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Replying To Inaroundehouse: "Donegal a serious outfit????? We scored 2-16 against them. They a very good side but they no serious outfit.
Look what Dublin conceded against Meath. That's a serious outfit." I agree with this up to a point.
In both the semi final & final Donegal were by far the superior team in every facet of the game but got sloppy towards the end resulting in unnecessary anxiety.
They got away with it up to now but won't against top teams.
MuckrossHead (Donegal) - Posts: 5028 - 23/06/2019 21:00:06
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Replying To Game2Halves: "Donegal have reverted to type. Is Jimmy McGuiness back? It's a pity, they tried expansive football last year under Bonner but now obviously winning has outweighed the need to play entertaining football. Awful to watch, using their big physical players to spoil the game, 15 men behind the ball. Back to the norm for Donegal . I think the attacking mark will be introduced next year and hopefully will be end of this sort of playing once and for all. I thought it was just a tactic against Tyrone but obviously this is how they set up. Back to rubbish football ." Obviously you didn't enjoy your day out in Longford.......
totalrecall (Leitrim) - Posts: 916 - 23/06/2019 21:00:41
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Replying To offtheditch: "Donegal a sullenly the better team.
We made their job too easy with our kick outs and generally giving them possession too easy.
Donegal very clinical.
Donegal very very synical. Murphy plays the victim and the ref. so well." If Clarke had of spent as much time concentrating on the ball as he did body checking / pushing / sledging Murphy then the outcome might have been different
totalrecall (Leitrim) - Posts: 916 - 23/06/2019 21:05:02
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Replying To greysoil: "Thanks Ned, but I wasn't seeking your affirmation." Nor was I giving it. Merely indicating that I agreed with your assessment. You are an abrasive sort, understandable after monaghan's early departure.
Ned_Stormcrow (Cavan) - Posts: 1071 - 23/06/2019 21:13:05
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Good performance from Donegal in the first half but sloppy enough in the latter part of the second half. Cavan looked nervous at the start which was understandable and Donegal took advantage. Shaun Patton was excellent with his kickouts and pushed up on the Cavan kickouts and won quite a few of them. In the media we have suddenly moved to the top of the queue to challenge Dublin, not sure about that as we still have a way to go. However we are improving and have a good set of forwards.
Still think this is a good Cavan team who can recover and make the Super 8s. They are a team who could do well in the next few years, they have some excellent footballers.
Finally the bitterness from some Tyrone posters is astounding. It comes across as pure jealousy. I realise not all Tyrone supporters are like that but you do your county no favours with such an attitude.
Green_Gold (Donegal) - Posts: 1874 - 23/06/2019 21:17:33
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Replying To totalrecall: "If Clarke had of spent as much time concentrating on the ball as he did body checking / pushing / sledging Murphy then the outcome might have been different" I absolutely agree on Clark, however my note was not specific to Murphy albeit it could seem like that. Donegal in general were cynical, they fouled Cavan in their own half repeatedly constantly playing the man without even an attempt on the ball so that they could recalibrate their 13 - 15 men behind the ball in the first half.
One one level I admire it as they had the ability to turnover Cavan and were very clinical going forward in punishing Cavan. I just don't like it. But they went home with the cup we didn't. That's not sour grapes as after 20 minutes the game was up. If they didn't clock up 25 scores in winning the game then that would be different so it's a plan and a bloody good one with the players they have I just don't like that element if a teams play whether it brings success or not.
I do look forward to them and Dublin meeting later on in the championship with such similar gameplay.
I also look forward to further progression with Cavan with more big game experience under their belt and progress playing wise this year.
offtheditch (Cavan) - Posts: 157 - 23/06/2019 21:31:55
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Good win by Donegal and no doubt pundits will now promote them as the main challengers to Dublin. However I'm sure it will be a concern to Bonner that Cavan, who completely froze in the first twenty minutes, still managed to put up a very big score against them. Patten's kick-outs were exceptional and the forwards worked very well as a unit but the backline still looks shaky, particularly if Magee is missing. Murphy's 'tackling' must also be a source of worry for the manager
neverright (Roscommon) - Posts: 1648 - 23/06/2019 22:27:07
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Replying To offtheditch: "I absolutely agree on Clark, however my note was not specific to Murphy albeit it could seem like that. Donegal in general were cynical, they fouled Cavan in their own half repeatedly constantly playing the man without even an attempt on the ball so that they could recalibrate their 13 - 15 men behind the ball in the first half.
