National Forum

Counties Missed Opportunities....

(Oldest Posts First) - Go To The Latest Post


Replying To wexico15:  "Waterford were different animals in 07 and 08, 07 was arguably the peak of that swashbuckling team, Dan getting 8-12 in 5 games for example, beat Cork for the 1st time in Croke Park after already beating them in Munster, ye ambushed them in the semi final and fair play for that, would they have put it up to Kilkenny in the final, I think they would have been competitive anyway.

08 was different they got well beat by Clare in Munster after the change of manager stumbled through the qualifiers beat Offaly by 6 ( Eoin Kelly got 2-13 out of 2-18) and ourselves by a point in the quarter final and I'd say ourselves and Offaly along with Dublin were ranked 8,9 and 10 and that time, in the semi final the shoe was on the other foot from 07 when they ambushed Tipp who were very impressive in Munster."
Agreed. In 2007, Waterford were hugely impressive in Munster and they beat Limerick easily in the final. In those days, the provincial champions and runners-up both just qualified for the all-Ireland quarter finals. Waterford had the terrible luck to come up against Cork, who were by far the strongest team coming through the back door. It went to a replay and Waterford won after 2 epic hard-fought encounters. A week later, they came up against a Limerick side that had a comfortable quarter-final win over Clare followed by an extra week's rest and Waterford just did not have enough gas left in the tank. I think they would have given Kilkenny a right good rattle in 2007.

Gaillimh_Abu (Galway) - Posts: 996 - 08/07/2020 03:42:36    2283423

Link

Replying To leitrim4sam:  "In the 133 year history of the All Ireland championship Leitrim have never beaten Roscommon at home, every time we have beaten them it has been in Roscommon. We have drawn with them at home but never beaten them. Our biggest rivals. In the All Ireland Qualifiers in 2003 we drew them at home, played a fantastic game and were winning deep in to injury time by 1-11 to 1-9 when Roscommon scored a scrambled goal to put them a point ahead, our goalkeeper kicked the ball out and the game was over. Thats the one that always kills me looking back, leaving the ground with the Rossie fans singing to the tune of living next door to Alice " all my life I've been living next door to Leitrim, Leitrim who the f... are Leitrim!""
They have little to be singing about.

The biggest missed opportunity in our history was the 1995 Connacht Championship. Handed the semi final to Galway in Carrick and lost by a point, Galway kick Mayo off the field in the final who we had beaten in the final the year before. Then Galway lost to Tyrone by a goal in the AI semi, a team we had beaten in the league that year if i remember correctly. We most likely would have lost the AI final had we got to it against Dublin, but who knows.

republicofcloone (Leitrim) - Posts: 375 - 08/07/2020 08:35:00    2283426

Link

Replying To bearindsquare:  "I was thinking the same. Dublin were definitely there for the taking that day and Kerry were in the final too but if Donegal had of won it that year would it of just pushed the fall a year earlier?"
It's a funny one. In the spring of 2012 Kerry absolutely walloped us down there. McGuinness refers to it specifically in his book as a wake up call. He even went so far as to say that he was actually glad we didn't beat Dublin in the semi final. That the team was not quite far enough along in its development to take on and beat Kerry in an All Ireland final. If we had met Kerry in the 2011 final and were beaten well who knows how it would have affected Donegal.

Lockjaw (Donegal) - Posts: 9116 - 08/07/2020 08:57:49    2283428

Link

Replying To dickie10:  "Meath probably threw away a leinster title in 2007, easily beat Kildare in the opening round and then lost after a replay to dublin in leinster semi final. some extremly dubious ref descions against meath the first day, disallowing perfect geraghty goal. We would have had a Laois team past its best in final. Although Meath got the karma in the Leinster final three years later v Louth when the got the bit of luck all teams need."
Geraghty should've had a penalty that day too. (although his disallowed goal, he did put a hand on the Dublin defender).
It's on youtube.

