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This is my first thread on Hoganstand and to be honest only my second post but I have been a long time lurker on this site and read most threads on the national and Dublin forums. Im from Dublin, hurled and played football with my club for my entire life, Im 38 now so finished up, my dad played hurling for his county and was very successful and my brothers and sisters all played for most of their youth and adult lives. My friends and social circle basically revolve around the GAA and Im thankful of what the games and the organisation have given me.
The thing I cant get my head around is the posting of some people on here, they call players scum and accuse them of thuggery and nastiness at every turn. They slam teams for being cynical and scream about referees not carding players like they've murdered someone. Its like they never played the games. Our games are great, they are physical, competitive and yes combative, the way they should be. People get abused for being hard or dirty like these are awful things to be? If you've played you know that every team and every player bends the rules, that physicality and yes even a little bit of aggression are required to be successful. Im not trying to play the keyboard warrior, and im not condoning cheap shots or diving or any of that s££t but I don't understand why now every physical contact of a tough nature is being focused on and people are expanding these incidents as indicators of a players character.
In short our games are good, hard, physical and safe to play. Anyone who has played knows this, I challenge anyone to watch the 4 Dublin v Meath games from 1991 and tell me they weren't great, as tough, physical and combative as any games in GAA history. So my question is why all the hate for our games and the players? Cant we just leave them play and the referees decide and shake hands on it after without weeks of mickey mouse over analysis and personal attacks on players?
Up the dubs!!!!!
Beepee (Dublin) - Posts: 17 - 24/09/2016 15:04:05
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Replying To Beepee: "This is my first thread on Hoganstand and to be honest only my second post but I have been a long time lurker on this site and read most threads on the national and Dublin forums. Im from Dublin, hurled and played football with my club for my entire life, Im 38 now so finished up, my dad played hurling for his county and was very successful and my brothers and sisters all played for most of their youth and adult lives. My friends and social circle basically revolve around the GAA and Im thankful of what the games and the organisation have given me.
The thing I cant get my head around is the posting of some people on here, they call players scum and accuse them of thuggery and nastiness at every turn. They slam teams for being cynical and scream about referees not carding players like they've murdered someone. Its like they never played the games. Our games are great, they are physical, competitive and yes combative, the way they should be. People get abused for being hard or dirty like these are awful things to be? If you've played you know that every team and every player bends the rules, that physicality and yes even a little bit of aggression are required to be successful. Im not trying to play the keyboard warrior, and im not condoning cheap shots or diving or any of that s££t but I don't understand why now every physical contact of a tough nature is being focused on and people are expanding these incidents as indicators of a players character.
In short our games are good, hard, physical and safe to play. Anyone who has played knows this, I challenge anyone to watch the 4 Dublin v Meath games from 1991 and tell me they weren't great, as tough, physical and combative as any games in GAA history. So my question is why all the hate for our games and the players? Cant we just leave them play and the referees decide and shake hands on it after without weeks of mickey mouse over analysis and personal attacks on players?
Up the dubs!!!!!" i would argue that the diving, cheating etc that has crept into our games has caused far more damage than anything said on this message board.
You had a Tyrone minor recently taunting a Donegal player about the death of his father. thats worse than anything Ive ever read on here, and youll find that most posters on here also play, too (or at least have played)
Im all for good hard play but there has to be some honour involved in it too, and there is no excuse for being "dirty".
joncarter (Galway) - Posts: 2692 - 24/09/2016 15:21:00
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Well said and hello!
realdub (Dublin) - Posts: 8589 - 24/09/2016 15:29:36
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Well for start I think it's a bit of a stretch to say 'posters are ruining the game". I just don't understand that point.
But you're right. There is a lot more talk about dirty play and poor refereeing on this site than comparable sites that are dedicated to rugby and soccer say. But I think posters do have a point if they object to the persistent fouling of a particular player, fouling that seems to go unpunished.Gaelic football is such fast flowing game and it is very difficult for the referee to follow the play and also watch out for all the off the ball stuff that is going on. Perhaps that is why there is so much debate.
