Is it now time for the GAA to come down hard on teams that their players, management or supporters are involved in violence at GAA grounds, every week or 2 we hear stories of violence breaking out at underage matches or adult club matches. My opinion is simple ban the clubs involved for a year or two, fine them heavy and demand they pay, if they claim that the club will disband if fined then take the GAA ground off them, that's worth a few bob, there is no place for violence in our games and shame on those who get involved, the GAA also need to protect match officials and also make them accountable for their decisions, some of the violence happens when the ref is too slow to make a decision earlier on in the game and players are getting pumped up because the ref didn't punish an offender properly and now a mêlée breaks out and full scale fighting happens involving a large number

riverboys (Mayo) - Posts: 1389 - 03/11/2016 19:47:33    1931320

Is it now time for the GAA to come down hard on teams that their players, management or supporters are involved in violence at GAA grounds, every week or 2 we hear stories of violence breaking out at underage matches or adult club matches. My opinion is simple ban the clubs involved for a year or two, fine them heavy and demand they pay, if they claim that the club will disband if fined then take the GAA ground off them, that's worth a few bob, there is no place for violence in our games and shame on those who get involved, the GAA also need to protect match officials and also make them accountable for their decisions, some of the violence happens when the ref is too slow to make a decision earlier on in the game and players are getting pumped up because the ref didn't punish an offender properly and now a mêlée breaks out and full scale fighting happens involving a large number
riverboys (Mayo) - Posts:751 - 03/11/2016 19:47:33Does banning a club help bring about change though? How can you demand a club pay big fines? How can the GAA take a ground off a club and what do they do with it if they do?
You cant totally blame referees if players take things into their own hands and if they were at fault how exactly do you propose to make officials accountable for their decisions?

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 03/11/2016 20:04:55    1931327

Sometimes refs could do themselves a favour and explain their decisions without acting in an arrogant and sometimes provocative manner. The link below is Tony Scullion's account of what Padraig Hughes said to him when he asked a simple question of him. I guess this was his version of the event but I know from my own experience of dealing with refs that the same response was given to me a few times which does nothing to help the situation. If a ref makes a call he has to have a reason, otherwise why make it. Why shouldn't this be explained by a ref? saying 'bye bye' is childish and certainly doesn't convince anyone that you made the right call.

http://www.hoganstand.com/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=262728

SaffronDon (Antrim) - Posts: 2385 - 03/11/2016 20:30:18    1931340

Bit Draconian there riverboy in my opinion. While I agree that there is no place in GAA (sport in general) the fact is it will always be there so it's a hard one to try and eradicate, no matter how severe the penalty. Clubs and Managers can do all the possibly can to have discipline running through their teams and still be faced with a situation on the pitch where a brawl breaks out where their players get involved and for those minutes they have no control over what happens. Yes you can verbally and physically do your best to calm it down but you are still at the mercy of the madness of the moment. Madness where you a lot of the time have guys who wouldn't be violent by nature involved either defending a team mate who is taking a battering or has reacted to constant provocation towards them, be that verbal or physical. Even the most docile person has a breaking point and when you add the already charged emotions of a game then you do have the chance of it boiling over.

You also have other factors to consider including how the game is being officiated. In a lot of games I have witnessed where a mass fight broke out it was very poor handling of the game till that point that led to the incident. Teams being allowed to be overly physical to a point of violent play but not being properly punished leads to even heightened tensions and you always know when there is a chance of a brawl happening and not surprised when it does.

I agree though with your obvious frustration as there are clubs who just seem to have that element always present and something should be done. I think that if there were repeat offender clubs then there should be some sort of help first on offer from the County Executive . Identify if it is an issue which is down to the philosophy of the club or individuals and advise with appropriate action, be that get rid of said individuals or insist on a strict conduct code which they have to follow and put them on probation if you like where they know failure to comply would lead to suspension. If those in charge and the community in general are serious about their club and what it means to be a GAA club then that should be enough to clip the wings. Yes there is a good chance that somewhere down the line they could be involved in a brawl but, as I said above, that's the nature of the beast and that just be dealt with in the normal way (well, not the normal way but the way that rules are written)

Thankfully though for all the games I have watched over the years it has been a very small percentage which have had a brawl or serious violence in them.

