National Forum

Who is most likely to beat the Dubs 2017

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Replying To GeniusGerry:  "You could argue that they weren't particularly brilliant in 2016 or 2015 either, but it was still good enough. Definitely get where you are coming from though. In some ways they are where Kerry were in 2011, with some of their greatest ever players coming to the end. Dublin are far better equipped to deal with it now than we were at that time though, with the squad they have and so much U21 success in recent years.

I would imagine that Gavin will be freshening up the forwards and midfield this year with the likes of Flynn, McCauley, Brogan and mcnanamon all dropping out. I can't see them winning another All Ireland with those four starting. That should negate any complacency, but whether their replacements are good enough is another thing. We can talk about squad depth all day but the only way to find out if the fringe players are up to it at the top level is to play them in meaningful matches. Costello and Mannion and others are great off the bench against tired defences but starting is another matter. Time will tell.

There is certainly some hope for the rest of us in 2017."
While the dubs may not have been particularly brilliant in 2015 or 2016, they weren't relative only to themselves, not the field. Consistently, they are the best team by some distance over the past 6 seasons. In 2015 they beat Mayo in a replay, and were very strong in the final thereafter. In 2016 they beat donegal, kerry and mayo in the all ireland series stage of the competition. Outside of leinster, they are beating the top teams and are not getting it handy in terms of who they draw either.

If Dublin lose this year, (I think it is possible), It could be kick outs and mid field that beats them as they are a bit vulnerable there imo.

Donegalman (None) - Posts: 3830 - 03/05/2017 10:13:07    1984144

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It'll be Kerry or Mayo

Tyrone/Donegal/Monaghan are all capable of it

But Kerry and Mayo are ahead of those three

Kerry though have shown a fair bit of their hand, especially in the middle, and really what's Mayo going to bring that's any different?

Same players as last year, it's all about if Dublin have it in them to do 3 in a row

A stupidly difficult thing to do, still think Dublin have another 1 or 2 in this team but maybe not 1 in 2017, and then hopefully the younger injection of players will keep them very competitive for some time to come.

Gavin has just signed up to 2019

So that's great news.. we've a crop of U21 AI Champions and Jim Gavin to bring them into the panel over the next number of seasons

All very positive

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20598 - 03/05/2017 11:41:28    1984173

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Kerry

kikfada (Louth) - Posts: 2091 - 03/05/2017 11:53:07    1984177

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Nothing will instil as much fear into a Dublin player as a Meath jersey. Combine this with a new management and players that are in the right frame of mind and you will get a fair rattle if the teams meet. You can be sure Andy Mc is studying areas of vulnerability shown in the league final.

Jimin10 (Meath) - Posts: 783 - 03/05/2017 12:02:50    1984179

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Replying To Donegalman:  "While the dubs may not have been particularly brilliant in 2015 or 2016, they weren't relative only to themselves, not the field. Consistently, they are the best team by some distance over the past 6 seasons. In 2015 they beat Mayo in a replay, and were very strong in the final thereafter. In 2016 they beat donegal, kerry and mayo in the all ireland series stage of the competition. Outside of leinster, they are beating the top teams and are not getting it handy in terms of who they draw either.

If Dublin lose this year, (I think it is possible), It could be kick outs and mid field that beats them as they are a bit vulnerable there imo."
If Dublin lose this year, (I think it is possible), It could be kick outs and mid field that beats them as they are a bit vulnerable there imo.


Bizzare statement Donegalman........??
Fenton and Cluxton are probably our best players and if you watched the league this year, Cluxton's kickouts and his genera performances have returned to 2011 standards

Liamwalkinstown (Dublin) - Posts: 8166 - 03/05/2017 12:04:12    1984180

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Thought he would stay longer especially after dessie farrell doesint want the job! he'd be leaving around the same time as brogan flynn and cluxton along with the manager that's a blow..Hopefully this year either ourselves and Kildare give a test if either get to the leinster final..After that if kerry have j.od back in form as some one said I think it's theirs to loose..They could want it that bit more

royal7 (Meath) - Posts: 156 - 03/05/2017 12:04:28    1984181

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Think Mayo and Kerry are both capable on their day. However there is every chance Mayo could go out early because i don't think they are improving. Time will tell and in fairness when they needed the points in the league they delivered. Just have a feeling their top men are pushing on a bit.