Regarding the name calling. I've rarely seen a poster here get away with calling anybody a 'scumbag'.
Good to read your post.
B.A.C. Abú
avonali (Dublin) - Posts: 1974 - 24/09/2016 15:37:06
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Replying To Beepee: "This is my first thread on Hoganstand and to be honest only my second post but I have been a long time lurker on this site and read most threads on the national and Dublin forums. Im from Dublin, hurled and played football with my club for my entire life, Im 38 now so finished up, my dad played hurling for his county and was very successful and my brothers and sisters all played for most of their youth and adult lives. My friends and social circle basically revolve around the GAA and Im thankful of what the games and the organisation have given me.
The thing I cant get my head around is the posting of some people on here, they call players scum and accuse them of thuggery and nastiness at every turn. They slam teams for being cynical and scream about referees not carding players like they've murdered someone. Its like they never played the games. Our games are great, they are physical, competitive and yes combative, the way they should be. People get abused for being hard or dirty like these are awful things to be? If you've played you know that every team and every player bends the rules, that physicality and yes even a little bit of aggression are required to be successful. Im not trying to play the keyboard warrior, and im not condoning cheap shots or diving or any of that s££t but I don't understand why now every physical contact of a tough nature is being focused on and people are expanding these incidents as indicators of a players character.
In short our games are good, hard, physical and safe to play. Anyone who has played knows this, I challenge anyone to watch the 4 Dublin v Meath games from 1991 and tell me they weren't great, as tough, physical and combative as any games in GAA history. So my question is why all the hate for our games and the players? Cant we just leave them play and the referees decide and shake hands on it after without weeks of mickey mouse over analysis and personal attacks on players?
Up the dubs!!!!!" I don't think everything typed on these fora are really meant tbh.
I 'hate' Philly McMahon, but would love to have him on my team. (Well, last year anyway!)
Diarmuid Connolly drives me nuts, but I think he was the best player in the country.
I agree with the general jist of your post, but also think we should probably take more of the posts on here with a pinch of salt.
BlastCalyle (Mayo) - Posts: 206 - 24/09/2016 15:42:12
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Replying To joncarter: "i would argue that the diving, cheating etc that has crept into our games has caused far more damage than anything said on this message board.
You had a Tyrone minor recently taunting a Donegal player about the death of his father. thats worse than anything Ive ever read on here, and youll find that most posters on here also play, too (or at least have played)
Im all for good hard play but there has to be some honour involved in it too, and there is no excuse for being "dirty"." Look I promise you, im not into the keyboard warrior thing and sledging and stuff is not something I want in the game especially stuff about peoples families but honestly, ive been called plenty of names on the pitch, and yes ive been guilty of mouthing at players. Nothing about dead relatives or anything as nasty as that but ive used bad language and called people things. Im not proud of it, im just being honest. I can understand and completely agree that really personal stuff is 100% wrong.
Diving is bulls%%t and no one likes it but thread after thread and post after post about it is a disaster. There seems to be a lot more comment about the dubious things in our games now than the positive. Ive noticed it over the last 10 years of going to games of crowds baying for sendings off when there is no need, no one hurt and no one offended on the pitch. Maybe im wrong but I honestly don't remember things being as focused on in the past. Dublin lad gets a bang, everyones up in arms, Connolly and keegan have a handbag session, everyone losses their s""t, both sides. Mick Lyons was a savage of a full back, hard, aggressive, yes dirty, but will always have the respect of Dublin fans my age because he was a great footballer. I never heard anyone say he wasn't in Dublin and I never remember anyone saying anything but positive things about him personally. When did we all decide that a little bit of bite was a terrible thing? I listened to Sean Boylan and David Brady talk about the meath vs mayo replay in 96 and the row. No one died, football was played, lads got on, no one reckons anyone involved is a scumbag, so whats changed?