He did have a perfectly good goal disallowed, possibly in that game or the replay (or maybe another year v Dublin) when he jumped to punch in a high ball and got done for a foul or square ball - it was neither.

cavanman47 (Cavan) - Posts: 5010 - 08/07/2020 12:27:58    2283458

Link

Great thread. I know we will get no sympathy but Kilkenny lost the 99 All Ireland when We had a wide open goal chance that was hit over the bar which would have probably ended the match for Cork. We got our fair share of breaks though the 93 Leinster Final drawn match, Wexford played as good a match as any team could play only to get drawn by one of the greatest team points ever in championship hurling. By the way this was one of the greatest matches ever played. The 4 in a row All Ireland, Tipp had 3 super goal chance and didn't convert any of them if they had scored 1 of them I think it woud have been very hard for Kilkenny to come back. That is sport a great as it is it is also very painful.

gatha (Kilkenny) - Posts: 318 - 08/07/2020 13:01:46    2283467

Link

Replying To leitrim4sam:  "In the 133 year history of the All Ireland championship Leitrim have never beaten Roscommon at home, every time we have beaten them it has been in Roscommon. We have drawn with them at home but never beaten them. Our biggest rivals. In the All Ireland Qualifiers in 2003 we drew them at home, played a fantastic game and were winning deep in to injury time by 1-11 to 1-9 when Roscommon scored a scrambled goal to put them a point ahead, our goalkeeper kicked the ball out and the game was over. Thats the one that always kills me looking back, leaving the ground with the Rossie fans singing to the tune of living next door to Alice " all my life I've been living next door to Leitrim, Leitrim who the f... are Leitrim!""
Remember that game well, we should have been out the gap long before the goal which was the only time that day that our full back dropped a ball he was outstanding - the single most sickening defeat I ever remember and I've seen plenty. Always was nothing between the teams in those days sadly not the case now

green.and.gold (Leitrim) - Posts: 427 - 08/07/2020 13:10:13    2283468

Link

2001 QF v Kerry (first game) - To come back from 9 points down to go a point ahead, the last 20 mins, we were all over them, Kerry couldn't lay a glove on us. And then Davey Byrne kicked the ball out over the sideline form a goal kick, criminal error. And we all know what Maurice Fitz done then!! Even with that we still had a 45' to win it at the death, and ill never know why Wayne McCarthy took that 45. He was a small fella and it was into the wind. Everyone and their mother could of told you he hadn't the power for that kick. Bad management. I was sick, as at that time Kerry had the hoodoo over us and i knew our chance was gone and that we would be beaten in the replay.

2002 SF v Armagh - A cracker of a game, thought we had played brilliantly against a brilliant Armagh team. 1 point down last kick of the game, we get a handy free. Ray Cosgrove, who was outstanding all year and MOTM on the day, steps up and hits the bar and the final whistle blows.

2006 SF v Mayo - Threw away a 7 point lead with less than 20 mins to go. Ciaran McDonald snatches it at the death with an outstanding score. SICKENING!!

The above are 3 games that always stick out to me as missed opportunities, and still hurt today. This was during our 16 year baron period without even making a final. I remember thinking we'd never win an all Ireland, we always found a way to lose big games. Nowadays we always find a way to win big games. 2011 changed everything. Who knows what could have happened this decade if we failed to get over the line that year.

ConnollyDub (Dublin) - Posts: 2007 - 08/07/2020 14:03:56    2283478

Link

why is that dublin when a point down always seem to get 4-5 mins injury time, they dont ever seem to get 2 mins injury time when chasing a game. overall does anyine think theres way to much injury tiime played now? i will never forgive seamus prior from lietrim for his timekeeping in the 1991 all ireland final, he blew the final whistle 28 seconds into injury time, when down kicked the ball out over the line. meath 2 points down with a asideline in on midfield. 28 seconds injury time......