One one level I admire it as they had the ability to turnover Cavan and were very clinical going forward in punishing Cavan. I just don't like it. But they went home with the cup we didn't. That's not sour grapes as after 20 minutes the game was up. If they didn't clock up 25 scores in winning the game then that would be different so it's a plan and a bloody good one with the players they have I just don't like that element if a teams play whether it brings success or not.
I do look forward to them and Dublin meeting later on in the championship with such similar gameplay.
I also look forward to further progression with Cavan with more big game experience under their belt and progress playing wise this year." You have to foul in them areas. Donegal are an extremely defensive/counter attacking team.....it's the cornerstone off playing this way.
Not criticising Donegal. Tyrone do it as well. Just some deluded Donegal fans don't realise they are a defensive/counter attacking team.
The_Fridge (Tyrone) - Posts: 2088 - 23/06/2019 23:05:07
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First think i done after the game was went out onto the pitch to congratulate these players, and believe me they were in bits. It killed me to bring my little lad up to get an autograph but by god they signed them when i'm sure they would rather be alone in the biggest hole know to man. Proud yes, Mountains of men, Tough men, athletes, specimens of men for sure, Goliath's of the highest calibre, Davids... well maybe not....
You have to admire Donegal in what hey brought to the table. We couldn't seem to get a hand on them and it wasn't just the direct play but the second wave that came from midfield the ensure a move didn't break down. At that speed it meant that contact (with a cavan defender) was rarely an option. In the latter end they took points when really goals were on offer
Someone mentioned earlier the attention Clarke gave Murphy, well i'd say the rest of the Cavan backs need to read Clarkes book. The attention Martin Reilly, McVeety and other got was worse. Now i may sound vindictive but i do admire what Donegal done and i think they have brought professional fouling to a new level. Any break by Cavan was more often than now met with a Donegal foul (at the same same time i ask the question where was the support). If i remember correctly in the middle of the first half with McAveety bearing down on goals, a defender catches him with both hands pulls him but lets go at the last second. We get a free and a score. Black card...no... Professional foul.. you bet your bottom dollar.
Conor lane gave a red card to Ciaran Brady in the drawn game against Armagh when he made contact with an opponents head coming out of a tackle. Same referee today gave Murphy a yellow with quite similar reckless tackle on our Goalie. Neither in my view were a red but at he same time consistency. Caolan Mooney also comes to mind
Cavan have move moved from an ultra defensive system where you in truth you didn't need to defend that well as there were always a couple of buddies around to swarm an attacker. I like our style of football but if we are going to play this way we really need to go back and learn how to defend especially in 1 on 1 scenarios. We need to get nasty (really f***king nasty) to the point that it stifles runs and moves of the opposition. Until then our David's are Goliaths....
Btw, my young lad is chuffed and wants to one of these Cavan guys. There's more to this than an Ulster Championship and its the generation that come next. Thats a smile on my face..
ponger (Cavan) - Posts: 540 - 23/06/2019 23:45:59
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Replying To ponger: "First think i done after the game was went out onto the pitch to congratulate these players, and believe me they were in bits. It killed me to bring my little lad up to get an autograph but by god they signed them when i'm sure they would rather be alone in the biggest hole know to man. Proud yes, Mountains of men, Tough men, athletes, specimens of men for sure, Goliath's of the highest calibre, Davids... well maybe not....
You have to admire Donegal in what hey brought to the table. We couldn't seem to get a hand on them and it wasn't just the direct play but the second wave that came from midfield the ensure a move didn't break down. At that speed it meant that contact (with a cavan defender) was rarely an option. In the latter end they took points when really goals were on offer
Someone mentioned earlier the attention Clarke gave Murphy, well i'd say the rest of the Cavan backs need to read Clarkes book. The attention Martin Reilly, McVeety and other got was worse. Now i may sound vindictive but i do admire what Donegal done and i think they have brought professional fouling to a new level. Any break by Cavan was more often than now met with a Donegal foul (at the same same time i ask the question where was the support). If i remember correctly in the middle of the first half with McAveety bearing down on goals, a defender catches him with both hands pulls him but lets go at the last second. We get a free and a score. Black card...no... Professional foul.. you bet your bottom dollar.