Beepee (Dublin) - Posts: 17 - 24/09/2016 16:26:25
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Replying To avonali: "Well for start I think it's a bit of a stretch to say 'posters are ruining the game". I just don't understand that point.
But you're right. There is a lot more talk about dirty play and poor refereeing on this site than comparable sites that are dedicated to rugby and soccer say. But I think posters do have a point if they object to the persistent fouling of a particular player, fouling that seems to go unpunished.Gaelic football is such fast flowing game and it is very difficult for the referee to follow the play and also watch out for all the off the ball stuff that is going on. Perhaps that is why there is so much debate.
Regarding the name calling. I've rarely seen a poster here get away with calling anybody a 'scumbag'.
Good to read your post.
B.A.C. Abú" All right I don't mean ruining the sport, I mean ruining the enjoyment of it, Football and hurling are competitive sports, people are going to get fouled, players are going to get targeted that's the way its always been. My old man tells a story about playing tipp in the mid 60's. He was 19. National league match in thurles. Full forward, Tipp full back at the time turns to him and says "if you want to go to work tomorrow, you do as youre told". My old man played, took his clips and went to work Monday. He enjoyed the challenge and the game for what it was. No one after the game spent all week slating the tipp lad, he was one of the best full backs ever, and being ruthless was part of his game, he was even admired for it.
Beepee (Dublin) - Posts: 17 - 24/09/2016 16:32:18
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Replying To Beepee: "All right I don't mean ruining the sport, I mean ruining the enjoyment of it, Football and hurling are competitive sports, people are going to get fouled, players are going to get targeted that's the way its always been. My old man tells a story about playing tipp in the mid 60's. He was 19. National league match in thurles. Full forward, Tipp full back at the time turns to him and says "if you want to go to work tomorrow, you do as youre told". My old man played, took his clips and went to work Monday. He enjoyed the challenge and the game for what it was. No one after the game spent all week slating the tipp lad, he was one of the best full backs ever, and being ruthless was part of his game, he was even admired for it." Ah! Beepee Beepee Beepee...
Cmere til I have a word in your shell-like.
We all start off like you. You're a bit like that lad in The Shining who arrives to save the day and gets a hatchet buried in him as soon as he walks in the door!
You'll get nowhere here with that hippy attitude.
You need to get a rise out of people.
Try a bit of stereotypical Dublin arrogance or condescension. Give out about the ref or the fact that Mayo ended up with more tickets.
Otherwise your just talking to the wall. Remember this is an anonymous forum. You can say whatever you like!
Don't worry. Be like them poor little Mayo lads...
Pick yourself up and have another run at it.
SirStrawHat (Dublin) - Posts: 58 - 24/09/2016 16:52:05
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Replying To Beepee: "Look I promise you, im not into the keyboard warrior thing and sledging and stuff is not something I want in the game especially stuff about peoples families but honestly, ive been called plenty of names on the pitch, and yes ive been guilty of mouthing at players. Nothing about dead relatives or anything as nasty as that but ive used bad language and called people things. Im not proud of it, im just being honest. I can understand and completely agree that really personal stuff is 100% wrong.
