Louth Forum

Underage Clubs

(Oldest Posts First)

Seen as senior football is at an all time low what do we think is wrong that we can't develop underage players and who do we feel has the best underage club in the county at the moment ?

Joey87 (Louth) - Posts: 41 - 04/07/2018 10:10:36    2118335

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Replying To Joey87:  "Seen as senior football is at an all time low what do we think is wrong that we can't develop underage players and who do we feel has the best underage club in the county at the moment ?"
"senior football is at an all time low "

Are you speaking about inter county or club level?

Itsme (Louth) - Posts: 401 - 04/07/2018 11:28:23    2118383

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Replying To Itsme:  ""senior football is at an all time low "

Are you speaking about inter county or club level?"
Senior intercounty sorry should've specified

Joey87 (Louth) - Posts: 41 - 04/07/2018 16:14:59    2118533

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Replying To Joey87:  "Seen as senior football is at an all time low what do we think is wrong that we can't develop underage players and who do we feel has the best underage club in the county at the moment ?"
Joey87...your on one post praising underage football and your started a post wondering whats wrong that we cannot develop underage players. I think your a wee bit confused.
We have the underage players in this county and the place is full of them. There is clubs out there who are putting in fantastic work developing young players. As i said in the post about the Louth minors when we set are standards very low its easy to celebrate a win when it comes along. and no doubt the county board will jump on it now saying we are doing well underage.
For example, the boys over our minor team this year are happy enough to win plates and shields and that has being the way since they started out. that is fine at club level but not acceptable at intercounty.

look at wicklow and laois for example, they now find themselves in a leinster minor semi final and if we cant set our standards like them well then we have no chance. our players are surly as good as theirs.

We donot need to worry about the underage players in this county as i said earlier there is clubs putting in serious work at underage, we need to get the rest of the clubs doing the same and then put proper management teams in place for our county underage squads

Your asking who are the best underage clubs at the moment and for someone who helps out at underage i would say there is a number of them in the likes of st marys, blues, gaels, cooley, kevins, rahillys, kilkerley, mattock. there is no worries here, we just need to give all the clubs plenty of help

louthclubplayer (Louth) - Posts: 33 - 05/07/2018 08:45:27    2118725

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I will say this, albeit amalgaimations are good in concept, some clubs are taking the mick. The country teams are the worst. Wont name clubs but they know who they are. In 1 instance there are 4 clubs joined together. Its more about not enough mentors to look after each teams rather than not enough kids in the parish. How some clubs cannot get 15 kids to put a team together is beyond me. It is mainly country teams who it affects. Town teams who have smaller areas to pull kids from dont suffer this issue. Country teams taking the P#@s.

joej (Louth) - Posts: 1509 - 05/07/2018 21:30:38    2118944

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Replying To joej:  "I will say this, albeit amalgaimations are good in concept, some clubs are taking the mick. The country teams are the worst. Wont name clubs but they know who they are. In 1 instance there are 4 clubs joined together. Its more about not enough mentors to look after each teams rather than not enough kids in the parish. How some clubs cannot get 15 kids to put a team together is beyond me. It is mainly country teams who it affects. Town teams who have smaller areas to pull kids from dont suffer this issue. Country teams taking the P#@s."
How can some clubs get enough players to put e.g. an u12 team together you say? Take O'Connells, Stabannon and Mitchells combination for example. How would you expect these teams to consistently put out teams without amalgamating? Three feeder schools to these clubs, Kilsaran, Stonetown and Stabannon have a combined boys and girls pupil number of around 290. Take club like Marys, 250 in Ardee Boys School alone, Geraldines 3 feeder schools have roughly 675-700 pupils. Marys and Geraldines both must be commended for the coaching structures that they have put in place which has allowed them to be near enough competing at the top of Division 1 year in and year out. However, they have a distinct advantage of simply having a huge playing population. There are other clubs in the who have similar luxuries if truth be told. So I don't know how you can bash ANY clubs for amalgamating without having exact knowledge for their reasons to amalgamate which in most cases simply boils down to not having enough numbers to field independently. Which town teams are you referring to with smaller playing populations than say a Mochtas or O'Connellls for example?