dickie10 (UK) - Posts: 685 - 08/07/2020 14:31:17    2283485

Link

Replying To dickie10:  "why is that dublin when a point down always seem to get 4-5 mins injury time, they dont ever seem to get 2 mins injury time when chasing a game. overall does anyine think theres way to much injury tiime played now? i will never forgive seamus prior from lietrim for his timekeeping in the 1991 all ireland final, he blew the final whistle 28 seconds into injury time, when down kicked the ball out over the line. meath 2 points down with a asideline in on midfield. 28 seconds injury time......"
must have still be sore about ye stealing Colm O'Rorke

Rosineri1 (UK) - Posts: 2099 - 08/07/2020 14:43:49    2283494

Link

Replying To dickie10:  "why is that dublin when a point down always seem to get 4-5 mins injury time, they dont ever seem to get 2 mins injury time when chasing a game. overall does anyine think theres way to much injury tiime played now? i will never forgive seamus prior from lietrim for his timekeeping in the 1991 all ireland final, he blew the final whistle 28 seconds into injury time, when down kicked the ball out over the line. meath 2 points down with a asideline in on midfield. 28 seconds injury time......"
I think the injury time now is more correct than in the past. In the past it was always hit and miss. Even now I take issue with it. Injuries in injury time never seem to get taken fully into account. The hooter/countdown clock is brilliant in ladies football but for some reason, in spite of it being passed a couple of times at congress, the top brass refuse to introduce it. Wonder what the reason really is?

Re Dublin favoritism, I don't accept that. I think favorites always get the rub of the green from refs (in all sports). Subconsciously they are expected to win so if something goes against them u are nearly wondering oh the other team must have fouled or there must be time left. I remember a Connacht v Leintster rugby game. Connacht got a try, no one appealed yet, no reason to think any issue other than how could the underdog possible score and the ref goes checking TV to make sure a foul wasn't committed.

Mayonman (Galway) - Posts: 1826 - 08/07/2020 14:48:20    2283495

Link

Replying To dickie10:  "why is that dublin when a point down always seem to get 4-5 mins injury time, they dont ever seem to get 2 mins injury time when chasing a game. overall does anyine think theres way to much injury tiime played now? i will never forgive seamus prior from lietrim for his timekeeping in the 1991 all ireland final, he blew the final whistle 28 seconds into injury time, when down kicked the ball out over the line. meath 2 points down with a asideline in on midfield. 28 seconds injury time......"
Swings and roundabouts. That was a very good Down team. If we had a decent defender in '96 they would have cleared Colm Coyle' s effort. We didn't, ye were worthy winners in the replay. We don't complain about those things too much! 25th anniversary next year!!!

GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7336 - 08/07/2020 14:50:49    2283496

Link

Replying To wexico15:  "Remember that game well in 2001, Fitzhenry made a rare mistake in that game and showed his resolve to slot a penalty and the unstoppable 21 at the death, the brilliant goal you referenced was actually Rory McCarthy, if my memory serves me right you're big regret that day was a string of poor wides, ironically we'd see that year as a missed opportunity too, in the semi final drawn game against tipperary ref blew up about 45 seconds early we had all the momentum at that point, we were actually 8 points down early in the 2nd half but 3 goals got us back in the game and as things turned out we missed chances in the last 5 minutes which could have given us the win, tipperary to be fair won the replay comfortably. Listening to Brian Carroll's podcast with Jamesie O'connor he actually mentioned it as a regret they lost to tipp by a point in the last knockout Munster semi final as felt they were on the wrong end of poor officiating from Dickie Murphy."
I remember Davy Fitz had plenty to say about "Dickie Murphy and his big smile" after that game. But the same Dickie had been rather generous to Clare two years previously when giving Conor Clancy a soft penalty near the end which Davy nailed to snatch a draw. Tipp should have won that day but Clare were vastly superior in the replay. In fairness, Dickie was one of my all-time favourite referees. Of course he made the odd mistake (don't we all) but I always felt he understood the game very well and I don't believe we have anybody as good nowadays. Then again, maybe the modern referee is subjected to more pressure, both from their assessors and from TV replays and analysis.

midlands (Westmeath) - Posts: 541 - 08/07/2020 15:14:44    2283504

Link

Replying To Mayonman:  "I think the injury time now is more correct than in the past. In the past it was always hit and miss. Even now I take issue with it. Injuries in injury time never seem to get taken fully into account. The hooter/countdown clock is brilliant in ladies football but for some reason, in spite of it being passed a couple of times at congress, the top brass refuse to introduce it. Wonder what the reason really is?