Diving is bulls%%t and no one likes it but thread after thread and post after post about it is a disaster. There seems to be a lot more comment about the dubious things in our games now than the positive. Ive noticed it over the last 10 years of going to games of crowds baying for sendings off when there is no need, no one hurt and no one offended on the pitch. Maybe im wrong but I honestly don't remember things being as focused on in the past. Dublin lad gets a bang, everyones up in arms, Connolly and keegan have a handbag session, everyone losses their s""t, both sides. Mick Lyons was a savage of a full back, hard, aggressive, yes dirty, but will always have the respect of Dublin fans my age because he was a great footballer. I never heard anyone say he wasn't in Dublin and I never remember anyone saying anything but positive things about him personally. When did we all decide that a little bit of bite was a terrible thing? I listened to Sean Boylan and David Brady talk about the meath vs mayo replay in 96 and the row. No one died, football was played, lads got on, no one reckons anyone involved is a scumbag, so whats changed?" I agree with alot of that. im all for a bit of argy bargy. Nothing wrong with a bit of a shoulder barge or an aul schemozzle. in fact id hate to see the day when GAA players start hugging and high fiving the opposition players, and chatting with them in the tunnel before the game and at half time, like you see in soccer, but off the ball violence, personal taunts, and cheating? Ill always passionately oppose them.
joncarter (Galway) - Posts: 2692 - 24/09/2016 16:58:15
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Replying To SirStrawHat: "Ah! Beepee Beepee Beepee...
Cmere til I have a word in your shell-like.
We all start off like you. You're a bit like that lad in The Shining who arrives to save the day and gets a hatchet buried in him as soon as he walks in the door!
You'll get nowhere here with that hippy attitude.
You need to get a rise out of people.
Try a bit of stereotypical Dublin arrogance or condescension. Give out about the ref or the fact that Mayo ended up with more tickets.
Otherwise your just talking to the wall. Remember this is an anonymous forum. You can say whatever you like!
Don't worry. Be like them poor little Mayo lads...
Pick yourself up and have another run at it." Fair enough, Ill bring up the fact that Dublin have twice the amount of Hurling All Irelands that Mayo have in total......lads in work love that one....
Beepee (Dublin) - Posts: 17 - 24/09/2016 17:02:47
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Replying To Beepee: "Look I promise you, im not into the keyboard warrior thing and sledging and stuff is not something I want in the game especially stuff about peoples families but honestly, ive been called plenty of names on the pitch, and yes ive been guilty of mouthing at players. Nothing about dead relatives or anything as nasty as that but ive used bad language and called people things. Im not proud of it, im just being honest. I can understand and completely agree that really personal stuff is 100% wrong.
Diving is bulls%%t and no one likes it but thread after thread and post after post about it is a disaster. There seems to be a lot more comment about the dubious things in our games now than the positive. Ive noticed it over the last 10 years of going to games of crowds baying for sendings off when there is no need, no one hurt and no one offended on the pitch. Maybe im wrong but I honestly don't remember things being as focused on in the past. Dublin lad gets a bang, everyones up in arms, Connolly and keegan have a handbag session, everyone losses their s""t, both sides. Mick Lyons was a savage of a full back, hard, aggressive, yes dirty, but will always have the respect of Dublin fans my age because he was a great footballer. I never heard anyone say he wasn't in Dublin and I never remember anyone saying anything but positive things about him personally. When did we all decide that a little bit of bite was a terrible thing? I listened to Sean Boylan and David Brady talk about the meath vs mayo replay in 96 and the row. No one died, football was played, lads got on, no one reckons anyone involved is a scumbag, so whats changed?" You were going fine there for a while & yes all of us who played liked the physicality of the game but then you admit that you sledged/mouthed at players & you weren't proud of it. End of any respect immediately, you are now pontificating, I played with a lad who had mental health issues & a guy he was marking started the mouthing & while it wasn't extreme it was nasty & unknown to the guy it hit a very raw nerve with our lad. It lead to this lad having to be taken off & a setback for him afterwards. I played hard but one thing I despised was guys sledging/mouthing, the work of a coward. Seems to be part of all games now but let's be honest if you have to go down that road your not much of a man. Seems that you want to take the high moral ground but with double standards.