LouthGael18 (Louth) - Posts: 2 - 25/07/2018 15:21:24    2126144

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Replying To LouthGael18:  "How can some clubs get enough players to put e.g. an u12 team together you say? Take O'Connells, Stabannon and Mitchells combination for example. How would you expect these teams to consistently put out teams without amalgamating? Three feeder schools to these clubs, Kilsaran, Stonetown and Stabannon have a combined boys and girls pupil number of around 290. Take club like Marys, 250 in Ardee Boys School alone, Geraldines 3 feeder schools have roughly 675-700 pupils. Marys and Geraldines both must be commended for the coaching structures that they have put in place which has allowed them to be near enough competing at the top of Division 1 year in and year out. However, they have a distinct advantage of simply having a huge playing population. There are other clubs in the who have similar luxuries if truth be told. So I don't know how you can bash ANY clubs for amalgamating without having exact knowledge for their reasons to amalgamate which in most cases simply boils down to not having enough numbers to field independently. Which town teams are you referring to with smaller playing populations than say a Mochtas or O'Connellls for example?"
People get talking about amalgamations at underage when they see them with squads of 20 kids on the age winning alot. Town teams tend to field on their own using the kids from age groups below. The benefit clearly being that their own club players get alot more games.
If any club in an amalgamation cannot field 11 players from three age groups they have a serious problem that's not being addressed. I understand that there will be peaks and troughs in all clubs memberships but to be happy to continually amalgamate is very confusing to me. The clubs that amalgamate alot don't have a problem fielding 9/10 kids in blitzes when it's non competitive so why the need a couple of years later?. Someone earlier mentioned that Mentors aren't available and that would be one explanation.

Ihateforums (Louth) - Posts: 103 - 25/07/2018 17:00:34    2126180

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Replying To Ihateforums:  "People get talking about amalgamations at underage when they see them with squads of 20 kids on the age winning alot. Town teams tend to field on their own using the kids from age groups below. The benefit clearly being that their own club players get alot more games.
If any club in an amalgamation cannot field 11 players from three age groups they have a serious problem that's not being addressed. I understand that there will be peaks and troughs in all clubs memberships but to be happy to continually amalgamate is very confusing to me. The clubs that amalgamate alot don't have a problem fielding 9/10 kids in blitzes when it's non competitive so why the need a couple of years later?. Someone earlier mentioned that Mentors aren't available and that would be one explanation."
From u14 upwards you really need AT LEAST 17/18 players to field as a standalone club. Competing with other sports such as soccer and rugby it is very hard to get all young lads out for games week in week out which is a difficulty all clubs town or country have. These 17/18 players would usually include drafting in players from 2 years below the age groups also. The problem I have seen however is what if you have a good group of 8/9 players of 15s/16s for an u16 squad or 17s/18s for a minor team but the majority of 14s and 16s haven't physically developed to play a couple of years above their age group and/or are not allowed play by their parents, which can be the case in some clubs. Do you go as a standalone club and play in Division 3 not knowing if you will field each week and deny a good core group of players the opportunity to play against the best players in their own age group or do you amalgamate with a similar team with 8/9 players and play Division 1. It really is a fine line but to answer your above question I sincerely doubt that the Mitchells/Stabannon and O'Connells would have 20/22 players between 14s/15s/16s or 12s/13s/14s on a consistent basis and that is proven by the numbers I outlined above in their feeder schools. They would need 80% of all boys in their feeder schools playing gaa to have 18/20 players. We know that not 4/5 children are playing GAA from 12 years and over. The thing is with any sport the drop off is quite after 10/11 and this can be seen to some extent in the GAA so it is hard to say that just because a team might have 7/8 lads at an u8 blitz that them 7/8 lads are going to be there at u16s, naturally at least 1/2 would have stopped playing and its the same in every club.