Conor lane gave a red card to Ciaran Brady in the drawn game against Armagh when he made contact with an opponents head coming out of a tackle. Same referee today gave Murphy a yellow with quite similar reckless tackle on our Goalie. Neither in my view were a red but at he same time consistency. Caolan Mooney also comes to mind
Cavan have move moved from an ultra defensive system where you in truth you didn't need to defend that well as there were always a couple of buddies around to swarm an attacker. I like our style of football but if we are going to play this way we really need to go back and learn how to defend especially in 1 on 1 scenarios. We need to get nasty (really f***king nasty) to the point that it stifles runs and moves of the opposition. Until then our David's are Goliaths....
Btw, my young lad is chuffed and wants to one of these Cavan guys. There's more to this than an Ulster Championship and its the generation that come next. Thats a smile on my face.." Good post, but Conor Lane didn't ref the drawn Armagh game.
cavanman47 (Cavan) - Posts: 5012 - 24/06/2019 08:28:08
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Replying To ponger: "First think i done after the game was went out onto the pitch to congratulate these players, and believe me they were in bits. It killed me to bring my little lad up to get an autograph but by god they signed them when i'm sure they would rather be alone in the biggest hole know to man. Proud yes, Mountains of men, Tough men, athletes, specimens of men for sure, Goliath's of the highest calibre, Davids... well maybe not....
You have to admire Donegal in what hey brought to the table. We couldn't seem to get a hand on them and it wasn't just the direct play but the second wave that came from midfield the ensure a move didn't break down. At that speed it meant that contact (with a cavan defender) was rarely an option. In the latter end they took points when really goals were on offer
Someone mentioned earlier the attention Clarke gave Murphy, well i'd say the rest of the Cavan backs need to read Clarkes book. The attention Martin Reilly, McVeety and other got was worse. Now i may sound vindictive but i do admire what Donegal done and i think they have brought professional fouling to a new level. Any break by Cavan was more often than now met with a Donegal foul (at the same same time i ask the question where was the support). If i remember correctly in the middle of the first half with McAveety bearing down on goals, a defender catches him with both hands pulls him but lets go at the last second. We get a free and a score. Black card...no... Professional foul.. you bet your bottom dollar.
Conor lane gave a red card to Ciaran Brady in the drawn game against Armagh when he made contact with an opponents head coming out of a tackle. Same referee today gave Murphy a yellow with quite similar reckless tackle on our Goalie. Neither in my view were a red but at he same time consistency. Caolan Mooney also comes to mind
Cavan have move moved from an ultra defensive system where you in truth you didn't need to defend that well as there were always a couple of buddies around to swarm an attacker. I like our style of football but if we are going to play this way we really need to go back and learn how to defend especially in 1 on 1 scenarios. We need to get nasty (really f***king nasty) to the point that it stifles runs and moves of the opposition. Until then our David's are Goliaths....
Btw, my young lad is chuffed and wants to one of these Cavan guys. There's more to this than an Ulster Championship and its the generation that come next. Thats a smile on my face.." I disagree on the Murphy 'challenge'. He had time to stop when Galligan won the ball. Instead he carried on and, what's worse, raised his knee into Galligan's chest. Red all day for me not that it would have made any difference as Donegal are way ahead of Cavan at the moment.
McMenamin is also a strong proponent of the 'sledging'. Saw it first against Tyrone and again yesterday fairly regularly. He got a yellow for getting in Moynagh's face when he kicked a wide. Not a good look and as Donegal have games in Croke Park with more camera angles it may be picked up more.
For Cavan think Micky made some tactical errors from the start but it was good experience for a team early in it's development. McVeety much more effective when he went inside is the second half. Needed to take him out of the middle where Donegal had two or three men around him every time he got the ball. Even if he got no ball he would have made space for others.