moc.dna (Galway) - Posts: 1212 - 24/09/2016 17:26:50
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Replying To moc.dna: "You were going fine there for a while & yes all of us who played liked the physicality of the game but then you admit that you sledged/mouthed at players & you weren't proud of it. End of any respect immediately, you are now pontificating, I played with a lad who had mental health issues & a guy he was marking started the mouthing & while it wasn't extreme it was nasty & unknown to the guy it hit a very raw nerve with our lad. It lead to this lad having to be taken off & a setback for him afterwards. I played hard but one thing I despised was guys sledging/mouthing, the work of a coward. Seems to be part of all games now but let's be honest if you have to go down that road your not much of a man. Seems that you want to take the high moral ground but with double standards." Yup. Manliness and nastiness are close allied, and thin partitions do their bounds divide (slight quote alteration there I know)
If you wanna get into your opponents head, do it by winning the first ball that comes between ye.
joncarter (Galway) - Posts: 2692 - 24/09/2016 17:52:42
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Replying To moc.dna: "You were going fine there for a while & yes all of us who played liked the physicality of the game but then you admit that you sledged/mouthed at players & you weren't proud of it. End of any respect immediately, you are now pontificating, I played with a lad who had mental health issues & a guy he was marking started the mouthing & while it wasn't extreme it was nasty & unknown to the guy it hit a very raw nerve with our lad. It lead to this lad having to be taken off & a setback for him afterwards. I played hard but one thing I despised was guys sledging/mouthing, the work of a coward. Seems to be part of all games now but let's be honest if you have to go down that road your not much of a man. Seems that you want to take the high moral ground but with double standards." Sorry to hear about your friend. I mean that genuinely.
To be fair I'm not taking any moral high ground, I'm discussing the reality of the game as I see it. If no one in you're club has every called anyone a name on the pitch or done something cynical fair play.
If like me players have occasionally lost their temper and called someone a f==er then I hope uve pulled them up on it immediately and questioned their manhood. Sounds like ur either in a club full of people with excellent manners or you're not being honest. I know that sounds personal but it's not meant that way.
Beepee (Dublin) - Posts: 17 - 24/09/2016 17:52:55
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Replying To Beepee: "This is my first thread on Hoganstand and to be honest only my second post but I have been a long time lurker on this site and read most threads on the national and Dublin forums. Im from Dublin, hurled and played football with my club for my entire life, Im 38 now so finished up, my dad played hurling for his county and was very successful and my brothers and sisters all played for most of their youth and adult lives. My friends and social circle basically revolve around the GAA and Im thankful of what the games and the organisation have given me.
The thing I cant get my head around is the posting of some people on here, they call players scum and accuse them of thuggery and nastiness at every turn. They slam teams for being cynical and scream about referees not carding players like they've murdered someone. Its like they never played the games. Our games are great, they are physical, competitive and yes combative, the way they should be. People get abused for being hard or dirty like these are awful things to be? If you've played you know that every team and every player bends the rules, that physicality and yes even a little bit of aggression are required to be successful. Im not trying to play the keyboard warrior, and im not condoning cheap shots or diving or any of that s££t but I don't understand why now every physical contact of a tough nature is being focused on and people are expanding these incidents as indicators of a players character.
In short our games are good, hard, physical and safe to play. Anyone who has played knows this, I challenge anyone to watch the 4 Dublin v Meath games from 1991 and tell me they weren't great, as tough, physical and combative as any games in GAA history. So my question is why all the hate for our games and the players? Cant we just leave them play and the referees decide and shake hands on it after without weeks of mickey mouse over analysis and personal attacks on players?
Up the dubs!!!!!" are you a clergyman?
liner (Mayo) - Posts: 756 - 24/09/2016 18:09:56
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Replying To BlastCalyle: "I don't think everything typed on these fora are really meant tbh.
I 'hate' Philly McMahon, but would love to have him on my team. (Well, last year anyway!)
Diarmuid Connolly drives me nuts, but I think he was the best player in the country.
I agree with the general jist of your post, but also think we should probably take more of the posts on here with a pinch of salt." Aye , bit of banter.