Donegal are in transition but look very promising. Again hard to know until it is put up to them in Championship.

IMO Tyrone are overrated. I would imagine every team hates playing them, and their set up makes them capable of beating any team on their day but i could not see it working a few times in a row.

Mayonman (Galway) - Posts: 1825 - 03/05/2017 12:19:27    1984189

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Replying To Mayonman:  "Think Mayo and Kerry are both capable on their day. However there is every chance Mayo could go out early because i don't think they are improving. Time will tell and in fairness when they needed the points in the league they delivered. Just have a feeling their top men are pushing on a bit.

Donegal are in transition but look very promising. Again hard to know until it is put up to them in Championship.

IMO Tyrone are overrated. I would imagine every team hates playing them, and their set up makes them capable of beating any team on their day but i could not see it working a few times in a row."
I don't know if Mayo are pushing on exactly. There's only a few there getting old. Higgins isn't getting any faster, Moran is ageing backwards but still I'm sure he knows he doesn't have much left in the tank, Boyle is no spring chicken and Clarke is the wrong side of 30 but is a keeper so it's not important really.The rest are mostly under 30 and a decent few in the 22-27 bracket. They don't have many new forwards. Boland looks decent and there is one or two from last year that may get more of a crop in in the early games of championship this year. One thing I will always say for Mayo is that I will never judge their league form, I don't believe they play with the same heart. Their mind can be only on one thing and that comes in Summer.

We are more or less the same. I don't know where Tyrone are at this year. Topsy tervy league. It's very hard to tell. Against Dublin we looked good. At least until Dublin brought on the mega subs and did their damage... and that is the difference between ourselves/Monaghan/Donegal and Dublin. When it comes down to it I don't think we can beat Dublin after 55 minutes. The top eight teams in Ireland can put it up to Dublin for 50-55 mins but then get battered by their subs. They just have an extra gear.

Donegal: I think looked decent with their youthful players but I can't see them challenging for anything more than a semi. They could shock me but I don't see it yet.

Kerry: they are the obvious threat to Dublin ...And I like most here would say they have the best chance of beating Dublin. . by chance I would say 50/50 at this stage. There's little if anything between them at the minute. Kerry really shocked me in that league final. I didn't expect their underage transition to be as fast at has been. I expected Kerry to be flying on all fronts in two years or so but they caught most of us by surprise It think. Just when gooch was hanging up the boots etc.

The last thing I'll say about any of any teams beating Dublin this year is I think they are not as strong as previous years. I'm not having a go at the team. I do admire how they have managed to stay like a Man United of the 00's for so long. Year after year either at the top or just next to it. They have won the U-21's and surely will have a few players from that crop in the next few years too... but for this summer I think they have weakened ever so slightly.. I think it's a case that Kerry have got just a little better and Dublin declined ever so slightly. Ageing cast, Cluxton is a keeper so I'll leave him out of it but plenty of the rest( Brogan, Connolly 29, MDMA 30,Flynn 30, O Gara 31, Dennis "Teddy Sheringham" Bastick 35 Philiy McM 29 and COSullivan 29 .) are getting on much more so than Mayo that you mentioned earlier. Granted player 29/30 aren't in full decline but at that age you start to slow down just a little bit and have more general wear and tear. They have plenty of youth coming through but I don't think it's at the level of these players mentioned above; just yet.

GameOfTyrones (Tyrone) - Posts: 469 - 03/05/2017 20:08:05    1984300

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It can only be the Royals.

We have more championship wins against Dubs than anyone else.

Why can't it be?.

