HoganStand GAA Football and Hurling

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Is it now time for a CAA - Club Administrators Ass

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I just looked on the GAA website to read about how some American lecturer in Sport loves the structure of the GAA, And how American sport is going down the professional route too much. Did no one mention to him about the raft of "OUTSIDE" trainers,managers etc. etc. now getting paid to train teams and how the poor old Club administrators have to find the funds to pay such people,when any such funds could be used to develop underage players in the club. The ethos of a local man training their local senior team is eroding at an alarming rate,trainers and managers going from club to club maximising training sessions to maximising earnings and in reality having little or no empathy with the club itself (outside of the senior team they are training). The players do not really care either they want everything handed to them,micro analysing everything from training and management, taking no responsibility for their own performance and wanting rid of the new trainer who cost their club a fortune in the first place if they do no "like" him. In a nutshell,I feel, the GAA are moving in the wrong direction and there will be a disaffected group of administrators who will just not want to give up their time for a club that has lost its part in the community. Am I correct,maybe not but its certainly beginning to feel that way. gohome (USA) - Posts: 20 - 10/01/2017 20:09:01 1944686 Link
Replying To gohome: "I just looked on the GAA website to read about how some American lecturer in Sport loves the structure of the GAA, And how American sport is going down the professional route too much. Did no one mention to him about the raft of "OUTSIDE" trainers,managers etc. etc. now getting paid to train teams and how the poor old Club administrators have to find the funds to pay such people,when any such funds could be used to develop underage players in the club. The ethos of a local man training their local senior team is eroding at an alarming rate,trainers and managers going from club to club maximising training sessions to maximising earnings and in reality having little or no empathy with the club itself (outside of the senior team they are training). The players do not really care either they want everything handed to them,micro analysing everything from training and management, taking no responsibility for their own performance and wanting rid of the new trainer who cost their club a fortune in the first place if they do no "like" him. In a nutshell,I feel, the GAA are moving in the wrong direction and there will be a disaffected group of administrators who will just not want to give up their time for a club that has lost its part in the community. Am I correct,maybe not but its certainly beginning to feel that way." Massive problem at club level, same guys in every county doing the circuit being paid cash. Some clubs have gone from having healthy balance sheets to being in debt due to paying one off managers who usually leave after one year, don't stay for the last game & after getting €15, 000 DONT even have the manners to furnish a report for the AGM. What is even more disgraceful is that many of these guys are in very well paid jobs & are training lads who have no employment. A very simple solution is Revenue to come in & investigate, there would be a huge haul for them with non declaration of income & penalties applied to that. Revenue are the answer. moc.dna (Galway) - Posts: 1212 - 10/01/2017 22:22:46 1944731 Link
Replying To moc.dna: "Massive problem at club level, same guys in every county doing the circuit being paid cash. Some clubs have gone from having healthy balance sheets to being in debt due to paying one off managers who usually leave after one year, don't stay for the last game & after getting €15, 000 DONT even have the manners to furnish a report for the AGM. What is even more disgraceful is that many of these guys are in very well paid jobs & are training lads who have no employment. A very simple solution is Revenue to come in & investigate, there would be a huge haul for them with non declaration of income & penalties applied to that. Revenue are the answer." Super post Gohome and I think you got it absolutely correct. It is now very rare to see a home grown manager at club level and this is going on at Senior / Intermediate / Junior level. Maybe your association should be called the GVAA , the Gaelic Volunteers Athletic Association. As someone who puts in a modest amount of time in volunteering and equally modest amount in various sponsorships , I am watching this very carefully and really hate the way it is going. facethepuckout (Roscommon) - Posts: 213 - 10/01/2017 23:13:06 1944744 Link
i agree 100%..Its time to put these mercenaries out of our clubs,Hopefully the CPA will head up this task in the near future lasertech (UK) - Posts: 129 - 11/01/2017 08:48:01 1944760 Link
The Ethos of the Amateur status is being abused left right and centre. Rules for managers and backroom staff should be the same as for players at club and county level. Be from the county or club or be working or living in the county you manage. Same as it is for the players. That would soon stop the money drain and the 6/7 nights training st county level. It's become a total money making racket and it's the players that are suffering. Awwwwnow (Cavan) - Posts: 1050 - 11/01/2017 08:49:05 1944761 Link
No proper Gaa man would manage an other club in his own county that would be pitted against his home club. Nor would a proper Gaa man manage a county to beat his own county unless he was getting well paid for it. Awwwwnow (Cavan) - Posts: 1050 - 11/01/2017 09:17:21 1944766 Link
