could not have pursued their chosen careers ,
By the way I know how professionalism works as a member of the EU a worker has the right of free movement in other words you could not stop someone born wherever from working were they liked.
Its so annoying that you attack every discussion with your rugby agenda thinly veiled behind every answer, let me spell it out for you the GAA is unique and not a one hat fits all organisation.

Damothedub (Dublin) - 11/05/2017 11:56:43    1985926

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Always find it a bit funny how people claim the GAA should do something anytime a high profile player or one deemed to have good potential chooses a career path away from the GAA.

A tiny fraction of GAA players are lost to the AFL - even at that many of them end up coming back after a few years.

Nothing the GAA can offer could possibly match the chance to be a professional sportsman. The idea of a college scholarship, role coaching kids and an ambassador job for a sponsor doesn't add up at all - how do you decide which players get these? Only the ones tempted by Aussie rules or do we offer them to every kid who plays more than one sport and has a chance to make a living from it?

Another idea that gets raised a lot is county boards or the county council looking after the player and setting him up with a job. It's not like councils are equal opportunity employers or anything like that, and sure LSP's don't have to adhere to Sport Ireland guidelines when hiring somebody - nah sure they can just ignore their funding partners and hire who they like.

Also people seem to ignore basic employment law, if the GAA did ever manage to move down the professional route then say hello to intercounty transfers becoming the norm.

People emigrate, always have done and always will do regardless of whether they're good at a particular sport or not.

There's more jobs in bigger towns and cities than there is rural areas.

There's nothing the GAA can do about either of those.

if_in_doubt (Kildare) - 11/05/2017 12:00:20    1985927

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Replying To ormondbannerman:  "Yes damo if funding is there the players would be full time players and not work in a profession. That's how professionalism works..
We can still believe n equality and not pay female players. Is the support their to pay women in terms of TV coverage, attendance at games?
The players would either receive grants or payment per games played and it would mean counties using core squad which get top payment and if they want to use others they pay them on a per game basis just like any other pro sport.
Minors wouldn't get paid unless you introduced pro academies and all players would still be going to college as it's not as if they'll earn enough to not have to work after playing. And please could you not put a space after the end of a sentence and the comma/full stop. It's so wrong!!!!"
Space at the end of a sentence is so wrong ? Well I think Damo is making a lot more sense in his post than you are my righteous friend .

dubarra (Wicklow) - 11/05/2017 12:09:55    1985934

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Replying To if_in_doubt:  "Always find it a bit funny how people claim the GAA should do something anytime a high profile player or one deemed to have good potential chooses a career path away from the GAA.

A tiny fraction of GAA players are lost to the AFL - even at that many of them end up coming back after a few years.

Nothing the GAA can offer could possibly match the chance to be a professional sportsman. The idea of a college scholarship, role coaching kids and an ambassador job for a sponsor doesn't add up at all - how do you decide which players get these? Only the ones tempted by Aussie rules or do we offer them to every kid who plays more than one sport and has a chance to make a living from it?

Another idea that gets raised a lot is county boards or the county council looking after the player and setting him up with a job. It's not like councils are equal opportunity employers or anything like that, and sure LSP's don't have to adhere to Sport Ireland guidelines when hiring somebody - nah sure they can just ignore their funding partners and hire who they like.

Also people seem to ignore basic employment law, if the GAA did ever manage to move down the professional route then say hello to intercounty transfers becoming the norm.

People emigrate, always have done and always will do regardless of whether they're good at a particular sport or not.

There's more jobs in bigger towns and cities than there is rural areas.

There's nothing the GAA can do about either of those."
Excellent post , but our rugby guru is bound to answer with his usual form of spin

Damothedub (Dublin) - 11/05/2017 12:10:20    1985935

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Replying To if_in_doubt:  "Always find it a bit funny how people claim the GAA should do something anytime a high profile player or one deemed to have good potential chooses a career path away from the GAA.

A tiny fraction of GAA players are lost to the AFL - even at that many of them end up coming back after a few years.