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 03/11/2016 20:41:39    1931344

Should have read:

You also have other factors to consider including, as you say, how the game is being officiated. In a lot of games I have witnessed where a mass fight broke out it was very poor handling of the game till that point that led to the incident. Teams being allowed to be overly physical to a point of violent play but not being properly punished leads to even heightened tensions and you always know when there is a chance of a brawl happening and not surprised when it does.

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 03/11/2016 20:50:12    1931346

You can't have a situation were referees have to explain themselves on a pitch in the heat of battle, that is just not workable or even feasible. There is a capt on the pitch in a quiet moment he can ask for clarification and a ref is NOT obliged to give one. In other sports there is a procedure to be followed but if you ask out of turn the penalties are usually severe, it usually results in the team capt being penalised and/or the team. Ref's have to fill in a report, a player sent off is entitled to see that and dispute it. Anything else is anarchy.

arock (Dublin) - Posts: 4896 - 04/11/2016 14:06:47    1931527

gotmilk (Fermanagh) - Posts: 4971 - 04/11/2016 14:23:15    1931539

All very valid points above. There is a huge culture in the GAA of backing your own club no matter what. 1 guy gets suspended but when someone else does it "he's not that type of player, it must have been an accident".

The only way to resolve it is taking a multi layered approach. You need to stop it getting to that point but also punish when it does.

A lot of it starts as simple off the ball pulling and dragging that eventually leads to a few digs etc.
Possibly change the role of the linesman. Their new job is to monitor an area of the pitch for off the ball stuff. Forget about lineballs, the ref can make that call. Off the ball foul results in a free in, probably a handy score, should change attitude quickly if linesmen do job properly & consistently.

2 guys will always get into a tangle. Stop it getting out of control
3rd man in - Red Card - again has to be refereed consistently

Brawl erupts anyway coz the changes above won't solve everything
Needs to be severe repercussions for team, club & county depending on severity. If county board bottle it Croke Park need to have authority to get involved.

A lot of the above depends on consistency of referees. Obviously the lower down the pecking order you go you may not even have linesmen. A frustration I have is I could receive a frontal shoulder charge taking half my head off and barely get a free but if someone gives me a dig in the stomach they will get a red. I'd prefer the dig in the stomach thanks!! I think they need to remove the "it was an accident" excuse from the rule book (if it even exists). In rugby the guy making the tackle is responsible for executing correctly .....in GAA i think the meaning of the word execution is often treated differently!!

Mayonman (Galway) - Posts: 1829 - 04/11/2016 15:30:24    1931564

I find this whole blaming the ref for physical melee's as madness. The ref certainly doesn't make 30 grown men take lumps out of each other. It's the players fault. A lot of these incidents also spread to the crowd as highlighted this last week with the two incidents in Westmeath/JHC match-what's their excuse? For too long players and clubs have been getting away with melee's and appealing the decision afterwards and getting it reduced. If a melee happens ban the team in question ie senior team. Not the the whole club, the team involved.
Also if a ref blows for everything and hands out cards he is criticised to the hilt. An example of this is P.Hughes after the Cargin KC game. The Irish news has an article saying he handed out two many yellows. However if the two teams battered each other he is criticised for letting the teams get too phiscal. Literally can't win.
I was at a league game in Tyrone a few weeks ago, no flash points whatsoever during the game,sporting game. 2 mins into injury time a row breaks out over nothing. It got calmed down away a few minutes but could of got really nasty. Is that the refs fault? Clearly it is up to the players to take responsibility for their actions.

The_Fridge (Tyrone) - Posts: 2088 - 04/11/2016 17:08:55    1931596

The_Fridge (Tyrone) - Posts: 2088 - 04/11/2016 17:16:13    1931600