I think that to develop the standard of football in underage football in Louth we should have regional competition with all clubs amalgamating at some stage during the year from every age group from 13s-18s with at least 8-10 games.Nobody would be playing outside their age groups. This would run alongside or before/after the competitions that currently exist ensuring nobody is missing out on any football. It would give better players the chance to play in games with higher intensity and higher skill level because having attended 3 days of Feile in July we were miles behind in terms of skills in comparison to teams right from Division 3 Feile through Division 12. If the Development squads had to be forced to take a break to run this competition so what. It serves roughly 30 players whereas this competition would benefit upwards on 100 at least.

LouthGael18 (Louth) - Posts: 2 - 26/07/2018 11:35:08    2126347

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There should be a club championship and then a county championship at underage level for 14s / 16s / 18s.

Club Championship would work as follows;
Division 1 / A Championship
Division 2 / B Championship
Division 3 / C Championship
etc..


County Championships would work as follows;
Division 1 / A teams and then amalgamation teams (from Division 2 / B and below). With amalgamation teams there would be no limit on the number of teams that amalgamate together and normal amalgamation rules would apply.

The incentive here is to encourage clubs to field as standalone for Divisions & club championships but also to facilitate and give their core players the competitive and higher level of playing in a County Championship

No amalgamated team can compete in the A Club Championship or Division 1.

Itsme (Louth) - Posts: 401 - 26/07/2018 16:12:46    2126469

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Replying To Itsme:  "There should be a club championship and then a county championship at underage level for 14s / 16s / 18s.

Club Championship would work as follows;
Division 1 / A Championship
Division 2 / B Championship
Division 3 / C Championship
etc..


County Championships would work as follows;
Division 1 / A teams and then amalgamation teams (from Division 2 / B and below). With amalgamation teams there would be no limit on the number of teams that amalgamate together and normal amalgamation rules would apply.

The incentive here is to encourage clubs to field as standalone for Divisions & club championships but also to facilitate and give their core players the competitive and higher level of playing in a County Championship

No amalgamated team can compete in the A Club Championship or Division 1."
My initial reaction to this was that amalgamated clubs are probably quite happy to stay out of Div 1 and A championships to roll over the clubs trying to field on their own in the lower leagues.

However, a quick look at this years championships throws these stat's up;

U14 A Championship has 7 amalgamations of 2 or more clubs
U14 B Championship has no amalgamations

U16 A Championship has 5 amalgamations of 2 or more clubs
U16 B Championship has 2 amalgamations of 2 or more clubs

Minor A Championship has 2 amalgamations of 2 or more clubs
Minor B Championship has 2 amalgamations of 2 or more clubs

Having looked at this I think my initial reaction above is wrong.

Overall, I like the idea you put forward.

Ihateforums (Louth) - Posts: 103 - 26/07/2018 16:36:23    2126482

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The reason clubs amalgamate is they do not have enough of players to field on there own. There is an issue among clubs and this is going to get a lot worse. It is only a matter of time when we see adult clubs amalgamate

itslouth (Louth) - Posts: 178 - 31/07/2018 13:29:23    2127851

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Replying To itslouth:  "The reason clubs amalgamate is they do not have enough of players to field on there own. There is an issue among clubs and this is going to get a lot worse. It is only a matter of time when we see adult clubs amalgamate"
I think clubs amalgamating is a great idea once it's necessary, puts young lads in a good team that could potentially contest with the bigger clubs in Div1 instead of being a Div2/3 team with little hope

Joey87 (Louth) - Posts: 41 - 08/08/2018 16:55:33    2130904

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Replying To Joey87:  "I think clubs amalgamating is a great idea once it's necessary, puts young lads in a good team that could potentially contest with the bigger clubs in Div1 instead of being a Div2/3 team with little hope"
So basically forget about participation levels and focus on competition.

You do know promising players 16/18 don't always stick around and vice versa some young players develop into promising players.

Itsme (Louth) - Posts: 401 - 08/08/2018 22:34:22    2131055

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