There is always a flip side here. Whats better? Keep going with failed people within the Club who have more agendas than Donald Trump and the team and club going nowhere or take a chance bringing in someone from the outside? Not every outside trainer/manager is a mercenary only concerned with the money and no regard for the Club, its a very simplistic view to assume that. On the flip side you have managers from within clubs doing untold damage because of personal agendas with players becoming completely disillusioned. Its simplistic to assume having a local club man as manager is all good and an outside trainer/ manager is all bad. If Clubs are putting themselves in debt to bring in an outside man then they are not being run properly in the first place by the local men in charge. tearintom (Wexford) - Posts: 1325 - 11/01/2017 09:47:55 1944768 Link
Replying To tearintom: "There is always a flip side here. Whats better? Keep going with failed people within the Club who have more agendas than Donald Trump and the team and club going nowhere or take a chance bringing in someone from the outside? Not every outside trainer/manager is a mercenary only concerned with the money and no regard for the Club, its a very simplistic view to assume that. On the flip side you have managers from within clubs doing untold damage because of personal agendas with players becoming completely disillusioned. Its simplistic to assume having a local club man as manager is all good and an outside trainer/ manager is all bad. If Clubs are putting themselves in debt to bring in an outside man then they are not being run properly in the first place by the local men in charge." Moneys not easy to come by in relatively small clubs,so I would assume paying an outside manager is a bit of a luxury. I do agree that some people in local club have too many agendas, you are correct it that assessment. gohome (USA) - Posts: 20 - 11/01/2017 10:38:33 1944780 Link
tearintom (Wexford) No one has a problem with an outside manager but this racket of €100 a night is a load of dung...Give the man a few quid for petrol no problem but you would want to be travelling a fair distance that €20 of fuel wouldnt cover. Remember these guys should be involved for the same reason as the rest of us,Its a hobby and we enjoy it lasertech (UK) - Posts: 129 - 11/01/2017 10:55:14 1944784 Link
Replying To gohome: "Moneys not easy to come by in relatively small clubs,so I would assume paying an outside manager is a bit of a luxury. I do agree that some people in local club have too many agendas, you are correct it that assessment." Why are clubs and counties allowed outside managers? Players can only play with where they live/ work or are from. Why not the same for managers? After all it's an amateur game isn't it? Awwwwnow (Cavan) - Posts: 1050 - 11/01/2017 10:59:04 1944785 Link
Replying To Awwwwnow: "Why are clubs and counties allowed outside managers? Players can only play with where they live/ work or are from. Why not the same for managers? After all it's an amateur game isn't it?" Thats not true in Louth.. The amount of transfers every year is a joke! An example, 2 brothers left 1 town team to join another town team, played for 2 seasons (won an Inter Champ) and then moved back to original club. A goalkeeper this year, has a transfer in to a town team from a country team (GK lives in area of his country team) DundalkGael (Louth) - Posts: 891 - 11/01/2017 13:18:13 1944837 Link
Replying To lasertech: "tearintom (Wexford) No one has a problem with an outside manager but this racket of €100 a night is a load of dung...Give the man a few quid for petrol no problem but you would want to be travelling a fair distance that €20 of fuel wouldnt cover. Remember these guys should be involved for the same reason as the rest of us,Its a hobby and we enjoy it" 100 quid a night it's nothing to what's being paid out. I know a club hurling manager who was wanted by 3 different clubs this year and he took the club that was farthest away even though the other 2 teams have a better chance of success. The team he took was 90 further away . It's all about the Cash lads! Let no one tell you any different. Awwwwnow (Cavan) - Posts: 1050 - 11/01/2017 14:15:52 1944855 Link
Replying To tearintom: "There is always a flip side here. Whats better? Keep going with failed people within the Club who have more agendas than Donald Trump and the team and club going nowhere or take a chance bringing in someone from the outside? Not every outside trainer/manager is a mercenary only concerned with the money and no regard for the Club, its a very simplistic view to assume that. On the flip side you have managers from within clubs doing untold damage because of personal agendas with players becoming completely disillusioned. Its simplistic to assume having a local club man as manager is all good and an outside trainer/ manager is all bad. If Clubs are putting themselves in debt to bring in an outside man then they are not being run properly in the first place by the local men in charge." I agree with you on this you put it across well. If clubs (and I know from experience as mine is one of the biggest but certainly not the best) stick to club players/club members coaching the result will be a nepotic environment that only leads to inbred mediocrity. Outside voices encourage new methods and new ideas and gives players a fair chance. I'd rather have a club that is run for success, both personal and club rather than some sort of aul'fella's whining about the lack of talent at their disposal and not fit enough to stick a flag in the ground. arock (Dublin) - Posts: 4893 - 11/01/2017 14:35:11 1944863 Link