Ibbecek (Meath) - Posts: 196 - 03/05/2017 23:20:33    1984327

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In my opinion Meath haven't got a snowballs chance in hell of beating Dublin. With all due respect some of the posters here from Meath are letting their heart rule their heads in my opinion. Dublin will walk Leinster again but will possibly be beaten in the latter rounds as they have went back a tiny bit. I wouldn't bet on it though.

thegadfly (Cavan) - Posts: 290 - 04/05/2017 03:25:19    1984329

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kerry

ziggy32001 (Meath) - Posts: 8354 - 04/05/2017 07:30:07    1984337

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Replying To GameOfTyrones:  "I don't know if Mayo are pushing on exactly. There's only a few there getting old. Higgins isn't getting any faster, Moran is ageing backwards but still I'm sure he knows he doesn't have much left in the tank, Boyle is no spring chicken and Clarke is the wrong side of 30 but is a keeper so it's not important really.The rest are mostly under 30 and a decent few in the 22-27 bracket. They don't have many new forwards. Boland looks decent and there is one or two from last year that may get more of a crop in in the early games of championship this year. One thing I will always say for Mayo is that I will never judge their league form, I don't believe they play with the same heart. Their mind can be only on one thing and that comes in Summer.

We are more or less the same. I don't know where Tyrone are at this year. Topsy tervy league. It's very hard to tell. Against Dublin we looked good. At least until Dublin brought on the mega subs and did their damage... and that is the difference between ourselves/Monaghan/Donegal and Dublin. When it comes down to it I don't think we can beat Dublin after 55 minutes. The top eight teams in Ireland can put it up to Dublin for 50-55 mins but then get battered by their subs. They just have an extra gear.

Donegal: I think looked decent with their youthful players but I can't see them challenging for anything more than a semi. They could shock me but I don't see it yet.

Kerry: they are the obvious threat to Dublin ...And I like most here would say they have the best chance of beating Dublin. . by chance I would say 50/50 at this stage. There's little if anything between them at the minute. Kerry really shocked me in that league final. I didn't expect their underage transition to be as fast at has been. I expected Kerry to be flying on all fronts in two years or so but they caught most of us by surprise It think. Just when gooch was hanging up the boots etc.

The last thing I'll say about any of any teams beating Dublin this year is I think they are not as strong as previous years. I'm not having a go at the team. I do admire how they have managed to stay like a Man United of the 00's for so long. Year after year either at the top or just next to it. They have won the U-21's and surely will have a few players from that crop in the next few years too... but for this summer I think they have weakened ever so slightly.. I think it's a case that Kerry have got just a little better and Dublin declined ever so slightly. Ageing cast, Cluxton is a keeper so I'll leave him out of it but plenty of the rest( Brogan, Connolly 29, MDMA 30,Flynn 30, O Gara 31, Dennis "Teddy Sheringham" Bastick 35 Philiy McM 29 and COSullivan 29 .) are getting on much more so than Mayo that you mentioned earlier. Granted player 29/30 aren't in full decline but at that age you start to slow down just a little bit and have more general wear and tear. They have plenty of youth coming through but I don't think it's at the level of these players mentioned above; just yet."
i hear but my point about Mayo is that the stalwarts are the guys pushing on a bit. Higgins(class act) and Moran etc are still doing it but when the end can come very swiftly once ur the wrong side of 30.

Ur right though very little between a few teams. Tyrone in my view are the biggest disappointment of the last year or two but they could quite easily turn that around given the resources at their disposal. A lot of teams can beat each other but if ur looking for a team to win 3 big games in a row it still comes nack to Dublin and Kerry.

Mayonman (Galway) - Posts: 1825 - 04/05/2017 07:43:17    1984339

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Replying To Ibbecek:  "It can only be the Royals.

We have more championship wins against Dubs than anyone else.

Why can't it be?."
Why can't it be? Emmm, oh yeh, it's because you're crap :D

realdub (Dublin) - Posts: 8584 - 04/05/2017 07:44:37    1984340

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Replying To Jimin10:  "Nothing will instil as much fear into a Dublin player as a Meath jersey. Combine this with a new management and players that are in the right frame of mind and you will get a fair rattle if the teams meet. You can be sure Andy Mc is studying areas of vulnerability shown in the league final."
Cant agree , while the sight of a Dublin jersey may bring out something extra in a Meath player , sadly that is no longer the case with Dublin , those fantastic games from the 90s are but a distant memory , these players are used to beating Meath there is no scar tissue ,they do not know defeat bar those left from the 5 goal hammering , now I don't say this to pi77 you off nor do I say it out of disrespect on the contrary because of my age I easily recall titanic battles and for Dublin football fans Leinster has become all the poorer for it recently because of lack of real competitive action , be careful what you wish for but Id love nothing than to see Meath Kildare amongst others raising their game and creating an actual live real rivalry again in Leinster.