Would be great to make Super 8s for the experience for this team.
opa01 (Cavan) - Posts: 502 - 24/06/2019 08:57:53
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Replying To neverright: "Good win by Donegal and no doubt pundits will now promote them as the main challengers to Dublin. However I'm sure it will be a concern to Bonner that Cavan, who completely froze in the first twenty minutes, still managed to put up a very big score against them. Patten's kick-outs were exceptional and the forwards worked very well as a unit but the backline still looks shaky, particularly if Magee is missing. Murphy's 'tackling' must also be a source of worry for the manager" The majority of this Donegal team are very young and relatively inexperienced, when compared to Dublin. They kept Cavan at arms length yesterday, albeit taking their foot of the pedal in 2nd half slightly. By the time Cavan got the 2nd goal, it was 71 mins in and the game was over as a contest.
Donegal's attack is impressive, previously opposing teams would just concentrate on nullifying the threat of Murphy and McBrearty inside, doubling up on them, and tracking Ryan McHugh's runs. But the current Donegal team are a little harder to Marshall, so many serious scoring options, alternating attacks from deep or pace attacks from winning kick-outs.
Donegal are not the finished article, the younger players aren't as solid at closing out matches, but in 18 months this very young group have won McKenna Cup, National League Division 2 title and 2 x Ulster Championships. I think we could give Dublin a game, we lost by 5 points last year against them in Croke Park and I think we are a lot better this time around.
Commodore (Donegal) - Posts: 1112 - 24/06/2019 09:12:12
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Replying To The_Fridge: "You have to foul in them areas. Donegal are an extremely defensive/counter attacking team.....it's the cornerstone off playing this way.
Not criticising Donegal. Tyrone do it as well. Just some deluded Donegal fans don't realise they are a defensive/counter attacking team." Think most Donegal fans know the style of the team at this stage of the season, the Tyrone management don't seem to know their style yet though.
Agreed that it's counter attacking but 1-24 can't be regarded as defensive. Call it as it really is, a team who can get up and down the pitch with ease and play expansive football. With scorers from everywhere. That's what Dublin do and nobody calls it defensive. Our use of the kick-pass and hand-pass yesterday was exquisite again. We are playing really well and it's just a few from across the River Finn who seem to be hiding from that and trying to pick fault. I wonder why that is?
Donegal_abroad (Donegal) - Posts: 1321 - 24/06/2019 09:22:50
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Have to say Donegal looked impressive again yesterday. Their running game in full flow is excellent and while they do draw all 15 men behind the ball it is their transition from back to front that is lightning fast at times. Cavan for me just didn't set the tone from the get go like they did in the games v Monaghan and Armagh replay. They paid Donegal far too much respect and looked a bit clueless once they crossed the Donegal 45. Donegal all round had the experience and cuteness to know when to slow things down and curtail any Cavan momentum and I felt Donegal showed a bit of mercy in the second half when they took fisted points when there were 2 or 2 lads waiting for the pass across the square for an easy goal chance. Donegal will be concerned of course at conceding 2-16 which invariably will win you most games and plenty for them to work on before the Super 8s. They have definitely put themselves at the top of the chasing pack but it's only two games played against two teams who really didn't acquit themselves as well as they should have on the day. Bonnar will be delighted where they are at, two good performances and still room for improvement. Ulster title in the bag and the team brimming with confidence. Graham will have 2 weeks now to rally the troops and I feel if Cavan can just forget yesterday asap and get a decent draw in rd 4 then they have every chance of making the Super 8s. That would be an excellent season for them.
TrueBlue35 (Dublin) - Posts: 206 - 24/06/2019 10:08:51
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Replying To TrueBlue35: "Have to say Donegal looked impressive again yesterday. Their running game in full flow is excellent and while they do draw all 15 men behind the ball it is their transition from back to front that is lightning fast at times. Cavan for me just didn't set the tone from the get go like they did in the games v Monaghan and Armagh replay. They paid Donegal far too much respect and looked a bit clueless once they crossed the Donegal 45. Donegal all round had the experience and cuteness to know when to slow things down and curtail any Cavan momentum and I felt Donegal showed a bit of mercy in the second half when they took fisted points when there were 2 or 2 lads waiting for the pass across the square for an easy goal chance. Donegal will be concerned of course at conceding 2-16 which invariably will win you most games and plenty for them to work on before the Super 8s. They have definitely put themselves at the top of the chasing pack but it's only two games played against two teams who really didn't acquit themselves as well as they should have on the day. Bonnar will be delighted where they are at, two good performances and still room for improvement. Ulster title in the bag and the team brimming with confidence. Graham will have 2 weeks now to rally the troops and I feel if Cavan can just forget yesterday asap and get a decent draw in rd 4 then they have every chance of making the Super 8s. That would be an excellent season for them." Good post.