Re Dublin favoritism, I don't accept that. I think favorites always get the rub of the green from refs (in all sports). Subconsciously they are expected to win so if something goes against them u are nearly wondering oh the other team must have fouled or there must be time left. I remember a Connacht v Leintster rugby game. Connacht got a try, no one appealed yet, no reason to think any issue other than how could the underdog possible score and the ref goes checking TV to make sure a foul wasn't committed."
Nail on head. The biggest issue I have with injury time at the moment is referee's inability to cop on to and punish cynicism. They should be adding more time on if anything.

Lockjaw (Donegal) - Posts: 9116 - 08/07/2020 15:33:05    2283505

Link

https://www.independent.ie/regionals/kerryman/sport/other-sports/kerry-got-out-of-jail-in-1986-as-odwyer-admitted-27369282.html

V Kerry in AI Final in 86.

Numerous reasons why Tyrone lost, principally Pat Spillane playing a storming final quarter! Missing a penalty, key defender (Sean Donnelly) missing through injury; midfielder E McKenna leaving the pitch injured etc.

None of those are sufficient excuse though. If you're 7 points up with a quarter of the game left, you have to be winning it, by whatever means necessary, no matter who you're playing. No naive team ever won an AI.

Tyrone had not been mentally prepared to be in front going into the home straight. The feeling was that if we could keep Kerry to a couple of points coming into the final quarter, we'd be doing well. Being 7 points up at that stage had never been in the script.

You close the game out. Any team could do that nowadays. Tyrone just looked panicked at the thought that they had been cheeky by daring to go in front : ).

Instead, Tyrone panicked, and started playing adrenalin football. They'd have had a better chance if they'd been a point behind coming into the last quarter. It's one thing to perform well as the plucky underdog, and Tyrone in 86 could do that very well. What they lacked was Kerry's winning mentality and Kerry's experience of how to win. Kerry saw victory as a birthright; Tyrone hoped they might win and lost their composure when they saw it was a real possibility. The last quarter was probably the most headless chicken, porous Tyrone defending I've ever seen. Half forwards bombing forward, no cover, and acres of space for Pat to exploit. Which of course he did, brilliantly.

A real opportunity; but perhaps only in theory. You can't really expect a county that had never won it to have a winning mentality; so the wheels coming off psychologically was perhaps inevitable. Kerry were always going to come back in that game, and a first-time Tyrone team were never going to have the experience to close the game out. Tyrone might have beaten any other county on that day; but the respect we had for Kerry, coupled with our lack of experience, meant that we were unable truly to imagine beating them. And you'll rarely achieve what you can't imagine.

essmac (Tyrone) - Posts: 1141 - 08/07/2020 18:59:19    2283522

Link

Replying To Lockjaw:  "Nail on head. The biggest issue I have with injury time at the moment is referee's inability to cop on to and punish cynicism. They should be adding more time on if anything."
There's an awful lot of inconsistencies too, different refs seem to stop the clock for different things!

achara (Monaghan) - Posts: 561 - 08/07/2020 20:36:47    2283527

Link

Great thread. Just reading down through them, surprised nobody has mentioned our own escape out of Gaelic Park, New York in 2016! If that game had lasted another 2 minutes, New York would have had their greatest ever result. And what would have become of Roscommon? Traveling back home, the whole country ridiculing them, could have been hard to get players back again the following year. As it happened, we have gone on to have a pretty successful period, 4 provincial finals, 2 titles. As for New York, what would a win in that game have done for them in terms of investment, exposure etc? I know they also had Leitrim on the ropes in '18.