Replying To tearintom: "There is always a flip side here. Whats better? Keep going with failed people within the Club who have more agendas than Donald Trump and the team and club going nowhere or take a chance bringing in someone from the outside? Not every outside trainer/manager is a mercenary only concerned with the money and no regard for the Club, its a very simplistic view to assume that. On the flip side you have managers from within clubs doing untold damage because of personal agendas with players becoming completely disillusioned. Its simplistic to assume having a local club man as manager is all good and an outside trainer/ manager is all bad. If Clubs are putting themselves in debt to bring in an outside man then they are not being run properly in the first place by the local men in charge." Not every outside trainer/manager is a mercenary only concerned with the money and no regard for the Club, its a very simplistic view to assume that. ?????? Of course they are mercenary ,.. If they weren't getting paid they wouldnt do it . This is a curse on the GAA right now that needs weeding out . I would Make every senior coach register as a coach for the clubs they are coaching with no transfer allowed for 5 years with the usual exceptions similar to players and same penalty for breaches too . Then the club would call the shots and simply not pay any coach . Every club has clowns with agendas , just need to be strong enough not to let them rule . Finsceal (None) - Posts: 559 - 11/01/2017 14:46:24 1944865 Link
Replying To facethepuckout: "Super post Gohome and I think you got it absolutely correct. It is now very rare to see a home grown manager at club level and this is going on at Senior / Intermediate / Junior level. Maybe your association should be called the GVAA , the Gaelic Volunteers Athletic Association. As someone who puts in a modest amount of time in volunteering and equally modest amount in various sponsorships , I am watching this very carefully and really hate the way it is going." Credit for being a volunteer & sponsor, however are you able to track your sponsorship. Let's presume you hand over a cheque, Is it going into one account, then are people being paid for coaching from that account & how much & what percentage of income is going to those individuals & is the one club account your sponsorship goes into paying out this cash to these "volunteers". Most sponsors & club members don't attend club meetings or AGM's as they don't want to be involved in the politics, as a result most are unaware of the reality of the situation. moc.dna (Galway) - Posts: 1212 - 11/01/2017 16:36:31 1944912 Link
Replying To tearintom: "There is always a flip side here. Whats better? Keep going with failed people within the Club who have more agendas than Donald Trump and the team and club going nowhere or take a chance bringing in someone from the outside? Not every outside trainer/manager is a mercenary only concerned with the money and no regard for the Club, its a very simplistic view to assume that. On the flip side you have managers from within clubs doing untold damage because of personal agendas with players becoming completely disillusioned. Its simplistic to assume having a local club man as manager is all good and an outside trainer/ manager is all bad. If Clubs are putting themselves in debt to bring in an outside man then they are not being run properly in the first place by the local men in charge." It's not a simplistic view, it's a view that is factual & causing huge problems within clubs. You refer to clubs been mismanaged from within & yes this happens as many members walk when they see people from the outside coming in & getting paid whilst the volunteer who in most cases does more for the club for nothing than the mercenary coming in. You also mention that a club who were going no where might have a better chance with an outside manager, well it's fact that in all counties there can only be one winner so most of these guys are unsuccessful. Please don't start telling us about Rochford & Corofin. That is a one off & he also inherited a very good club team with fantastic structures. 99% of these guys don't succeed. As for clubs with guys having agendas, I am afraid to tell you that after decades involved, the Gaa is rotten with that. These guys are of no benefit to any club, I have yet to see or hear of an outside manager who was paid come into a club, stay , win something & set up structures to bring the club forward. Mercenary is the only term to use for people who are hopping from club to club, I see one man appointed in one county who is on his 8th club, no legacy left behind other than the lotto committee's having to sell more to make up for the money paid out. moc.dna (Galway) - Posts: 1212 - 11/01/2017 16:50:19 1944916 Link
Replying To DundalkGael: "Thats not true in Louth.. The amount of transfers every year is a joke! An example, 2 brothers left 1 town team to join another town team, played for 2 seasons (won an Inter Champ) and then moved back to original club. A goalkeeper this year, has a transfer in to a town team from a country team (GK lives in area of his country team)" Same in Galway which is rife with it, some lads playing with their fourth club. At present there is one player who left one club to join another & now he wants to leave again & clubs are canvassing him to join them, it's a laugh. moc.dna (Galway) - Posts: 1212 - 11/01/2017 16:54:12 1944917 Link
Replying To moc.dna: "Same in Galway which is rife with it, some lads playing with their fourth club. At present there is one player who left one club to join another & now he wants to leave again & clubs are canvassing him to join them, it's a laugh." He should just be refused a transfer, Simple! DundalkGael (Louth) - Posts: 891 - 12/01/2017 13:30:27 1945151 Link
gohome- good post and I agree with most of what is being said, however there are cases where a guy in a club musters up enough support to manage his own club when in reality he has no management or football skills. And a good old manager is better than a bad young one. There are still guys who manage teams without any reward of any kind. Players have a lot to answer for, as in most cases they do not, or will not, respect a manager-except the ones that they do not know-one from the outside. Players always blame the manager when the lose, when it is themselves who are responsible. I am glad that the new club player organisation has been formed as I think the whole county set has gone bonkers with training and associated costs- gone is the day when a player can do a labouring job or have a trade and commit to the county. browncows (Meath) - Posts: 2342 - 12/01/2017 15:35:34 1945195 Link