From our point of view, a Super 8 place would represent progress. Of course an ulster title would have been brilliant but we are a good bit off Donegal's level.
cavanman47 (Cavan) - Posts: 5012 - 24/06/2019 10:24:16
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Replying To Donegal_abroad: "Think most Donegal fans know the style of the team at this stage of the season, the Tyrone management don't seem to know their style yet though.
Agreed that it's counter attacking but 1-24 can't be regarded as defensive. Call it as it really is, a team who can get up and down the pitch with ease and play expansive football. With scorers from everywhere. That's what Dublin do and nobody calls it defensive. Our use of the kick-pass and hand-pass yesterday was exquisite again. We are playing really well and it's just a few from across the River Finn who seem to be hiding from that and trying to pick fault. I wonder why that is?" Essentially I'm in agreement. I've argued for years with Tyrone fans that the counter attacking style of football suits our players best and we got success, not all Irelands due to Dublin, but getting to the latter stages of the all Ireland. We can go into semantics and call it counter attacking but it is 14 men between the ball with 2 sweepers, funnel the opposition man into a 5 man swarm, turn over, and everyone counters at pace. Its been done before, this isn't anything new.
Now the problem is when you come up against Dublin they know not to go into the swarm, in 2017 Tyrone played like Donegal and were hammered because simply kept the ball for 2-3 mins, going from side to side, patiently waited for an opening, then bang, goals and points followed. They also have the players to dismantle Donegal's kick outs.
Donegal are playing well but for how long?
The_Fridge (Tyrone) - Posts: 2088 - 24/06/2019 10:27:40
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Replying To TrueBlue35: "Have to say Donegal looked impressive again yesterday. Their running game in full flow is excellent and while they do draw all 15 men behind the ball it is their transition from back to front that is lightning fast at times. Cavan for me just didn't set the tone from the get go like they did in the games v Monaghan and Armagh replay. They paid Donegal far too much respect and looked a bit clueless once they crossed the Donegal 45. Donegal all round had the experience and cuteness to know when to slow things down and curtail any Cavan momentum and I felt Donegal showed a bit of mercy in the second half when they took fisted points when there were 2 or 2 lads waiting for the pass across the square for an easy goal chance. Donegal will be concerned of course at conceding 2-16 which invariably will win you most games and plenty for them to work on before the Super 8s. They have definitely put themselves at the top of the chasing pack but it's only two games played against two teams who really didn't acquit themselves as well as they should have on the day. Bonnar will be delighted where they are at, two good performances and still room for improvement. Ulster title in the bag and the team brimming with confidence. Graham will have 2 weeks now to rally the troops and I feel if Cavan can just forget yesterday asap and get a decent draw in rd 4 then they have every chance of making the Super 8s. That would be an excellent season for them." That is it in a nutshell, Donegal are a very good side but still plenty of room for improvement. I thought Cavan looked a bit nervous in the first half and stood off Donegal. They have some great players though, Geroid McKiernan is top class, McVeety and Killian Clarke would get on any team and Cian Mackey is just a wonderful footballer - shame he isnt 10 years younger. I fancy Cavan to get to the super 8s.
At the time I thought the Michael Murphy challenge on Galligan was 50/50 but looking back at the replay he did raise his knee and it was borderline red, probably yellow was just about right but he did give the ref a decision to make. Michael does play on the edge and I have to admit that I have to cover my eyes when he goes in for a challenge. His workrate is absolutely phenomenal though, we are so lucky to have a player like this. The man would play in goals if he had to.
On the Donegal style of play, I agree that we get a lot of men back when not is possession. Most teams do that nowadays dont they? However when we go forward we do so with intent, not like the years under Rory Gallagher. As a supporter I was getting fed up with our style under Rory struggling to break 10 points in a game, we have doubled our scores since Bonner left.
Green_Gold (Donegal) - Posts: 1874 - 24/06/2019 10:45:01
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Hard luck to Cavan, was surrounded by lovely folks on the Hill in Clones and while Donegal killed the atmosphere early doors they were still in great spirits. Best of luck going forward to the qualifiers and hopefully you make it to the Super 8s.