Douglas_44 (Roscommon) - Posts: 225 - 08/07/2020 21:09:53    2283535

Link

Funny you mention New York.Down through the years both New York and London had very good looking teams on paper with some great ex county players that were still young but probably had nt the same level of training as other counties.Players like Micheal Finneran (Roscommon)Timmy Dowd (Kerry)Owen Mulligan (tyrone) played with London and some fine players also with New York

CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 3674 - 08/07/2020 21:57:23    2283538

Link

Replying To ConnollyDub:  "2001 QF v Kerry (first game) - To come back from 9 points down to go a point ahead, the last 20 mins, we were all over them, Kerry couldn't lay a glove on us. And then Davey Byrne kicked the ball out over the sideline form a goal kick, criminal error. And we all know what Maurice Fitz done then!! Even with that we still had a 45' to win it at the death, and ill never know why Wayne McCarthy took that 45. He was a small fella and it was into the wind. Everyone and their mother could of told you he hadn't the power for that kick. Bad management. I was sick, as at that time Kerry had the hoodoo over us and i knew our chance was gone and that we would be beaten in the replay.

2002 SF v Armagh - A cracker of a game, thought we had played brilliantly against a brilliant Armagh team. 1 point down last kick of the game, we get a handy free. Ray Cosgrove, who was outstanding all year and MOTM on the day, steps up and hits the bar and the final whistle blows.

2006 SF v Mayo - Threw away a 7 point lead with less than 20 mins to go. Ciaran McDonald snatches it at the death with an outstanding score. SICKENING!!

The above are 3 games that always stick out to me as missed opportunities, and still hurt today. This was during our 16 year baron period without even making a final. I remember thinking we'd never win an all Ireland, we always found a way to lose big games. Nowadays we always find a way to win big games. 2011 changed everything. Who knows what could have happened this decade if we failed to get over the line that year."
ConnollyDub would you put in the year 2000 for another missed opportunity for the Dubs? They were well in control against Kildare in the Leinster Final replay. Kildare came out of the second half and scored two early goals. If the Dubs held on to win Leinster in 2000 they would have faced Galway who have not beaten the Dubs in the Championship since the 1930's. Then it would of Kerry in the final who needed a replay to see off Galway in the 2000 All Ireland final.

Ollie2 (Louth) - Posts: 782 - 08/07/2020 22:33:12    2283540

Link

Replying To Ollie2:  "ConnollyDub would you put in the year 2000 for another missed opportunity for the Dubs? They were well in control against Kildare in the Leinster Final replay. Kildare came out of the second half and scored two early goals. If the Dubs held on to win Leinster in 2000 they would have faced Galway who have not beaten the Dubs in the Championship since the 1930's. Then it would of Kerry in the final who needed a replay to see off Galway in the 2000 All Ireland final."
I don't think that Dublin team of 2000 would have beaten Galway Ollie. Even though Galway were short Ja Fallon, Tomás Mannion and Kevin Joyce they still had serious firepower and very good players all over the field. I still think John O Mahony made a mistake playing Ray Silke on Mike Frank Russell in the first game against Kerry. Richie Fahy was a better option. It's hard to believe all of that happened twenty years ago.

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6031 - 09/07/2020 01:58:37    2283548

Link

Replying To Ollie2:  "ConnollyDub would you put in the year 2000 for another missed opportunity for the Dubs? They were well in control against Kildare in the Leinster Final replay. Kildare came out of the second half and scored two early goals. If the Dubs held on to win Leinster in 2000 they would have faced Galway who have not beaten the Dubs in the Championship since the 1930's. Then it would of Kerry in the final who needed a replay to see off Galway in the 2000 All Ireland final."
I wouldn't necessarily say it was a missed opportunity to win the all Ireland, i dont think we would have won it that year. Definitely a missed opportunity to win Leinster of course, especially given at that stage we hadn't won one in 5 years. I remember the match well, another sickener. That first half was the best a Dublin team had played since 1995, but them two quickfire goals at the start of the 2nd half completely floored us. And we never recovered.

ConnollyDub (Dublin) - Posts: 2007 - 09/07/2020 11:52:02    2283568

Link