Damothedub (Dublin) - Posts: 5193 - 04/05/2017 08:30:26    1984352

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Replying To Jimin10:  "Nothing will instil as much fear into a Dublin player as a Meath jersey. Combine this with a new management and players that are in the right frame of mind and you will get a fair rattle if the teams meet. You can be sure Andy Mc is studying areas of vulnerability shown in the league final."
This isn't the 90's lad, Dublin have zero fear of Meath.

TheFlaker (Mayo) - Posts: 7882 - 04/05/2017 10:04:57    1984391

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I can only hope Kerry repay others confidence in us with interest this summer, An Riocht Abu!

TheHermit (Kerry) - Posts: 6354 - 04/05/2017 11:02:19    1984415

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Replying To GeniusGerry:  "You could argue that they weren't particularly brilliant in 2016 or 2015 either, but it was still good enough. Definitely get where you are coming from though. In some ways they are where Kerry were in 2011, with some of their greatest ever players coming to the end. Dublin are far better equipped to deal with it now than we were at that time though, with the squad they have and so much U21 success in recent years.

I would imagine that Gavin will be freshening up the forwards and midfield this year with the likes of Flynn, McCauley, Brogan and mcnanamon all dropping out. I can't see them winning another All Ireland with those four starting. That should negate any complacency, but whether their replacements are good enough is another thing. We can talk about squad depth all day but the only way to find out if the fringe players are up to it at the top level is to play them in meaningful matches. Costello and Mannion and others are great off the bench against tired defences but starting is another matter. Time will tell.

There is certainly some hope for the rest of us in 2017."
remember the last time the Dubs were going for 3 in a row
as far as i can remember i think it was Kerry was it Kerry oh
it was that is the team that will stop the Dubs Mayo should
have taken last years AI they beat themselves Dubs are in decline
Brogan and Flynn Mcmenamin Andrews OSullivan just a few to mention
there best days are behind them

wfkerry (USA) - Posts: 933 - 04/05/2017 11:49:05    1984428

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This is a great thread, i really like that every county feels as if they are "coming", in many ways they are. You have Mayo, Galway, Tyrone, Donegal all doing well at U21 level in recent seasons. Kerry have done very well at schoolboy level too.

Funny thing is though is Dublin feel they are coming as well with another couple of U21 All Ireland wining team still to be integrated in the panel. Its an interesting one and should lead to fantastic championships in the years ahead.

I wonder how it will all pan out and whose "youth" will prevail or how long will we see a team enjoy a period of dominance like the one we are enjoying at them moment or will it happen ever again.

Have to say though, these are great threads, its a nice thing for each county to put forward a case of why they will defeat us, the perch is a lovely place to be as long as you can stay there.

I would have bitten your hand of for a "who can beat Dublin thread" in the 90s/00s.

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4443 - 04/05/2017 11:50:04    1984429

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Replying To extranjero:  "I reckons Wexford'll have a great shot against the Dubs this year. Unfortunately, we're unlikely to beat Carlow first, so we'll probably never know."
was just going to say same, carlow will be the big test for us, ill be very sure of beating the dubs if we get over them, i see the dubs are afraid of us to, the game is being taken out of wexford park!!! u could see the fear in galvins eyes on tv last night, id say he is praying they have no injuries!!! god this poteen is some strong!!!

Stmunnsriver (Wexford) - Posts: 2838 - 04/05/2017 12:14:17    1984438

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Liam what's all this stuff about Gavin querying the 'logic' of the referee that was selected for the League final?

Surely it's not sour grapes on the Dubs part??

;D

TheHermit (Kerry) - Posts: 6354 - 04/05/2017 13:30:44    1984454

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