Nothing the GAA can offer could possibly match the chance to be a professional sportsman. The idea of a college scholarship, role coaching kids and an ambassador job for a sponsor doesn't add up at all - how do you decide which players get these? Only the ones tempted by Aussie rules or do we offer them to every kid who plays more than one sport and has a chance to make a living from it?

Another idea that gets raised a lot is county boards or the county council looking after the player and setting him up with a job. It's not like councils are equal opportunity employers or anything like that, and sure LSP's don't have to adhere to Sport Ireland guidelines when hiring somebody - nah sure they can just ignore their funding partners and hire who they like.

Also people seem to ignore basic employment law, if the GAA did ever manage to move down the professional route then say hello to intercounty transfers becoming the norm.

People emigrate, always have done and always will do regardless of whether they're good at a particular sport or not.

There's more jobs in bigger towns and cities than there is rural areas.

There's nothing the GAA can do about either of those."
It's all very well to say it's only a tiny fraction. The problem is it is the best. The guys that may make a the difference between winning an All Ireland or not. In Kerry's case had Maurice Fitz, Seamus Moynahan and Darragh O'Sé been coming through today and we would never have seen them in our game. As a GAA person who enjoys seeing these great laochra gaels in action I would hate to see that. If a guy gets approached I am all for bending the rules to keep them. I was equally disappointed to see Colin O'Riordan cherry picked from Tipp, its nothing to do with the big counties.

dahayeser (Cork) - 11/05/2017 12:20:05    1985936

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we will always lose a few top players to professional sports,end of.
a far bigger worry is the drop off rate between minor and u21.
the reasons for this have been done to death on here,losing lads to soccer,lads getting fed up waiting for games,lads no longer willing to put their lives on hold for gaa when they can go out and have a few pints and play soccer for the craic but know they have a game every sunday.
and then there is gaa politics,in-fighting,etc which would also put anybody off.

perfect10 (Wexford) - 11/05/2017 12:41:47    1985941

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Replying To ormondbannerman:  "Yes damo if funding is there the players would be full time players and not work in a profession. That's how professionalism works..
We can still believe n equality and not pay female players. Is the support their to pay women in terms of TV coverage, attendance at games?
The players would either receive grants or payment per games played and it would mean counties using core squad which get top payment and if they want to use others they pay them on a per game basis just like any other pro sport.
Minors wouldn't get paid unless you introduced pro academies and all players would still be going to college as it's not as if they'll earn enough to not have to work after playing. And please could you not put a space after the end of a sentence and the comma/full stop. It's so wrong!!!!"
To have a little dig at a guy over his lack of full stop's/comma's is beyond tragic when you cant use there, their and they're in the correct context. If you are going to correct someone's grammar mistakes, at least have the decency to make sure your English is up to scratch otherwise you make a complete mockery of your point, which is petty anyway.

waynoI (Dublin) - 11/05/2017 12:44:10    1985942

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Replying To Superglue:  "You can count on one hand how many lads have made it over there.
You need a lot of hands to count how many didn't and are back home."
How many fingers have you got?

Breffni39 (Cavan) - 11/05/2017 13:29:37    1985951

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Yes damo if funding is there the players would be full time players and not work in a profession. That's how professionalism works..
We can still believe n equality and not pay female players. Is the support their to pay women in terms of TV coverage, attendance at games?
The players would either receive grants or payment per games played and it would mean counties using core squad which get top payment and if they want to use others they pay them on a per game basis just like any other pro sport.
Minors wouldn't get paid unless you introduced pro academies and all players would still be going to college as it's not as if they'll earn enough to not have to work after playing. And please could you not put a space after the end of a sentence and the comma/full stop. It's so wrong!!!!
ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts:12936 - 11/05/2017 11:32:17


Your own punctuation and sentence structure isn't the best.

Commas, capital letters and syntax could all be better but we can understand the points that you are making so there is no need to highlight them. We all make mistakes, myself included, but as long as posts are clear enough then it is okay. When they are brought up the thread gets derailed. I understand that I'm also contributing to the derailment of this thread but I feel that it is a point worth making.

MesAmis (Dublin) - 11/05/2017 13:40:16    1985954

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