GameOfTyrones (Tyrone) - Posts: 469 - 24/09/2016 18:17:56
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I've yet to see a supporter score from the stands or a poster commit a cynical foul. Seriously. Pinch of salt.
legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7840 - 24/09/2016 18:29:18
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Replying To joncarter: "i would argue that the diving, cheating etc that has crept into our games has caused far more damage than anything said on this message board.
You had a Tyrone minor recently taunting a Donegal player about the death of his father. thats worse than anything Ive ever read on here, and youll find that most posters on here also play, too (or at least have played)
Im all for good hard play but there has to be some honour involved in it too, and there is no excuse for being "dirty"." You are kidding yourself if you think diving, cheating, etc. has only just crept in within the last few years I would argue that it has been present throughout the history of the gaa. I give you the example of the 1936 Connacht final where galways Brendan Nestor caused a riot after a melee in front of the Mayo goal in which the ball drifted into the goal and Nestor raised the flag himself and got the goal awarded and a draw. Thens there Kerry rough cynical play in the 1939 semi v mayo and the same in the 1940s against Antrim! Tyrone or Ulster teams didn't event that type of football. Granted these things are more visable because of the improved TV coverage but theses things are not new to the gaa.
Spoddgy (Mayo) - Posts: 660 - 24/09/2016 19:11:31
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Replying To SirStrawHat: "Ah! Beepee Beepee Beepee...
Cmere til I have a word in your shell-like.
We all start off like you. You're a bit like that lad in The Shining who arrives to save the day and gets a hatchet buried in him as soon as he walks in the door!
You'll get nowhere here with that hippy attitude.
You need to get a rise out of people.
Try a bit of stereotypical Dublin arrogance or condescension. Give out about the ref or the fact that Mayo ended up with more tickets.
Otherwise your just talking to the wall. Remember this is an anonymous forum. You can say whatever you like!
Don't worry. Be like them poor little Mayo lads...
Pick yourself up and have another run at it." Them little Mayo lads picked themselves up and won the U21 title this year (beating the Dubs along the way). It's the big Mayo lads we have the problem with.
Llaw_Gyffes (Mayo) - Posts: 1113 - 24/09/2016 20:00:41
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Replying To Beepee: "Fair enough, Ill bring up the fact that Dublin have twice the amount of Hurling All Irelands that Mayo have in total......lads in work love that one...." So a county with 10 times our population has more All Irelands in hurling than we have in football and that is surprising how? Sounds like a riot in your work! A lot of sense in your original post.
Llaw_Gyffes (Mayo) - Posts: 1113 - 24/09/2016 20:16:03
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Replying To Spoddgy: "You are kidding yourself if you think diving, cheating, etc. has only just crept in within the last few years I would argue that it has been present throughout the history of the gaa. I give you the example of the 1936 Connacht final where galways Brendan Nestor caused a riot after a melee in front of the Mayo goal in which the ball drifted into the goal and Nestor raised the flag himself and got the goal awarded and a draw. Thens there Kerry rough cynical play in the 1939 semi v mayo and the same in the 1940s against Antrim! Tyrone or Ulster teams didn't event that type of football. Granted these things are more visable because of the improved TV coverage but theses things are not new to the gaa." im sure there were specific examples dotted throughout the history of the GAA, in fact I remember Spillane taking a dive once in a GAA gold match I watched,(one of his teammates dragged him up and balled him out of it by the way) but was it a mainstream tactic like it is now? I dont think so. I got into the GAA back in 1998, never missed a televised game in 5 years(bar the ones I went to), and the first time I ever saw it was in the all ireland semi of 2003 (Tyrone v Kerry) and again in that final (Phillip Jordan tricking the ref into sending off Diarmuid Marsden).
Been seeing it regularly ever since, from various different counties. (some more than others)
And just to point out, just because something has always been happening doesnt mean we should just accept it.
joncarter (Galway) - Posts: 2692 - 24/09/2016 20:28:19
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