From a Donegal POV the pace and workrate in the panel at the minute is unreal to see. You see lads busting a gut to get up and down the pitch and when we're attacking, even if the opposition are set in their defensive position, you can see the runners coming on the loops to create space. It's fantastic, really really impressive. Incisive runs from the likes of Jamie Brennan, Eoghan Bán, Paddy McGrath.
We're still a little naive at times and obviously conceding 2-16 isn't great but I think the big change in Donegal football the past 2 years is yeah, we'll give you opportunities to score, but good luck stopping us the other end. We've improved our attacking play further this year but the goal chances are still being given up and a team with better forwards will be more clinical.
Really looking forward to the Super 8s and while obviously the focus will be on our home match in Ballybofey first of all, it's hard not to cast an eye to Kerry in Croke Park - should be a cracker!
JoeSoap (Donegal) - Posts: 1432 - 24/06/2019 11:03:54
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Ulster Final 2019 went broadly as expected (well apart from the 2nd Cavan goal which lost me a few quid on the 6+ points prediction). It was clear beforehand that Cavan were a bit over-valued based on the results against Monaghan and Armagh, and so it proved. I had to laugh at the Sunday Game live panelists watching it again last night. They fell into that lazy assumption trap and then immediately performed a volte face in the final analysis. Hope they are not getting paid too much of the licence fee.
Looking on in Clones yesterday, I felt that Cavan were let down by poor management from the outset. Mickey Graham needed a wildcard in attack but instead opted for 2 identikit half backs. 20 minutes later the game was over. Stephen Murray did very well off the bench and was the one player who forced Bonner into a switch. Him plus a proper target man could have got Cavan going a bit better, Graham then made the classic error of waiting far too long to change it up when the problems were so stark and obvious.
In contrast, Declan Bonner adjusted his half backs from the outset to counter Martin Reilly, and got Ran McHugh on the ball early and often by allowing him to push further up. Thompson and McGee too did a pile of damage going forward. The imperious Hugh McFadden gave Donegal all the defensive cover they needed.
Overall, Donegal's ball winning and retention was fantastic, helped in no small part by both goalkeepers' kick-outs. You would feel a degree of sympathy for Ray Galligan. He did not have too many options as Cavan's big men seemed to shy away from responsibility at re-starts. Still, some of the down-the-throat stuff to Donegal's half forwards helped kill off the contest. All in all a damp squib of a contest but a lot of quality for Donegal and a lot of lessons potentially learned by Cavan.
From here, Donegal will surely ignore the clutching media headlines and knuckle down to get ready for Kerry and possibly Galway. They are in the driving seat on that side of the draw. The shape of this mornings R3 draw will give Cavan a renewed optimism hope of reaching the Super 8's. There will be 2 very beatable qualifiers in the hat in a couple of weeks. Iron out a few problems and there is certainly a place to be taken for this team.
Eddie the Exile (Monaghan) - Posts: 1057 - 24/06/2019 11:21:38
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Replying To neverright: "Good win by Donegal and no doubt pundits will now promote them as the main challengers to Dublin. However I'm sure it will be a concern to Bonner that Cavan, who completely froze in the first twenty minutes, still managed to put up a very big score against them. Patten's kick-outs were exceptional and the forwards worked very well as a unit but the backline still looks shaky, particularly if Magee is missing. Murphy's 'tackling' must also be a source of worry for the manager" Murphy's tackling must be a source of worry? I doubt that very much. Murphy's defensive work is top notch. He rightly picked up a yellow card yesterday for a lazy challenge on Galligan but still had the discipline to put in a strong defensive showing for the remainder of the game. He's very hard to beat in a one on one situation when defending and very rarely fouls (Doesn't foul anymore that the top defenders in the country). Everyone know about his attacking side and how he can control a game in the middle third but he's defensive ability is also why he in the best all round footballer in the country. He can literally play at 6, 8 or 9 and anywhere in the forward line and still have a massive influence on the game.
Conceding 2-16 will be a concern but the second half had a challenge game feel to it. The result was never in doubt after the first 20 mins.
Mobot (Donegal) - Posts: 459 - 24/06/2019 11:30:37
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